AU 202: Analysis, Solutions, and Stories (spoiler)

[ducki]

LOL, thanks Kon!

I've never really had that problem, as I still haven't truly accepted the Dark Side, so I always have plenty of culture.

I find myself unbearably uncomfortable if all my Ancient Towns don't have temples, even when not playing a Religious civ.

Maybe I'll have another go at this with a non-Rel civ and just be a barbarous, cancerous growth on the land.

[Catt]

Originally posted by DaveMcW
You could set up a moving wall on your border, similar to the settler block. Bismarck can't sneak attack you if he can't get in!

It would be interesting to try one of those "doomed" games.

You need units to make a wall! The "doomed" games I was referring to are those in which Bismarck shows up at you capitol with his starting units on turn 15. Has only happened to me on Deity, and then only a couple of times - the last time (Civ III - hasn't happened to me yet in PTW) I replayed from the 4000 BC autosave about 4 times, experimenting with openings -- nothing could salvage it -- just simply couldn't build units quickly enough to deter an opportunistic attack by Bismarck. I could move my starting settler for 5 or so turns and "get out of his way" -- but that's not something one would do without foreknowledge of the start positions .

Originally posted by ducki
What is "IDGAFIYF"?

Kon nailed it. Credit to Jawa Jocky for the excellent acronym

Catt

[Aeson]

Originally posted by DaveMcW
You could set up a moving wall on your border, similar to the settler block. Bismarck can't sneak attack you if he can't get in!

It would be interesting to try one of those "doomed" games.

I've done this a couple times on huge maps. Ended up with about 35 units (Greek) in a stack one time, being herded by 5 Scouts. In the open you need this many to delay them indefinitely, as they'll usually keep sending new units along that you have to 'merge' with the main stack. With a few more units you could actually drive them just about anywhere you want, might be useful in some situations (alliances after you move their units to a 'friend'..hmmm). I just quit the game because it was completely too inane and ludicrous, and they were blocking my expansion in that direction. As about half the stack was Hoplites, I really didn't want to fight them with my Warriors and Chariots I was building at the time. They won't declare war unless you completely bottle them up, or they make it to your borders.

Expansionist tends to be the only defense for them, as your first Scout or second needs to see them coming or it will be too late.

[High_Lord]

somebody tell this dummy (me) what is AU 202 some kind of rules mod?

[High_Lord]

ok by exploring the site this dummy found out -- Apoyton University--

[Mazarin]

...have you ever tried per-turn gifts against early invasions? For me, it seems to be the only possibility to avoid early warfare: I usually give 1 gpt every 5 rounds to very aggressive civs; 1 gpt every 10 rounds to less aggressive civs...it doesn't always work, but I have the impression that I'm no longer archer-rushed that often

[Aeson]

It doesn't work if they are already coming. As this is a problem when they start coming basically from the beginning of the game, there really isn't a chance to get contact with them quick enough.

Keeping the AI happy after that point is always a good idea though, unless you want them to attack.

[Dominae]

Great game and analysis Catt (for both attempts!).



A few notes on my experience with the German rush. If you look back to my early posts in this thread, my Scouts allowed me to see their forces coming, so I used just 2 units to make them zig-zag to my lands. I had a feeling they wouldn't attack my units in the field, saving their declaration of war for a juicy city target. The zig-zag routine bought be enough turns to put at few units inside the city they were going for, and this repelled them easy enough. On Deity, the rush would have come sooner (and stronger), so maybe I wouldn't have survived on that difficulty. On Emperor, it was simply a matter of early information (yay! Expansionist).


Dominae

[Catt]

Originally posted by Dominae
. . . my Scouts allowed me to see their forces coming, so I used just 2 units to make them zig-zag to my lands. [. . .] The zig-zag routine bought be enough turns to put at few units inside the city they were going for, and this repelled them easy enough.

Yes - I didn't see them coming until it was too late, and even then I mistakenly thought they wouldn't attack my city with 3 warriors in it (2 regs and a conscript). Bastards.

On Emperor, it was simply a matter of early information (yay! Expansionist).

Which is a very good point that isn't mentioned much in support of expansionist!

Catt

[Jawa Jocky]

Its about 1500 AD and I still haven't built a library. I might have captured one or maybe my literacy rate has been increased by some captured wonders.

[Jawa Jocky]

Anyways I just got too bored to finish this one. I was going to get MT and finish off with domination. Here is my humiliating loss.

[Dominae]

Nice game Jawa. Don't feel too bad about not "winning", us human players know when a player has won and when he has lost. You've clearly beat the scenario.

Any additional thoughts on the Keshik?


Dominae

[Jawa Jocky]

Keshik-

Doesn't require Iron - Not really an issue.
Lower Defense - Not really an issue.

Cheaper - Now this helps. I was pumping these guys out a lot quicker than knights. Having more units is quite usefull, IMO. I took out the Iroqouis and Germany with these guys.

Mountian movement - I didn't play the AU mod so I had to avoid hills (good fix). With Greece in the mountians I got test this ability.
pros - You can pillage mountian improvements on the turn you move onto them
-You can travel without fear of attack deep into enemy territory and due some strategic pillaging
-you can set up abushes you normally can't by remaining an extra space back in the mountians

cons - With your weaker defense and you can be an easy target
-If you run across someone in the mountians its

[Jawa Jocky]

hard to kill them since they have a defensive bonus.


Keshik Conclusions

This units main benefit is it's cheaper cost. You just end up with more of them. The mountian movements give you some benefit, but the 3 movement bonus some of the other knight replacements offer is better.

Mongol conclusions - They are an all out war-monger civ with the most beautiful leader in the game.

[Konquest02]

In God We Trust...

I finally managed to finish AU 202, despite my finals and my lack of time. But overall it was a pretty good game. I will first give a brief AAR and then draw some conclusions.

In the beginning , God created the Americans and gave his good pal Lincoln the tak of guiding them through what he had just created... Since then, the fate of the Americans was in God's hands.

But he gave this people knowledge on how to build roads and mines faster and he created THE unit: the Scout. With the help of these scouts, Lincoln managed to get a good start. Washington was founded right where God chose to put the first American settler.

Soon, a friendly tribe was told by God to join our civilization. Manifest Destiny was under way. This tribe soon founded the great city of new York, near the mountain where they were discovered.

Then, our scouts met the Iroquois, generated by a competing God. But we were too strong. We took a couple of cities then made peace. This gave us room to expand, while crippling the Iroquois.
A conscript warrior from a tribe saw a nice city, Athens. Since there was nobody in it, he decided this would be his town. So he walked into Athens, defeating Alexander the not so Great, whom fled into the jungle. YIPEE! more room to expand. The game was almost over by then...

Soon fell the Iroquois. Greece respawned just between me and the Germans, acting as a nice buffer... I got these to war a lot against each other and when Greece was almost defeated (±1 defender in each city), my newly discovered knights rolled over the land, leaving one desert city for Bismarck. Within 2 turns, there were no more Greece. A couple turns later, I defeated Germany without much trouble, as they did not have access to any Iron. God was smiling looking at the American continent...

My GA was really peaceful. I captured the Pyramids in Berlin and I had already built Copernicus' Observatory. I then built JS Bach's Cathedral and there goes my GA! I spent it building infrastructure in my newly conquered lands.

Finally won by Domination in 1810, after a lot of experiments. I wanted to invade Egypt fairly quickly just when I got to Motorized Transportation, but the time I got there, they had discovered Replacable parts. My advance was a lot slower, facing infantry. So my democracy was overthrown and I decided to experience Communism. Eeech...Never to do again. I got 10 turns as a Commie and corruption was near 35%. I thought my FP placement was bad enough to get a so-so corruption rate, but it was awful... I then captured 4 cities and triggered a domination win...

On the seventh day, God sat around his house, drank beer and played bowling with his friends Buddha, Allah and his son JC. He saw that was good, and decided to invite them the next day...

--Kon--