Great War (WWI) scenario?

[Ecthy]

Let me summarize it all again then

28. 07. Austro-Hungarian Empire declares war on Serbia
29. 07. Russia begins mobilization of its army
31. 07. Germany demands Russia to quit mobilization and issues France to keep neutrality in the case of a war between Germany and Russia
The demands are ignored/rejected
01. 08. Germany declares war on Russia.
03. 08. Germany declares war on France.
04. 08. The German army enters Belgium, causing the declaration of war by Great Britain, to Germany

Alas, I don't have the dates here for the Allied countries declaring war on Austria.

The Ottoman empire didn't enter the war before October, 29 1914. Bulgary entered on the side of the Central Powers on October, 14 1915.

Japan entered on the Allied side on August 23 1914, Italy on the 23rd of March 1915. Others are:

09. 03. 1916: Portugal
27. 08. 1916: Romania

06. 04. 1917: United States of America
27. 06. Greece

I left out those South American tiny countries that entered the war for only god knows which reasons... Montenegro joined Serbia on the 5th of August, 1914, San Marino followed Italy on 3rd of June, 1915

everything should be comprehensable now, apart from the missing figures for Austrian entering of war against Russia and the Entente

Would the UK have entered the war if Germany hadn't marched through Belgium? I think so, because the pact between Great Britain and Belgium was like 100 years old ar that time, an apparent pretext.

[Dauphin]

Would the UK have entered the war if Germany hadn't marched through Belgium? I think so, because the pact between Great Britain and Belgium was like 100 years old ar that time, an apparent pretext.

Question that I have often asked, if we didn't presumably Germany would have won the war. How would it all have panned out from there?

[Ecthy]

I'm afraid the French would have beaten the crap out of us if we hadn't marched through Belgium...

[Rasbelin]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
I'm afraid the French would have beaten the crap out of us if we hadn't marched through Belgium...

You might be right. I suppose they would have dug
themselves into trenches for a much longer time,
than "just" 3 years.

[Sandman]

So...

Could the German player move Lenin to St Petersburg and trigger the Russian Revolution?

[Dauphin]

Originally posted by Ecthelion
I'm afraid the French would have beaten the crap out of us if we hadn't marched through Belgium...

The French had a "defence" mentality. Why bother attacking at all, just ensure the Siegfried line wasn't breached and focus on expanding into Russia.

[Dr. Nick]

Siegfried line? In 1914?

[Dauphin]

D'oh!

What were the defences called before WW1?

[Ecthy]

I'm sure it was not the Maginot line, what do you think?

[HisMajestyBOB]

See Jeszenka's Second Reich scenarion for inspiration. Personally, i think the US should not be included (just give units to the Allies) Also, France and Britain should be one civ, so they can cooperate effectively. Finally, a way to simulate the Russian Revoltuion and Russia's withdrawl from the war would be nice (maybe w/ events?)

[Rasbelin]

So the conclusion is that the list "should"
be something like this:

Russia - Czar Nicholas II
Germany - Wilhelm II
Austria-Hungary - Franz Josef
France - Georges Clemenceau (PM) or
Raymond Poincare (president)
Britain - Lloyd George
United States - Woodrow Wilson
Italy - Victor Emmanuel III
Greece - Eleutherios Venizelos
Ottoman empire - Enver Pasa

[jsw363]

Originally posted by Big Crunch

Question that I have often asked, if we didn't presumably Germany would have won the war. How would it all have panned out from there?

Part of the reason that the war started was because Germany didn't believe that Britain would enter the war. The British didn't give Germany any explicit answer to the issue and in fact hinted that they would stay out. It's a really complex issue about which numerous historians have written books. I think that one of the best is "The Pity of War" by Ferguson. Great read...

[Tolls]

"The French had a "defence" mentality"

Not really...they had a very aggressive mentality in 1914, involving their much vaunted "elan"...which didn't really work. They were supposed to attack attack attack, except the Germans outflanked them and it all sort of went wrong.
If Germany hadn't gone through Belgium, then there would have been one almighty blood bath between the two sides (assuming Germany invaded)...until they were both knackered and settled down to a "quiet" few years, while Germany sorted out Russia.

Had the Germans not attacked, I expect the French Plan XVII would have been as successful as it was in reality...

[Dauphin]

Originally posted by jsw363


Part of the reason that the war started was because Germany didn't believe that Britain would enter the war. The British didn't give Germany any explicit answer to the issue

The Foreign Minister (Grey IIRC) was on a fishing trip during the critical days, and his underlings were not that competent. There was no direct contact AFAIK on the issue of British entry.

With all "what ifs" we will never really know, there were many variables at play, to single one out is absurd.

[jsw363]

Originally posted by Big Crunch
The Foreign Minister (Grey IIRC) was on a fishing trip during the critical days, and his underlings were not that competent. There was no direct contact AFAIK on the issue of British entry.

Many of Europe's leaders were on vacation as it was the summer when the crisis occurred. However there was much contact between all the nations regarding what kind of position Britain would take in a conflict.

In a letter from Grey to British Ambassador to France, Sir Francis Bertie: "it was the uncertainty with regard to whether we would intervene which was the encouraging element in Berlin, and that, if we would only declare definitely on the side of Russia and France, it would decide the German attitude in favor of peace."

Despite all the contact the British still did not signal their intentions to the other nations. Not the single cause of the war, but a contributing factor. In any event this is OT.