Dealing with gigamap problems

[MikeLynch]

I'm sure the answers to these questions have been posted somewhere, but I figure a few of you more frequent, long-term Apolyton folks might have the answers memorized.

I've installed the nolimits patch and MapEdit and have successfully played some gigamap games. It's a little daunting how huge I can make the maps, but aside from that the only real problems I'd like to solve are as follows:

1) City naming. I really don't need twelve Hays Citys. Is there a maximum limit on custom city names you can put in the relevant text file (city.txt unless I'm mistaken), and if so, what is that limit?

2) Maximum number of cities. Does the nolimits patch not solve this problem? Is there any way TO solve it?
(And on that note, is it just my imagination or did all the other AI nations get really pissed off at me when they realized they couldn't found any more cities?)

3) I enlarged the size of the Big Earth map that comes with MGE using MapEdit and was disappointed to see that it doesn't stretch the land, but just adds oodles of ocean. (Sort of like "enlarging the canvas" for you PSP users.) Is there any way to actually enlarge AND stretch a map? In such a way, for example, that maybe one square of grassland in the original map magically becomes four squares of grassland in the same relative location?

And, a follow-up,
4) Has anyone done an accurate Earth gigamap?

I'm also hunting for any and all websites or other resources for *well made* "random world" maps. I hate the way Civ generates maps and I'd like my continents and oceans to actually be decent-sized and distinct, and the landforms to be as realistic as possible. But the problem with making them myself is that, then, I know them.

[Scouse Gits]

1) There is no (known) limit on the names in your cities.txt file
2) Nope you are still restricted to a total of 127 (or is it 255?) - if this limit is over-ruled the memory starts overwriting itself
3) I believe there is a Earth Giga-map - but don't use them myself - have you tried the Directory?

SG[1]

[La Fayette]

Julius Brenzaida, who is the maker of the 'no limits' patch, is now on vacation (he sent me a message this morning), so you are sure he will answer you if you ask him a question.
I remember having played a succession game (with Julius, smash and a few other players) on an Earth Map that was designed by Julius and that I found very satisfying.
I should be able to find a savegame if you are interested.

[Mercator]

Re: Dealing with gigamap problems

Originally posted by MikeLynch
1) City naming. I really don't need twelve Hays Citys. Is there a maximum limit on custom city names you can put in the relevant text file (city.txt unless I'm mistaken), and if so, what is that limit?

There is a limit actually... I think I tested it a couple of weeks ago. I forgot what the exact number was though. Maybe I wrote it down somewhere.

O wait, I remember something... There is a single byte in the savegame that tracks where it is in the list.

After the variable has reached 255, the value will flip over to 0 (which is NOT the first city, but rather the @civilization line). When the end of the @EXTRA city list is reached, the variable is reset to 1 (so you don't get to see this @ name).
So technically, you can make the list as long as you want, but in practice there's no point in having more than 255 cities in the combination of the civilization-specific and extra lists.

2) Maximum number of cities. Does the nolimits patch not solve this problem? Is there any way TO solve it?
(And on that note, is it just my imagination or did all the other AI nations get really pissed off at me when they realized they couldn't found any more cities?)

maximum number is 255. The no-limits patch does't solve this. It's nearly impossible to solve.

3) I enlarged the size of the Big Earth map that comes with MGE using MapEdit and was disappointed to see that it doesn't stretch the land, but just adds oodles of ocean. (Sort of like "enlarging the canvas" for you PSP users.) Is there any way to actually enlarge AND stretch a map? In such a way, for example, that maybe one square of grassland in the original map magically becomes four squares of grassland in the same relative location?

Yep... Sorry "real" resizing is rather more difficult. Especially because I have a more civ2 map specific resampling method in mind... And considering I've hardly gone beyond vague sketches on paper it's gonna take a while (~ infinity).
Then again, such resizing can never be too accurate, so you would need to to some editing (unless you don't mind slightly crooked maps).

MapUtility can do it, but doesn't support gigamaps.

And, a follow-up,
4) Has anyone done an accurate Earth gigamap?

Yes, some people have. I think there are about 4 or 5. Not sure where you can find them though, try the downloads here at Apolyton, at CivFanatics and try a search in the civ2 forums... Or you could wait till I get to my other computer and fetch them for you.

I'm also hunting for any and all websites or other resources for *well made* "random world" maps. I hate the way Civ generates maps and I'd like my continents and oceans to actually be decent-sized and distinct, and the landforms to be as realistic as possible. But the problem with making them myself is that, then, I know them.

Not really gigamaps, but this is a good site for "random" earth-like maps:

http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/5869/

And you should try Civ.Map.Gen (available at my site or on its original website). It's an awesome civ2 map generator (doesn't support gigamaps either).

Originally posted by La Fayette
I remember having played a succession game (with Julius, smash and a few other players) on an Earth Map that was designed by Julius and that I found very satisfying.
I should be able to find a savegame if you are interested.

Ooh yes! Invasion Earth... Here's the original thread (includes savegames):

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=995

(you can load the savegame with MapEdit and save the map)

[La Fayette]

The truest gift of gods

Now, I have found the succession game started by Julius that I mentioned previously: "The truest gift of gods" (thread on this forum).
We started on a tiny island in the middle of the Pacific Ocean... fun !
I don't know whether the map was the same as the one in use for 'Invasion Earth', but I know it was also a gigamap provided by Julius.

[Julius Brenzaida]

All answers have been accurate, what a great forum
I've made avalaible two big earthmaps, they should be at least on apolyton and civfanatics or I can send them to you, if you ask.
You can also take them from the two nice succesion games cited by LaFayette.
Invasion Planet Earth is for ToT
Truest gift of the Gods for MGE
There is also some other nice bigmaps of earth made by others, I should look in my hard drive. They've probably passed through the creation forum if you care to look there
I hope this helps ...

[War4ever]

if the no limits patch is on, will it affect my civ MP games???

[La Fayette]

no limits

It doesn't affect mine AFAIK

[Mercator]

Here's a great gigamap, made by Ostrander Bellepoint. It's an edited giga version of the world map called "Mercator" by Alexandre (as available on the map site I mentioned in my previous post).

[Julius Brenzaida]

Originally posted by War4ever
if the no limits patch is on, will it affect my civ MP games???

It should not.
But I don't play MP
I suggest you copy your good old civ2.exe first and then give it a try with the patch

[sirsnuggles]

1) City naming. I really don't need twelve Hays Citys. Is there a maximum limit on custom city names you can put in the relevant text file (city.txt unless I'm mistaken), and if so, what is that limit?

I didn't really understand Mercator's answer (sorry Merc, please forgive me), but I don't think that there's much of a limit. I've never tested it scientifically, but I've inserted custom names for a long time. I just checked the city.txt file that I got from Microprose and it includes 630 city names (including ones for the Arabs and Incas who are not in the standard set-up). For the custom civs that I've created, I've used up to 70 city names (and it worked) in the city.txt file. So, I'd suggest getting a geography book and adding in an additional 30-40 cities for each civ (I'm actually working on doing that myself this very moment).

Come to remember it, I got so tired of seeing each civilization possessing several 'Turin' 'Cremona' and 'Cunaxa' cities that I changed the city.txt file to read (of course picking up where the default setting left off) German 40, German 41, German 42, etc... and for each civ up to about 50 or so. That worked. So, yes, you can correct that annoying problem in gigamap games.

[Julius Brenzaida]

Originally posted by sirsnuggles

I didn't really understand Mercator's answer (sorry Merc, please forgive me), but I don't think that there's much of a limit. I've never tested it scientifically, but I've inserted custom names for a long time. I just checked the city.txt file that I got from Microprose and it includes 630 city names (including ones for the Arabs and Incas who are not in the standard set-up). For the custom civs that I've created, I've used up to 70 city names (and it worked) in the city.txt file. So, I'd suggest getting a geography book and adding in an additional 30-40 cities for each civ (I'm actually working on doing that myself this very moment).

I think Mercator was talking about no more than 255 (civ list+extras) for ONE civ in the city.txt file

[sirsnuggles]

That makes sense. I'm sure you're right!

Thanks Julius.

[Mercator]

Originally posted by sirsnuggles
(sorry Merc, please forgive me)

No problem... I have a habit of making everything look more complicated than it is.

JB got it right.