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The Rules for ACDG III

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  • #31
    Ok obs. I almost feel like popping in our private forum now.
    Be good, and if at first you don't succeed, perhaps failure will be back in fashion soon. -- teh Spamski

    Grapefruit Garden

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    • #32
      But you are no longer a Gaian
      SMAC/X FAQ | Chiron Archives
      The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. --G.B.Shaw

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      • #33
        I know.
        Be good, and if at first you don't succeed, perhaps failure will be back in fashion soon. -- teh Spamski

        Grapefruit Garden

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        • #34
          Don't cry - you left on your own :
          SMAC/X FAQ | Chiron Archives
          The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. --G.B.Shaw

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          • #35
            Originally posted by HongHu
            I know.
            You're always be a Gaian... in your heart!
            He who knows others is wise.
            He who knows himself is enlightened.
            -- Lao Tsu

            SMAC(X) Marsscenario

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            • #36
              I also must object to the stockpile energy bug. Putting it in the build queues should be illegal. It does favor builders, and it does have a big effect in your overall income, allowing you to rush things and progress much more quickly. It would also be easy to police. As far as the stockpile energy bug happening naturally, I guess we could allow it, as I don't know how one would police it or prevent it from happening (hey, we all forget to place an item in a build queue every once in a while.)

              Everything else looks good. Of course, this is my fist ACDG, so I'm not familiar with what has been generally accepted in the past. If the stockpile energy bug has been used in the past, and it didn't have any adverse effects then, then I suppose it would be okay.
              Civ IV is digital crack. If you are a college student in the middle of the semester, don't touch it with a 10-foot pole. I'm serious.

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              • #37
                If we'd want to eliminate the stockpile energy bug, we'd have to:
                1) forbid putting stockpile energy in the queue after a unit,
                2) force everyone to put something else (anything except stockpile energy) in the queue after a facility or secret project.

                If we only forbid 1) stockpile energy after a unit, as you suggest, then the stockpile energy bug will no longer work for unit production, but still for facility/SP production. And since I assume momentum players will produce more units than builders, this is actually even more in the disadvantage of momentum players!

                So completely forbidding the stockpile energy bug would be most levelling back the field in the favour of momentum, however since I assume no one will like being forced having to use the queue, I think completely allowing the bug for everyone and everything is the next best thing.
                Contraria sunt Complementa. -- Niels Bohr
                Mods: SMAniaC (SMAC) & Planetfall (Civ4)

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                • #38
                  Actually the stockpile energy bug favours anyone who makes a lot of units. You only get extra energy from stockpiling after a unit not after a facility of secret project.

                  Normally when a facility or secret project is built and the build queue is empty, the game automatically inserts stockpile energy into the build queue. Hence, when a facility or SP is built, the normal game behaviour is to get extra e.c.s.

                  However, when a unit is produced, the game automatically starts work on another unit of the same kind. The normal game behaviour is to get no e.c.s after producing a unit.

                  Therefore, whoever produces more units (Usually the momentum players I'd say) gains more from this. Consider also that a builder will usually have a better infrastructure, and so the cash from stockpiling is less significant.
                  Play hangman.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Chaunk
                    Normally when a facility or secret project is built and the build queue is empty, the game automatically inserts stockpile energy into the build queue. Hence, when a facility or SP is built, the normal game behaviour is to get extra e.c.s.
                    Getting credits that way is normal in the sense that the game automatically switches to stockpile energy, but I suppose it's still not normal in the sense that the stockpile energy bug probably isn't a deliberate feature by the designers, meaning that if the game worked properly, builders wouldn't get the extra cash.
                    Contraria sunt Complementa. -- Niels Bohr
                    Mods: SMAniaC (SMAC) & Planetfall (Civ4)

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                    • #40
                      Granted, but on the basis that forcing people to use queues is too much hassle, we have to allow stockpile energy to even out the unintended behaviour IMHO.
                      Play hangman.

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                      • #41
                        The real secret to getting lots of Stockpile Bug energy is to have pruduction of some "thing" finish in your bases as often as possible, idealy every turn if you can manage it. Each time you manage that your converting your yearly mineral income into Credits at a 2:1 ratio and when you spend thouse Credits to hurry production you can get a aproimatly 1 production for 2 credits for a total ratio of 4:1. Basicaly a 25% refund on the stockpiled minerals.

                        This all translates to an EFFICIENCY OF SCALE, by having a base finish its current production as often as possible rather then laboring away for 20 years on a progjet too large for it you lower overall costs. This supposed BUG infact replicates real world economics!

                        (I dont think this is intended by Firaxis, its just pure luck that of all the bugs one of them actualy incresses realism)

                        Thus I fully support our stance of using the Stockpile Energy Bug for all multiplayer gaming
                        Companions the creator seeks, not corpses, not herds and believers. Fellow creators, the creator seeks - those who write new values on new tablets. Companions the creator seeks, and fellow harvesters; for everything about him is ripe for the harvest. - Thus spoke Zarathustra, Fredrick Nietzsche

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                        • #42
                          The more reason why AI's get behind that quickly? They don't use that bug eh...
                          He who knows others is wise.
                          He who knows himself is enlightened.
                          -- Lao Tsu

                          SMAC(X) Marsscenario

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Impaler[WrG]
                            This supposed BUG infact replicates real world economics!
                            Not quite. The problem with stockpile energy bug is that you can't use the build queue. Building small things often, like rec commons, tanks, creches, etc., gets your more energy if you build them with a stockpile energy after each, than if you put things in the queue after them. Likewise with units. It means if you set it to build a scout, then a rover, then a cruiser, it gets less money than a scout and a stockpile, a rover and a stockpile then a cruiser and a stockpile. That isn't real world economics, that's a bug.

                            But yes, building things most similar to your size does generate the best economies of scale, usually.
                            Smile
                            For though he was master of the world, he was not quite sure what to do next
                            But he would think of something

                            "Hm. I suppose I should get my waffle a santa hat." - Kuciwalker

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Chaunk
                              Granted, but on the basis that forcing people to use queues is too much hassle, we have to allow stockpile energy to even out the unintended behaviour IMHO.
                              I agree.
                              Contraria sunt Complementa. -- Niels Bohr
                              Mods: SMAniaC (SMAC) & Planetfall (Civ4)

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                              • #45
                                whats the deal with choppers attacking bases?

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