Rushing Unhappiness Question

[CaptainChaos]

Im playing a Despotism. I have a city with three population. I have two military units (each producing content) and one temple (producing content) and three luxury items producing happiness. I have rushed the heck out of that place. It shows two content people and one unhappy person, which means I have to convert the unhappy person to an entertainer, which leaves the city less productive and two content and one happy person.

I do not understand the math here. Even if it were 3 unhappy people (from constantly rushing), shouldn't the temple and two soldiers turn them all content and then the luxury items turn them all happy? Not 2 content and 1 unhappy.

What's the deal? Thanks for any guidance. This is really annoying me and frustrating my strategy.

[vmxa1]

I would think that it should be fine. Are these native or captive? In the city view, do you actually see those lux? Is this a modified game?

[CaptainChaos]

Hi, thanks so much for the reply. Actually, I was slightly wrong but this makes it only more confusing. I have a temple and a soldier and two luxuries, and three of my own country people. It is a modified game but i only changed the strength of navy units so triremes won't sink air craft carriers.

So, now what I notice is that if i use all three pop to work the land, I get two unhappy faces, despite having a solider AND a temple. If i use one person as an entertainer I get two content people and one happy people. This makes LESS sense than what I saw before. Because of the solider and the temple at all times I should have at least two content faces right? and the two luxuries either should make them happy, no? so even if the third pop was working the land and unhappy, i should have two happy and one unhappy...? Thanks again for anything you can explain.

[vmxa1]

When you click on the citizen what do they say? The whip effect last 20 turns, so I am not sure if 2 MP and a temple and 2 lux are enough. Is this emperor or higher? IOW you start with only 1 content citizen.

If so then 2 MP would offset the normal unhappiness. I do not pretend to really know the mechanics of whipping, but I would expect that 4 whipping not more than 20 turns ago, would cause what you are seeing.

[CaptainChaos]

Actually, I only have 1 MP and 1 Temple and 2 Luxuries and am playing Monarch. But none of this makes sense. First of all, can i have more unhappy people than population? Even if all three start out unhappy, I have 1 MP and 1 Temple which should = 2 Content and 1 Unhappy. Then I have 2 luxuries; don't those make the 2 content people happy? So, shouldn't I have 2 happy people and 1 unhappy person?

[vmxa1]

You can have unhappiness from whipping or from war. These are cumulative with any other unhappiness, such as crowding. WW and whipping are dissipated over 20 turns. The bottom line is that regardless of why, you have to get at least to the point where you have at least as many happy as unhappy.

[CaptainChaos]

Well, I appreciate the time you have taken to analyze my problem. What bothers me is that until I understand the mathematics of this I cannot hope to plan properly, especially by whipping. If I only have three people, I can't see how there can be more than 3 unhappy faces, and yet i do in fact have everything i need to make at least 2 people content and then happy, so that I should have two happy vs. 1 unhappy. it makes no sense and until i figure out the missing piece of the puzzle i can't possibly hope to fix my situation. don't you agree?

[vmxa1]

Actually no I do not agree. You only need to know what it takes to get to a balance. IOW as many happy as unhappy. The apparent way it works, note I do not use the whip normally, is you will have a ledger.

It will track all the unhappiness you have piled up from whipping. You have your normal unhappiness issue to settle and then you have to offset the whipping. YOu will either have to hold the whip until 20 turns have gone pass or will have to use one of the mechanism to make citizens content.

Special games may require whipping. Early parts of the game may require some, but in the main, I want to get into a form of government that does not use whipping.

We are talking about civ3 not civ4 correct? Civ4 is different in that it is a civic that allows whipping and it may be switched to at any point.

[Aqualung71]

10c worth of advice from a real amateur at this - don't whip your citizens. In the long run (and usually the short term also) it is hugely counter-productive. Find another way.

Despots always fail in the end

[Whoha]

To resurrect a dead thread, and anwser the question to anyone else that might be wondering this, pop rush/draft unhappiness is calculated last or second to last in the happiness calculations. The only way to deal with this type of unhappiness is to convert the unhappy person into a specialist.

Originally the game did not have this feature, and players found that using pop rushing they could trivialize the game by getting a massive military force and absolutely crushing the AI even on deity, and for late game then use luxuries, improvements, and the slider to control the resulting unhappiness as cities actually grew. I did this once on deity just for the hell of it and that game was kind of interesting if blatantly unfair to the AI.

So Obviously they patched it, and also made drafting hurt more in the process.

Finally disbanding the city will transfer its unhappiness to another city, so no trying to set up temporary cities to do this with.