Rank the traits: Expansionist

[kobo1d]

Hi all. Long time reader, 1st time poster.
I was curious how everyone would "rank" the traits.
This time: Expansionist

On a scale of 0-5, 0 being totally worthless and 5 being the best, how would everyone rank the Exp. trait?


Update

Expansionist averaged 2.222 after 36 votes.
Ranked last, 8th place.

Chart coming soon.

[Kloreep]

Expansionist is completely map dependant. The larger the map, the lesser the ocean percentage, the fewer the number of civs relative to the map, and the further away the continents setting is from archipelago, the better it will be.

[vmxa1]

I never like exp trait and it is totally worthless at the highest levels. It can be used in large maps on PTW at emperor level to just crush the AI by popping lots of huts.

You don't need it though and above that level the huts are not your friends.

[kobo1d]

updated stats

[vmxa1]

You may want to hold off on those updates till you get a few more votes.

[Donegeal]

Exp is one of the most underrated traits in the game.

Need tech? Pop a hut.

Want to rex? Pop a hut.

Need money? Pop a hut.

Need units? Pop a hut.

When playing an expansionist civ, I usually end up with a massive tech lead very early. I also almost always get a settler very early. A free city and a tech lead? Plus a couple of extra units and some money? Come on! Game over mid way through the Ancient Age! (Play on Monarch/Regent with random STANDARD maps)

Additionally, expansionist civs are one of the most dangerous civs for the AI to be, but they aren't played correctly by the computer. They start out with a single Scout which the AI sends out to pop huts and well.. to Scout. It will pop techs and settlers just like a humans would. It will help the AI keep up with a quick human tech rate. If you see one... Kill it. Do it as soon as you can. The AI will not build another one and it will loose out on 50% of its trait advantages. You can sue for peace later on. Usually after 5 turns, if you still have an "Average" military, they will make peace without compensation. If they are strong, then they will demand something from you. Go ahead and give them a tech. So what? You should be so far ahead of them at this point that it wouldn't matter anyway. Plus, giving them that one tech FAR out weighs the benifits that it would have gained through continued exploring and hut popping.

However, I did not have the courage to rank it a 5 as that should be held exclusivly for Ag.

[Mountain Sage]

As usual, 0 on archipelago, 5 on pangea, gargantuan, 35 civs. Since I play mostly on archipelago...

[Jon Shafer]

I gave it a 3, since the potential advantages are quite good as Done mentions, however it's highly map and luck dependent... some games I've gotten 1 tech and some gold and that was IT.

[vulture]

It is very map dependent, but I've had too many games where there just weren't that many huts I could get to first, and I've come away with very little.

[Arrian]

Hmm, 2 or 3?

It can be huge, if you get a settler and a couple of techs. Or it can be nearly useless, if you get a couple of conscript warriors and a little gold. Plus, the exploration edge is reduced due to the ability of all civs to build curraghs, which can map out the coasts pretty fast.

I dunno. I play standard maps/monarch, and it just doesn't do much for me. I play it occasionally, and am usually less than thrilled.

I'm going with a 2. Maybe Aeson will come along and explain one more time why most of us are wrong about this one

-Arrian

[Aeson]

10 shield 2 movement units that can pillage... available from day one, with a free one to start.

Iroquois being moved to Comm/Ag makes it a less attractive trait overall though. Same with map trading being moved back and the Ag combo going to an expensive Scout unable to stay in AI territory while at peace. Chasqui are very good at laying waste to an AI still, and in some situations are probably the strongest UU out there. Too variable though. Usually would rather have a cheaper Jag or a non-military Scout.

Still a solid 4 vs the AI on average settings without relying on hut bonuses... if you don't mind exploiting every little flaw in the AI.

[kobo1d]

updated stats

[Mountain Sage]

Originally posted by Aeson


10 shield 2 movement units that can pillage... available from day one, with a free one to start.

on archiplago, all alone on your island?

[Donegeal]

how dare you question AESON!!!!!

[Aeson]

At least you have an extra tech towards Map Making if you're all alone, and will know your situation ASAP. Otherwise you might spend extra time building up to an Archer rush, building a Granary for a strong Rex on a small island, researching something other than straight to Map Making, ect.

Then when you're ready to invade, drop off a Scout or two in the target's territory, find their Iron, Horses, and/or important roads, pillage them the first turn of the war, and pull their units away from your landing site.

It's obviously not going to be as useful a trait under those conditions, but hardly useless.