Rank the traits: Commercial

[Jon Shafer]

Against human players COM isn't all that much of a boon. COM is a trait about long-term advantages, and games against other humans are often decided early, before the advantages of COM start to stack up.

[vmxa1]

I agree that most traits have to be valued on the basis of the map and game settings. Map size and levels and MP or SP and how do you want to win are all going to change the rating.

[bongo]

Com is a bit strange. It won't help you that much to get an early lead, expand fast etc, but it works all the time. As opposed to the other traits which need certain circumstances to work. (you need wars to benfit from mil. , revolutions to benefit from rel. etc)

[Cerbykins]

4 - fights corruption. I hate ALL corruption. ALWAYS

(that simple )

[Krill]

You should meet alexman, cerby. You would make great friends.

3 - I play a long term builder game, but I don't find it that useful. I need a fast REX to get all the land I need, and this does not help in that situation

[Cerbykins]

The name rings bells

For me, it's as much an act of psychology as practical gain. Although, at the same time - small changes imperceiveable at first might have big repercussions later. I should probably add I like the big games and big empires

[kobo1d]

updated stats
commercial rose 1 spot

[Arnelos]

4. Commercial was my favorite trait once they fixed the bugs with it (took them awhile...) in stock Civ3 and has remained one of my favorites ever since. Once you HAVE an empire, the corruption reduction makes an absolutely ENORMOUS impact, especially over time.

However, commercial has more impact in the early stages of the game than I think many give it credit... in the early stages of the game when you are frequently running up against massive corruption even in relatively close cities (at least on standard to tiny maps), that corruption reduction bonus can be a major boon...

Personally, I find that the point at which commercial shines best is the late ancient and early Middle age period. When you've built up city pop in core cities to 7 (gaining the +1 trade bonus) and even your secondary cities are benefiting from the corruptoin reduction of this trait, it can be incredibly powerful.

Admitedly, the increase in unit upgrade costs with C3C made this trait less powerful because that boost in income during that period of the game was much of what made the trait so powerful... you used that extra income to upgrade more troops rather than having to build the more expensive versions from scratch. That said, it's still a very powerful trait during that period of the game, if for no other reason than that research during that period is VERY difficult unless you're running under Republic or Monarchy with the commercial trait (though the scientific trait is good for this, the commercial trait will benefit you in more different ways).

Frankly, I find that this is an underrated trait for MP play, especially. Not all MP games are decided in the first 50 turns, afterall. Many take well more than 100 turns to be decided and this trait will give a rather sizable benefit over such a period.

[MotownDennis]

Commercial is the absolute worst trait in the game. Period.

Sure it has its advantages, but I would always rather have any other trait.

[joncnunn]

A nice solid 3 traight. Less distance corruption, so helps out with corruption especally in the FP centric region.

Also +2 commerce for every city that reaches size 7. For a Republic for of govt this really makes the difference between a size 6 or size 7 huge!

(+2 in the city, +2 in the extra worked road tile, -4 unit support costs, and that's without considering the other structures present)

[Arnelos]

Originally posted by MotownDennis
Commercial is the absolute worst trait in the game. Period.

Sure it has its advantages, but I would always rather have any other trait.

This opinion must be primarily influenced by consistently playing on tiny maps in games that rarely make it beyond 50 turns. In my experience, playing what MP games I do primarily on standard maps with 8 players and games lasting well beyond 100 turns, the commercial trait can be very very powerful.

[Cerbykins]

And even on those, expansionist can't be much cop...
i really do not see where that could come from, but I'm sure someone will fill me in

[MotownDennis]

Originally posted by Arnelos


This opinion must be primarily influenced by consistently playing on tiny maps in games that rarely make it beyond 50 turns. In my experience, playing what MP games I do primarily on standard maps with 8 players and games lasting well beyond 100 turns, the commercial trait can be very very powerful.

LOL Arnelos. You know I'm a MP guy so you throw this barb at me? I don't think I've played a 50 turn, tiny map game in my life, to be honest.

Anyway, you're right, commercial is terrible in MP (IMO). I was actually approaching this question from a SP perspective though (where I'm a demigod level player).

I guess you need a more detailed explanation as to why I feel that the commercial trait is "the worst trait". Note the way I referred to it - "the worst trait". This does not mean that it is useless. This simply means that any other trait is better.

By the time the commercial trait starts paying off, the game is already over; it's already been won or lost. The other traits are what get you to that point. The other traits are useful in the early game where you really need them to counteract the huge advantages the AI gets at harder levels.

If you have a huge empire in a republic government and have tech parity or better with the AI, you aren't going to lose, are you? The commercial trait is overkill.