Deirdre Vs Cha Dawn

[Adam_Smith]

PRovost H,

So true I've never really gotten to that point though. I'm almost there though in a PMEM game No Manifold nexus though (fell in the water)

Ogie,

I play the same settings for every faction. Always pods, always abundant fungus (more points), but never spoils of war. I believe that pods on and more water would be an even greater advantage to Cha Dawn, but pods off and more water is off course much different.

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Qual,

I agree with almost everything you say with one small exception. IOD's are near invincible but not necessarily invincible. IOD with Nueral Amp SP allows defense of 1.5 * lifecycle bonus (no planet bonus applies to the defender). Tackle that monster with an resonance weapon empath unit and you've got a 1.875 * morale bonus * planet bonus rating.

Assume you've got a demon life cycle defending against an elite as outlined above and you've got a clear advantage to the attacker (granted the attacker will come out significantly bloodied but still attacker should win). Odds should be in that case 1.875* planet bonus to 1.5 defense as morale effects cancel each other out.

It may be nitpicking but IoD's can be taken out even if a player or AI garners the Nueral Amp sp.

Finally worst comes to worst any native life will fall prey to conventional missiles every time.

Og
[This message has been edited by Ogie Oglethorpe (edited September 28, 2000).]

[Adam_Smith]

quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe on 09-26-2000 05:20 PM Momentum-style is a must for the pink girlie boy.

Sorry to pick out a quote of yours to disagree on With all due respect I believe that the folks who created this faction did so with the aim of creating the ultimate momentum faction, and if that were possible they may have done so. However, the Planet Cult is the perfect case in point that no faction should be played momentum style (except on a tiny planet with little water).

If you don't start building your empire up immediately your momentum will die out before 1/3 of the game is over. Even if you have several subs this will be so. The key to winning with Cha Dawn is making the transition from the glorious beginnings to a declining mid-game and then to another glorious late game. Of course, you might get lucky and be placed right next to your opponent and be able to conquer him before he gets SoTHB, but this is less often than not.

[Qualicide]

forgot about renisance, the AI never uses them so i just dont count them into my calculations

is it possible to have a trance/empath/+4 planet/SP psi units? with the psi cannon of cource, not natives, that would be great with a good +140% attacking

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http://thangorodrim.angband.org/angband.html (alright meybe i didnt make it)

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Adam.

I don't think we are actually in disagreement. Getting an early start is quite easily accomplished for Cha since he can effectively concentrate more on early infrastructure, former and/or pod builds rather than looking to prototype impact speeders. Since the worm army is free this allows him/her other options.

When I advocated early momentum style to my way of thinking this is the best way to play this faction as it allows him the ability to leverage better research from subs. I hear what your saying about his overall staying power as a faction in all phases of the game and perhaps I was a bit harsh in characterizing him as a full blown momentum style faction which we both believe he is capable of being.

I have seen great benefits when playing Cha as a builder. Builds of WP (starting tech) allow for early pop boom by condensor farming. Extra worm police allow the pop boom to continue. Gain Ascetic Virtue and with free brood pits you've got all your drone worries under control with 3 worms and whats more you are virtually nerve gas proof. Lots of upside. My beef with Cha is if isolated he is painfully slow in research and without a victim or two early on will be playing catchup.

[This message has been edited by Ogie Oglethorpe (edited September 29, 2000).]

[Adam_Smith]

Ah... Ok, Early momemtum style is different. Yes, we agree here. Yeah, that would be horrible to catch all the worms and never kill them for the pearls when there is no one to force submission on, and you need cash. I guess you can set it up so that that would happen. You would have to have a huge planet, lots of ocean, and little fungus would help. In fact, that sort of world would probably hurt Cha Dawn a lot, and I wouldn't won't to try it except in a challenge.

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Qual,

I may be mistaken but I believe the unit you described namely a psi attack/psi defense unit does not allow for upgrades of empath and/or trance. For that matter, I also beleive that special abilities of soporific gas are disallowed as well (but again can be mistaken).

You may want to confirm this via scenario editor.

Og