2162 End Turn and 2163 Discussion

[AndiD]

What do we know about the folks running Gaia? Player personalities etc.

Role-playing wise, EnvEcon is a environmental tech ("the bridge between environment and economy") and SotHB leads to Centauri Empathy (Green and better worms (Biolabs?)), so that offers some great roleplaying opportunities.

We could offer starting a environmental conservation program for our industry (more pure roleplaying) and gameplay cash assistance when they are being invaded by Sparta or the Hive, for example.
[either we are dead at that time or we will be able to afford it - I cannot quite see something in between in the mid-term...]

Otherwise... I'd say simply trust them. I guess they prefer fighting Morgan to the end as opposed to Sparta...

[Whoha]

Originally posted by Mead


Let's not tear down the roads now. Only after we get an indication of invasion if its not too late.

we have no choice, elite rovers will land and get 6 movement points as it stands. Anything 3 squares away can get hit by an elite missile rover, but tear out 1 or 2 road sections from our coast to our core and we are safe. That may have just been a freak accident with the solar flare, but we can't afford to take that chance again with the PEG or the HGP.

[Mead]

Originally posted by Whoha


we have no choice, elite rovers will land and get 6 movement points as it stands. Anything 3 squares away can get hit by an elite missile rover, but tear out 1 or 2 road sections from our coast to our core and we are safe. That may have just been a freak accident with the solar flare, but we can't afford to take that chance again with the PEG or the HGP.

I hear what you are saying and I'm thinking about it.


The things going through my mind are that roads work both ways. This is, they allow both thier rovers and our probes fast travel.

Tearing up a few roads may but us some time and I am not adverse to doing it, but I would much rather make two or three hard points (well garrisonned, permiter defense equipped bases) that they can't bypass.

I suggest we start RC next turn in the bases that we want permiters in. Then the folowing turn turn them to Perimeter defenses and rush them. Because Sparta has us infiltrated I don't want them to have any advance noteice that we are equipiing those bases with perimeter, until the defenses are in place.


Mead


PS
I hope, hope, hope, we have enough time. If they did not have MCC I feel we would, with it I'm am worried.


PPS
Take a look at the map and see just how many units they can produce, particularly with that Fort Superioty, 6 pop base, and borehole cluster enhanced base.

[Whoha]

actually our probes still have access to our core roads, it just means that they get to either the spot the rover stopped on, or the rover stayed next to the coast, either way good for us.

Would foresting our costal roaded squares and stationing units there force rovers to expend 2 movement points to make it to land?

[Mead]

Originally posted by Whoha
actually our probes still have access to our core roads, it just means that they get to either the spot the rover stopped on, or the rover stayed next to the coast, either way good for us.

Would foresting our costal roaded squares and stationing units there force rovers to expend 2 movement points to make it to land?

Good point on our probe travel. My concern would be that they would be able to take a city and hold it without fear of us probing it.

I don't know about your question. If we forested the square and placed a unit on there then would it:

Need one omvement point from an amphibious unit to kill our unit, followed by two movement points from the attacking unita and two movement points from every other unit to land?

I know it takes one movement point for us to land anything. Remember it takes one movement point to land a probe on the river near the Uni base we've been probing plus 2/3 of a movement up the river to get next to the base.

I remember from SP games I would often place a rover on a transport and pop pods in the fungus coastlines. It would take one rover move to land the rover (which would also pop the pod) and one rover move to get the rover back on the transport the same turn. this was very handy when the rover popped mindworms. If there is a road in the fungus (or forest) then I think the rover could move elsewhere (other than back to the transport) using up only 1/3 turn. If there was no road then it would be required to use up whatever it takes to get through forest or fungus.

Mead


Mead

[jtsisyoda]

I can confirm that landing from a boat is always one movement point, even on fungus.

We could station probes outside of bases, near coastal bases, so they wouldn't know where they are, and would have difficulty planning probe defense.

One possibility is to have roads connecting adjacent coastal cities, connected by roads, with probes hanging out on the roads. The probes might have a chance to retake quickly. Core cities wouldn't be as vulnerable because the roads don't lead in, only around.

[AndiD]

I think this could be a good compromise - maybe no roads directly adjacent to the coast and a destruction of selected roads leading inland. Probes without armor stay on the roads (they don't do any good in base defense anyway).

I won't switch to RC to hide our perimeter defense efforts but to offensive units - looks more frightening for 1-2 turns and they might decide to pack a few defenders into their invading horde.

I think about placing a Plasma Crawler and sensor at the south to effectively block the Hive until they approach with Gatling or Missile units - since they will come after us as soon as we techsteal D:AP.

Does someone know whether PROBE+2 (Fundy) affects success rates of probe teams. We might wanna try to frame someone else if we have two or even three chances of probing Yang for D:AP in four turns?

The correct timing for Fundy is crucial but we can only guess at the moment. Ideally, we switch to Fundy one turn before they land but when will this be.

Mead: Any update about your thoughts of leapfrogging tech together with Gaia? The earlier they get a improved commerce rating and can make use of their borehole the better...
And In your Angel diplomacy efforts, have you asked them whether they have infiltration of Sparta?

I'll also see whether I can place some crawlers on forests and/or on the coast and whether we can armor them - or would this be waste of money until we get Perimeter Defenses in all bases within three tiles of any coast and at least a Plasma Garrison / Attorney in it?

[Mead]

Originally posted by AndiD
I think this could be a good compromise - maybe no roads directly adjacent to the coast and a destruction of selected roads leading inland. Probes without armor stay on the roads (they don't do any good in base defense anyway).

Let's look at the ones we want to get rid of.

I won't switch to RC to hide our perimeter defense efforts but to offensive units - looks more frightening for 1-2 turns and they might decide to pack a few defenders into their invading horde.

Sounds OK to me. I just don't want to tip them off to our plans.

I think about placing a Plasma Crawler and sensor at the south to effectively block the Hive until they approach with Gatling or Missile units - since they will come after us as soon as we techsteal D:AP.

How much will the plasma crawler cost?

Does someone know whether PROBE+2 (Fundy) affects success rates of probe teams. We might wanna try to frame someone else if we have two or even three chances of probing Yang for D:AP in four turns?

It is my understanding that PROBE+2 (Fundy) does improve Probe success rates. Who do we want to frame? Even though it may improve the chances of success it is still safer to probe without framing someone else.

The correct timing for Fundy is crucial but we can only guess at the moment. Ideally, we switch to Fundy one turn before they land but when will this be.

My best guess is 2 turns from now, 3 max.

Mead: Any update about your thoughts of leapfrogging tech together with Gaia? The earlier they get a improved commerce rating and can make use of their borehole the better...

No, not yet. I'll check with them. As I said earlier, giving them the tech now is a tradeoff between them having and using it to get a higher tech rate, against more time between when we give them the tech and when they return it. What is the tech we want in return, Neural grafting right?

And In your Angel diplomacy efforts, have you asked them whether they have infiltration of Sparta?

No, I haven't asked. I don't think they do, otherwise they would be rushing into Pact with us. It can't hurt to ask, can it?

I'll also see whether I can place some crawlers on forests and/or on the coast and whether we can armor them - or would this be waste of money until we get Perimeter Defenses in all bases within three tiles of any coast and at least a Plasma Garrison / Attorney in it?

I don't think we need to perimeter and heavily gassison every base within three tiles of the coast. Right now we need to make 3-4 hard points where we concentrate our defenses. Hardpoints that are well garrisoned with plasma defenders, a rover or 2 and 2 probes. They should be placed so that their ZOCs inhibits travel around them.

Mead

[Mead]

Originally posted by AndiD
Some screenshots of Spartan land (as Caretakers - Sparta as Sparta gives black population numbers on black background?!)

http://apolyton.net/upload/view.php?file=52362_map_screenshots.zip

Note: We should remove every faction data from each image we don't want to share (infobox etc.)! Can you do it or shall I?

AndiD

I don't know how to do it. Can you please do it and forward the Sparta map onto Geo at DA, and Chaos at Gaian?

Please ensure you give them only the Spartan info with no pictures of anyone else's territory.

I'll PM both and let them know its coming.


Thanks


Mead

[AndiD]

Will do - should take just a few minutes. It will be Spartan land and Uni land (since they are submissive and hard to edit out... )

[Mead]

Come to think of it. Let's not send screenshots of Sparta to Gaia right now. We already have them as a Pactmate. My main reason for sending the screenshots to DA is to try to influence them to become our Pactmate (because they will see how big, powerful, and dangerous Sparta is).

With Gaia, they are already our Pactmate so we don't have to influence them. I don't mind sharing the map with them, but not giving them it 'for free' when we don't have to.


Mead

[AndiD]

Sent a complete map Geo.

I'm not sure whether anything went to Chaos because Apolyton stalled on sending the PM. It could be that the PM was sent and I simply didn't get reply from he Poly server, it could also be that the Poly server refused to take the PM. After that, I read your msg above and did not try to resend...