is Joan of Arc politically correct? I want Clemencau

[lord of the mark]

Joan of Arc (jeanne d'arc for you frenchies) seems to be included rather than such leaders as Charles De Gaulle, Napoleon, Louis XIV, St. Louis, Charlemagne at least in part with the idea that the game should be "politically correct" ie that it should include female leaders. This is seen by some as concession to the "left" This is profoundly ironic, as the cult of Jeanne d'arc was created in the late 19th c by catholic, royalist (ie RIGHT WING) frenchmen looking for a national symbol that was not associated the secular, democratic (ie Left wing) third Republic - as were the tricolor, the Marseillase, the 14th of July (instituted as a holiday for the first time by the third republic) It is both ironic, and a sign of how identity politics has distorted the left that this icon for the most backward and reactionary elements in French politics is considered "left wing"

Moi, I want Clemencau(sp?) for the French leader.

LOTM

[ixnay]

Well, probably the only thing I'll notice about the French is that they are PINK

[jdd2007]

IIRC, JoA is the female leader. I agree that Napoleon should be ahead of her, but that is for the male leader.

[Saint Marcus]

there are no male and female leaders. just one for each civ.

[Buck Birdseed]

What one leader symbolises france more than any other? I bet you most French people would say Jeanne d'Arc. Q.E.D. (I suspect a fair portion would say Asterix the Gaul, though. )

(p.s. Politically correct my arse. Diversity, interest, colour, fun. We already have a Napoleon-a-like in Alexander, a Talleyrand in Bismarck, a De Gaulle in Mao and a Louis XIV in Catherine. We don't have a Clemenceau, that's true, but find someone who is not a history freak or French who even knows who he is (of the type, Danton or Robespierre would be more well-known though more controversial and certainly less good choices) and you are better than I think you are.)

[Earthling7]

Why can't they have two leaders like in previous Civs?

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Snapcase
We don't have a Clemenceau, that's true, but find someone who is not a history freak or French who even knows who he is

Come on, he's not really obscure...

[Patriqvium]

Originally posted by Earthling7
Why can't they have two leaders like in previous Civs?

Because that would have virtually doubled the art budget and delayed the release...

[Buck Birdseed]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
Come on, he's not really obscure...

Add "person living in Montreal" to the list.

[Ubik]

Joanne d'ark a PC thingie? Nah, I think it is a Hollywood thingy... how many films with Clemanceu do you remember? How many hit films, actually.

But Joanne... oh, they made that attrocity film (starring that nympho model... don't remember her name, Mila something...) and everybody jumps up "hey, it's old Joanne, yeah!"

On a more serious note, having her as a leader of France is - frankly (no pun intented) - ridiculous. If they were looking for a real leader, try Clemanceau or De Gaulle... if a "recognisible" face, try Napoleon... if a controversial, try Robespierre... or you can go back to the Luis

But not a half-crazed peasant girl used by the church of France to gain attention... Bah!

[Saint Marcus]

How about Charles Martel, Charlemagne and Clovis?

And De Gaulle is no Mao. LOL.

Clemencau pour roi! (deliberate bad french )

[KrazyHorse]

Actually, I can't believe they shafted Louis Quatorze out of top spot. He was the model of kings fo centuries to come! He was the state! He was King for...I can't remember, but it was a really long time (67yrs?)!

[Saint Marcus]

I agree. I want the Sun King in the game. He wasn't in any civ game

"The law? That's me"

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Snapcase
What one leader symbolises france more than any other? I bet you most French people would say Jeanne d'Arc. Q.E.D. (I suspect a fair portion would say Asterix the Gaul, though. )

(p.s. Politically correct my arse. Diversity, interest, colour, fun. We already have a Napoleon-a-like in Alexander, a Talleyrand in Bismarck, a De Gaulle in Mao and a Louis XIV in Catherine. We don't have a Clemenceau, that's true, but find someone who is not a history freak or French who even knows who he is (of the type, Danton or Robespierre would be more well-known though more controversial and certainly less good choices) and you are better than I think you are.)

De Gaulle = Mao ??? are you kidding?????

We dont get churchill, FDR, De gaulle.

Do we get ONE democratically elected modern leader - It looks like Lincoln is the ONLY democratically elected leader we get at all - greeks get Alex instead of Pericles.

I am disappointed.

LOTM

[ixnay]

I'm not a huge European history buff or anything, but I've never heard of this Clemencau guy. Most of the other names are familiar.