MP Combat

[Smash]

In solo play,difficulty level greatly effects battle outcomes.Much better #s on king as opposed to deity for instance.
Does this apply to MP?

It seems to me that the game uses king level #s as far as human controlled units are concerned but then again I get some awfully odd outcomes sometimes which remind me of a deity level warrior that beats an archer on hills.

[arii]

This might not be true but I have the feeling that king favors the defence whereas deity favors the offense.
This is definitly true with the barbs. Never let a barb attack you at deity, always attack him, even with a warrior

[markusf]

barbs have 150% defence and attack on diety, at king they have 50% of what a normal unit has

[rah]

I thought that on Deity, that the barb bonus was only on attack, not defense.

RAH

[Smash]

hmmm...I wonder if the host has different #s than others.The game still kinda revolves around the host's civ.Would non hosts be considered ais by the game?

I find that regardless of level,things seem to favor the defender.You really need superior tech to launch most successful invasions.Even then I've lost many a dragoon to pikes for example.Thens theres those darn 2x cities on hills and what not.I think its time to join the trade loving doves in MP

I always try to hit barbs first unless fortified vet on good defensive terrain.They don't have defensive bonus.Maybe 50% under normal conditions.They seem to attack with normal #s with the occasional veteran.As compared to my units anyways.
My warriors always lose.Almost always.I'll use them to weaken and once in a blue moon I get to say "Yes!"

[Makeo]

play me in a wargame.

[finbar]

Originally posted by rah
I thought that on Deity, that the barb bonus was only on attack, not defense.

RAH

You're right. It's 25% (of attack strength) at Chief level; 50% at Warlord; 75% at Prince; 100% at King; 125% at Emperor; 150% at Deity. Defence factors don't change with difficulty levels. In theory, anyway. Sometimes I wonder.

[rah]

hmmm...I wonder if the host has different #s than others.The game still kinda revolves around the host's civ.Would non hosts be considered ais by the game?

As far as barbs are concerned. NO

Barbs never seem to be able to kill any AI units, but in our games the barbs trash all the players. So I think No. And since I've won my fair share of battles and lost my fair share of battles. I would also say NO for military units.

I usually host so I believe I have enough experience to properly judge. But feel free to run hours and hours of extensive tests to verify it, please feel free.

The sneak attack bonus is something else.

RAH

[Smash]

But feel free to run hours and hours of extensive tests to verify it, please feel free.

um...I'll get right on it

So if I am plotting an attack should I be thinking king level AI as far as defensive abilities?

[rah]

Except for the very first unit attack, NO.

Everything will play straight up. I keep forgetting what everyone thinks the sneak attack bonus is, but I seem to believe 50% added offense is about right. Now if you could sucker someone into peace after the first attack, attack again, make more peace, and attack again.......... I would claim you as the world's greatest diplomat.

RAH

I really thought you'd want to test it.

[SlowwHand]

I don't know where or when I said, but I know I don't believe in the common thought of "Host Advantage" as thoroughly as I once did.

I know, I know. Sometimes Host gets extra tech and we restart, but from what I think I'm beginning to see is that is you get extra techs, it's because you're about to get it in the backside some other way. Probably in having bad starting position.
Also, some of the techs I might get as Host, I notice are not white, so doesn't that mean someone else got, too?
If Host has three techs even, and they're not white, has he truly Host Advantage from that perspective?

Erroneous, or has anyone else thought along these lines?

[Smash]

Of course its a huge advantage.Free starting techs are always blue.

I can't beleive some are still not restarting for host techs.About a million years ago Bird and I let Rah have bronze as a bunch of restarts was not going too well.One tech in the hands of a good player is pretty much the game.He blasted to Monarchy and never looked back.It doesn't seem like much but...let alone 3 or 4.

[rah]

Yep Smash, even a single tech is a heck of an advantage.
Does anybody not reset when the host gets a tech anymore?

After hundreds and hundreds games as the host, I've seen no pattern between what you see on the opening screen and the number (if any) of free techs. However, We do play on tiny worlds with large continents so everyone starts close to each other. I think the software and I dissagree on what constitutes a bad start that requires a few techs to make it even. I've started on an artic plain in the middle of nowhere and not recieved and free techs. And then started in the middle of a fours special pattern and recieved 3 free techs. It seems more determined by the distance to the closest other civ. Since I think the program thinks it's good for you to be close to one civ for early contact it won't give you techs if you start 10 squares away from someone. (in MP I don't consider that a good thing) But If you're all alone (which is what I prefer) it thinks POOR Player and rewards him with a few techs to make up for it.

I think the color you choose has a bigger impact than any hosting difference.

RAH
Ramblings of an old man.

[Deity Dude]

A little off subject but I will post it here anyway. A while back in a thread I had mentioned that I had thought I had remembered getting starting techs as non-host. Others responded that this was impossible (i think RAH and Ming were among them but it was pretty much universal). Well last night I was playing a game with Slowwhand as host and I started with pottery. I have the save if anyone is interested and I am sure Slowwhand will verify it also. I'll admit it doesn't happen often ( first time since that thread probably 2 months ago) but it did happen.

BACK ON SUBJECT
When I host I announce any starting techs I get and let players decide if they want to restart. Believe it or not quite often they don't want to.

[rah]

Very interesting DD. I assume it was a random start. Yes it would be interesting to see the initial starting save. Unless everyone that plays when I host lies , I've never seen it in over a thousand games/restarts.

I can't believe that people are OK with the host having a tech. Man, give me a freebie and I'll go to town. (especially if it's on the path to monarchy) They must really like what they see on the screen when they agree to it, but it is surprising that all would agree, since usually someone has something to ***** about.

Granted restart after restart gets annoying but I can only remember a dozen or so starts that took more than 5 resets. And none took more than 8. So if the people are trained well, it only adds 5-10 minutes to a game (if that). More than worth it to equalize the start as much as possible.

RAH