SMAC vs. SMACX Poll

[Bkeela]

I was just wondering what everyones opinion
on SMAC and SMACX are. Does everyone like both games equally, or are there purests out there like me, who loathe SMACX - not only for its many bugs, but also because of the awkward aspects the new story line introduces?

So if you could take the time to state if you either like both, are indifferent, or prefer SMAC over SMACX, or vice versa, I would be greatly interested. If there are enough replies, I will collate the results.

Thanks.

Bkeela.

[Khan Singh]

After playing SmacX, I don't think I could go back to ordinary Smac. I like the new indigenous life too much. Fungal Towers and Spore launchers are both great additions. I also like the new Projects.

But I have to admit that the new factions are very poorly balanced. The Drones and Progenitors are unstoppable, while the Angels and the Pirates are unplayable. IMO the Progenitors and the Drones should both start the game 20 yrs after the start. At least. Also, allowing the Progenitors to win by building a Resonance Communicator was a big mistake. Did the game really need a Victory path just like Transcendence----but easier?

[RedFred]

SMACX all the way. Better native life, interesting new factions, aliens to spice things up, handy new techs and SPs. One of the big reasons for me giving the nod to SMACX is that it is the more difficult of the two. I have not yet come up with a fast transcend time to match my best at SMAC.

My experience with the new factions has been different than Khan Singh's. I seem to be able to play the Drones, Cult!?, 'Borg and Pirates best and have more trouble with both aliens and Roze.

Odd about the aliens as they start out so powerfully. I think I rely on that early tech swapping with the AI a lot. Playing the aliens just doesn't seem as fun, either.

In my opinion, SMACX shines the brightest in random faction games with both old and new factions mixed in.

I agree that the downside is that there is no question that SMACX V2 is buggier than SMAC V4.

[Master Marcus]

Yes, but the most itching bug of all - the maintenance - is correctly fixed by v2. Remaining bugs are very minor ones sometimes at the advantage of a poor AI, I don't really mind for a great game unaffected at all by the details found on ZsoZso list. Still it would be great if Firaxis plan to make the v3.

I'm a SMACx v2 addict, and since you can play any original factions within the new upgrades - it's exactly like seeing the Star Wars special editions remakes : how many fans out there are still viewing the original when you can have all the original footing within the remakes ?

Not to mention that the AI is a bit less stupid : building more air units and colonizing smaller islands, for instance...

------------------
The art of mastering:"la Maîtrise des caprices du subconscient avant tout".

[Garth Vader]

Interesting that you made reference to Star Wars Special edition. I feel the same about those as I do with SMACx.

I liked the SW special edition but thought the changes they made to Empire and Jedi reeked. Especially the edited dialog. Yes I have seen them enough to notice a phrase or two out of place.

So I thought of the special editions as just a way to milk extra cash off the slobbering fans who bought the THX version of the originals and then spent more on the special editions.

[Enigma]

After playing SMACX I have decided that I enjoy it more, but not a whole lot. It is quite tedious to have to build aerospace complexes everywhere when I could just get a secret project. I do not like the new factions but the new techs, etc. are nice.

The drones do seem very overpowered, especially if played by a human player. Just swap tech with the AI.. you will not be so high on the power charts due to low tech. The drones are very powerful. Not to mention the one less drone can allow some serious ICSing even in FM without any drone problems.

The new storyline was more or less botched completely, writing a story with 7 factions is a LARGE strain, and writing a story with 14 factions is even worse.

Overall I think that SMACX is nice, but nothing I could not live without. As far as the price $20 is very little to pay for even 1 week's extra worth of amusement..

Also the 1/3 maintenence cost on Transcend and thinker seems to have been fixed in SMACX, this rewards pop booming even more since the facilities it affects are related to drone control.

I would far prefer a bug free v5. SMAC than a buggy v 2. SMACX.

But firaxis has been completely silent about this..

[kaz]

Roze can be played by anyone who plays the PK well. No real minuses, and a few pluses.
Add to this the early ability to go Planned, good early probes without Fundie(always a plus), and the ability to sit back and get tech for free(invaluable in MP), and it is a great faction in the hands of a human, but not quite that great for a AI.

The Pirates get the bonuses of being able to build virtually unopposed for 100 years, and if they terraform only the sea(and get the enhancement facilities), they can have a great support infrastructure(and bases in the deep sea that aren't worth it for anyone else to possess).

As for the Aliens, two words. Nerve Gas.

Drones? A Miriam clone. If you hate Miriam, you hate the Drones.

All in all, the SMAX factions are just jumped up versions of the first factions. More bonuses, more minuses. Great for single strategies and SP, but most MPers play old factions for their flexibility.
[This message has been edited by kaz (edited May 15, 2000).]

[Velociryx]

I *truly* enjoy my games of SMAX, for three principle reasons:

First: I really love the extra productivity from sea squares, thanks to the new builds possible....getting 4/5 from each kelp/harness on the map is just too sweet, and the pirates, using trunklines, can out-produce their land-lubbing counterparts in the midgame (surrounding and boreholing islands to get the BH-Kick).

Second, I love the whole host of little bug fixes that were introduced....everything from true maintenance costs, to artillery that actually does something, to the "cut maint. costs in half" SP that really WORKS now....::evil grin::

And finally, even though the new factions pretty much screwed the storyline, I like 'em anyway....quite refershing to have some new playstyles based on new sets of strengths and weaknesses without having to spend three weeks in the faction editor....

SMAC is still a cool game, but options-wise, SMACX really opens up the field of possibilities, and, as somebody else mentioned earlier, it's worth it for the native life forms alone! (even though, as a diehard Marketeer, the tend to kick my....assets? LOL)

-=Vel=-

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

What gives guys. Poor Rose has been taking a trashing here. Gotta love the grrrls.

Seriously though. Ability to go planned ASAP (as soon as you can raise 40 energy that is) rocks. This effectively allows the expansion for Angels on par with the best any other rapid expansion faction such as the Hive can offer. She has no real weaknesses and to my way of thinking is the perfect all around faction. Top that off with probe power excellance and shes got a vote from me for one of my fav factions.

But I digress. To the topic as posted. SMACX for game play definitely over SMAC. The so-called story line however does not work for me. I much prefered the original story. OTOH I'll take game play over story line any day.
And since I don't like the "new" story line more often than not I simply disallow use of progenitors (I for sure never play them). It's too tempting and easy to simply gas them out of existance.

[WhiteElephants]

I'm for SMACX for some of the reasons listed above -- maintenace costs fixed, new native life, new techs and SPs -- although I tend to play with the old factions (go figure?).

[Garth Vader]

I don't have SMACx and from what I have read I have no real desire to get it. I especially have no desire to plunk down an extra wad of cash for some new factions and techs when they haven't fixed all the bugs in the original game that I bought, and as I understand introduced some new ones .

[RedFred]

As in other threads, maybe we could get future voters to keep a running total of the votes. So far I make it out to be SMACX 7 SMAC 2.

Not sure what camp to put kaz in so I left him out for the time being.

[Basil]

Heheh, takes all kinds. I like both. In terms of story line, of course the SMACX story line basically doesn't exist, and isn't supported in the game anyway, except for the aliens. (It would be just so cool if a drone riot somewhere part way through the game led to a new faction, led by Domai, emerging.) But this is a game, not a novel, so that's a weakness but not the end of the world.

I really like about half the new facilities/secret projects/life forms/factions and actively dislike the other half, some of which are things that other people specifically like: I don't like spore launchers or aquafarms, for instance. I find many of these new features unbalanced - they are overpowered, too nice. Sea squares were good enough already, and why couldn't they have bothered to balance the new factions? (OK, I'll agree they balanced the Pirates. Now what about the other six?)

On the other hand, I really like the new engine, with its bug fixes. And hey - if I don't like a facility/SP/life form I can edit it out of alphax.txt, but I can't put one that I like into alpha.txt. So I'll probably end up playing a customized SMACX in the future, with the tech tree edited so that from a human faction's point of view you seem to be playing SMAC - until you run into a Progenitor faction and they have all this stuff from SMACX .

But if I'd had my choice, I'd rather they'd made the AI understand air power than all the additional features in the expansion.

So that's 7:2:2 for SMAX, SMAC, both.

[Zaxxon]

Wow I really like that idea of a drone riot having the possibility of leading to a new faction spawning . But instead of just the drones (I realize you picked the drones for their specific beliefs) it would be even more fun if it spawned a random faction.

Speaking of random, that is actually one of the main reasons that I'm all for SMAX over SMAC. I love not knowing who I'm going to play against (or who I myself am going to play, for that matter) when I start a new game. It keeps things interesting.

SMAX 8; SMAC 2; Draw(?)2

[senatus]

I like the new alien varieties; some of the SPs are fine, others a bit too powerful for their price (Cloudbase and the Energy Bank one). The techs are OK. I really dislike
the new factions because they disrupt the
"feel" of SMAC being centred on ideological
conflicts. I can't see the humans factionalized with the Progenitors around - they'd have to realize they are screwed as a race if they squabble - and in terms of an ideology, many of the new factions are stupid (i.e. I can't seriously see the Data Angels or even the Pirates "Ahar, Zackie, have ya ever been ta sea?" existing as a full-fledged faction that has to terraform and battle - they should be parasites in a civilized world, not a frontier one). If you called the DAs "Anarchists" and gave them SE choices and strengths / weaknesses I could buy it - but it's hard to see a full faction of hackers existing in a world where people worry about mindworm repellant more than computers.