Earliest landing with basic settings.

[Mark_Everson]

DaveV:

I generally can't pick up techs from the AIs. They usually won't trade with me because my civ is too big. And because I'm always in a representative government if I steal tech there's a good chance my government will collapse. Only if I have just given them about 3 techs will they like me enough to trade.

[arii]

I just finished a new game. Landing=1783.
I only did 3 turns better than before.
I used 1 big science city + 4 sub science cities (size11-12 with lib ma.pl. bank univ. fact. and highw.)
The other 8 cities were just support cities with no improvements and cranking out caravans.
With the caravan science bonus + beaker generated I was able to get 1 tech a turn for the last ~10 turns.
No matter how many techs I was giving the AI it would still not trade techs with me.
Good luck to anybody who try this. It goes very fast. Watch out!

[arii]

I yet finished another game with the basic settings deity small map 7 civ rag hordes.
This time I landed on AC in 1771 using a slightly different strategy.
During the first part of the game I focussed very hard on the main science city. I developped the secondary science cities later in the game(4 cities). I also skiped wonders that I use to build : pyramids, JSB cath. This allowed me to save ressources and build the other wonders faster.
The location of the science city was excellent : 2 gems 1 fruit and 1 iron on a river. There is still a lot of improvement : There was only 4 other civ, one being destroyed very early by barbs. So I could not get as much tribute. Also no civ was on a separate continent which I consider as a desadvantage. Caravan travelling through land is hasardous (sneak attack, barbs), takes longer and rewards less compared to routes with other continents.

[arii]

14 cities:
1 main science city (size 26 at the end)
4 secondary science cities (size 11 12 10 11)
9 support cities (size 3-7)

[Mark_Everson]

arii:

Congratulations!

How many cities total did you have?

[jpk]

The race to space is mainly determined by the rate at which someone can pick up science advances. If you build a super science city, most of your non-trade related beakers will come from that one city. Once you have 20 or so advances the science you get from a newly founded city is likely to remain negligible for the much of the remainder of the game. I've played with 30 cities and half of my science came from my science city.

One issue is mainly is whether the greater opportunity for trade caravans is outweighed by the need for happiness items. Another issue is the size of the map and the geography. Early landing dates are easier with a small map but the drawback is that there is usually only one continent. That means the payback from caravans is much less. If someone had a small map with multiple continents it might be ideal for an extremely early landing.

Perhaps someday Paul will decide to play a game with three cities and land in, oh, say 1500.

[Aaron Burr]

I find it very thought-provoking that the earliest AC landing year for OCC and multi-city is about the same (currently 1771 for both, apparently).

Anyone care to speculate on why this is so? My guess is:

1. Harder to get gifts from AI when you have more cities. (AI more likely to give/trade tech when it thinks you are weak).

2. Harder to stay at peace when AI sees you as strong.

3. As Paul has shown, you can take a more streamlined approach with only 1 city - no need for happiness wonders/improvements with ST in your 1 city; no need for Hoover, etc.

As a challenge, can anyone land on AC substantially faster with multiple cities than with OCC?
[This message has been edited by Aaron Burr (edited November 02, 1999).]

[Matthew]

with one city and shakespears one can put science up to 100% , taking ultimate advantage of the super science city. Gold from gifts, the occasional barb leader, trade routes, and when you drop science a bit to avoid beaker waste should be enough to pay city maintenance. With 5 or 6 cities in democracy you will need to increase taxes to maintain city improvements you might build, and luxuries for happiness.

Perhaps the ideal isn't to have just a few cities along with your super science cities, but rather a super science city + ICS approach, where all of your other cities are small enough to be kept happy with Mike's and JSB, and therefore need neither luxuries nor city improvements. But the higher you are on the power graph the more you will be penalized in beaker costs for advances, and it would likely take a lot of size 4 or 5 cities with no improvements to make up for the difference.

Also, I imagine that OCC playere tend to be more particular with their starting location, and have a lot more resaves.

[Sten Sture]

I would think it would be great to have 25 cities to build your spaceship in one turn. That would take a ton of cash or a lot of caravans. Perhaps 3 major cities for Modules, 6 minor cities for components and then late in the game found 16 small towns whose only purpose is to build a structural?

Of course the logistics are daunting, any way you try it...

[arii]

I don't think it's a good idea to have more than 15 cities. You run into happinness problem and can't grow your cities using WLTPD. Also spending you ressources building more settlers will delay you in you wonder and science pathway since you are not building as many caravans.
The difference with OCC is that you have to spend some of your ressource on the other city. The other city don't contribute much to the science you produce until they are at least size 8 with lib. univ. and trade routes. i.e not until 1000-1300 AC. The scores between the 2 are very close because before 1750 1 turn = 10 years. 1 tech = 20 years.

[DaveV]

I *finally* finished my ICS+OCC attempt at the early landing. After three weeks real time, I finally landed in (trumpet fanfare) AD 1595. I grew my capital to size 36 with food caravans, and stayed in Communism the whole game. I'll mail the log file and save games to anyone who's interested. Right now, I need to go to bed!

[Paul]

Ok, please mail to the adress in my profile.

[Carolus Rex]

Congrats, that's a great score!

So you're not just a conquest guru now, eh?

Communism the whole game? Incredible.

Could you please send me the log (no saves)? My email address is in my profile.

Carolus

[Mark_Everson]

Congratulations!

Communism! That Blows my mind ;-) Please include me in the mass-mailing...

[Steve Clark]

I'm curious too and want to learn some things. Please email me just the log. Thanks.