No city bribe = no Great Wall

[War4ever]

It's an interesting topic for debate. I am not the first to think of this nor do i even currently play with this rule. However i did play a game this way not to long ago.

Most of us , and certainly everyone i play with regularly agrees to a no city bribe rule, amongst some other rules we play with. In our circles they are known as "Rah rules" but don't mention that out loud because he doesn't like it

Considering there is some discussion going on about attack bonuses ,barb attack strength, and building on mountains, i thought i would bring up the topic of the Great Wall.

In a duel i played no city bribe , no Great Wall. For a duel this rule should be mandatory. The Wall inhibits war to the point where the game is too peacefull.

For MP games do you think the Wall should be allowed. Think of how much more conflict there would be without it. If that raging warmonger decides to knock on your door, you may find yourself in some serious trouble. This might prevent players from just using warriors to defend what is becoming consistently more and more a "race through the tech tree game" with very little conflict

[Smash]

If I'm willing to devote the resources to a somewhat less desirable wonder then you need to get after Metallurgy.

You only have to sack 1 walled city after all

[cavebear]

While I initially didn't see the connection between the two (I so routinely play "no city bribe"), I agree that it is an interesting question.

I think there is enough value for the Great Wall whether there is city-bribing or not. Even in no city-bribing games where I get the GW, I still pay attention to defense. There are enough heavy-duty attackers around to seem to require a valid defensive force anyway. And having the GW requires some serious watchfulness and preparation for Metallurgy.

Many Wonders confer substantial advantages, and having the GW in the game is not much different from the impact of Leo's, Sun's, or Mike's. My preference is for dealing with any or all of the Wonders and adapting to whomever gets which.

[rah]

In MP, I'll agree that city bribing shouldn't be allowed.

On GW, I agree with cavebear, every wonder conveys an advantage. (maybe in a duel i'd agree not to include it) . I usually don't build it unless I've lost the race to the others that I like a lot better. If games were continued more, I doubt this would be an issue. The second session would quickly see metalurgy and a few of the other techs that take out some of the early wonders.

On a side note, I have lost a couple of cities after building gw, but it does keep all but the most persisitent from choosing you as a target. But then the war academy has a similar effect.

Rich

[SmartFart]

If no Great Wall,then no Michelangelo's Chapel,no Sun-Tsu and no Pyramids . On Rah's maps,GW is best wonder you can have. It really buys you a ****load of time.

SF

[Rasputin]

does anyone ever play a deity level no wonders game ?? i think would be interesting to play where everyone had to build city improvments to keep poeple happy not just some abstract wonder

[mad max]

I don't understand what you americans want to play. On the one hand I got the impression you really like wargames. On the other hand you want to forbit citybribe. But citybribe is one of the best wappons in the beginning and against small cities. So if you really like to fight why don't you use this. And what is good about the great wall if you like to fight. You should forbit this instead of citybribe.

[SlowwHand]

Newsflash Max. Dipping to death is not making war.
There is no tactics, or really a strategy.
Overuse of Dips is b.s.

Yes the Great Wall should be in.
I don't understand why, when one trys to rein in a Dip with illogical ability, the cry goes up for no Wall.
What's the relationship in that?
None.

Rasputin, I've been trying to drum up interest in a No Wonder or One Wonder Only game for months. Deity or not.
Too many players just can't hang without Wonders.

[Rasputin]

Originally posted by SlowwHand
Rasputin, I've been trying to drum up interest in a No Wonder or One Wonder Only game for months. Deity or not.
Too many players just can't hang without Wonders.

well depending on time zones i would be interested...

[SlowwHand]

Maybe next weekend? Give us time to get some players.


One more thought on Wonders.
Pyramids are dicriculous.
How did a tomb become graineries in all cities?
Want to ban something, ban Dips and Pyramids, because they're what makes no sense.

[Rasputin]

maybe syd beleives in canibalism , they ate the mummies

[cavebear]

I suspect that Pyramids are "granaries" because they look like they ought to contain something, and grain crops were very important to the ancient Egyptians.

I would be interested in a "no-Wonder" game (well, whatever is required for space flight allowed). It would depend on the time. I could play on Sundays, any 3 hours between 10 a.m. and 8 p.m. Eastern US Time (GMT-5).

[Deity Dude]

Originally posted by SlowwHand

I've been trying to drum up interest in a No Wonder or One Wonder Only game for months. Deity or not.
Too many players just can't hang without Wonders.

Slowwhand - I'm up for a no-wonder game anytime you wanna give it a try. Ive never played that way but would be interested in trying.

[mad max]

I would like to play a no wonder game too, even without citybribe.

[Alexander's Horse]

Not another trade route

Markusf and I played a couple of games with no wonders - its okay provided you don't mind building caras all the time.

I tend to agree with the view though that Wonders tend to distract and unbalance games. You can do quite well without them and in the end build a stronger civ.