AI civ's on regent or above level

[Lambiorix_be]

Originally posted by vmxa1
Lambiorix_be, it will be very hard to win at Regent or better if the workers are automated. If you add in letting the governors running the cities, you are then basically just another AI. You will then need a superior start location to differentiate yourself and win.

You can win at this level by just running you workers with some efficiency. Above Regent you will need to be more efficient to win and manage your core cities at least.

Point taken...I will go manual

[mkqest]

I am in the same boat here at regent level and am guilty of worker automation and using the city governors. I was wondering if there were threads on worker usage and city mgmt? I've been reading the "must read threads" but have not come across anything specific yet. You can usually tell the cities I am managing by the nice plume of black smoke into the air.

I've played two complete games and about half a dozen incompletes and have learned plenty reading the available info but I have a few questions as you can imagine.

When REX-ing the first 5 cities, make 2 out of 5 settler pumps? 2 shield makers and one coastal harbor?

Seems there is debate about whether the pump starts at pop 3 or larger pop 4/5.

First units created are warrior, spearman/warrior, granary/settler, settler? In that order approx?

When do you start adding more workers to the mix? Do you try to build workers as improved tiles become available to be worked?

Workers working in pairs give any xtra edge versus doing same task separately in separate tiles?

Forest cut shields good one time per tile per city? Can you reforest, harvest and get second round of shields?

I have C3 gold which has PTW included with C3. Do I need the PTW patch?

As far as city mgmt goes, I am pretty much lost there. When to make specialists, when to change workers to other tiles? Taxation? I read about selling a city's walls?I am not afraid to read so if there are any good threads on this please leave a link.

Thanks for any help in this area. BTW, this is a great site. Tons of good info. Good work to all!

[vmxa1]

Originally posted by mkqest

Workers working in pairs give any xtra edge versus doing same task separately in separate tiles?

Forest cut shields good one time per tile per city? Can you reforest, harvest and get second round of shields?

I have C3 gold which has PTW included with C3. Do I need the PTW patch?

The main benefit is that if you have enough workers to do it in 6 turn with one worker and 3 with two workers, you get the improvement sooner.

So at the end of the day you may not save worker turns, but you will get move use out of the improvemenets.

You get one one chop for shields from a given tile, no matter how many times you planet and chop. The IFC is dead.

IIRC gold came with 1.27F for PTW, but you can check the version to be sure.

[vmxa1]

Originally posted by mkqest
First units created are warrior, spearman/warrior, granary/settler, settler? In that order approx?

When do you start adding more workers to the mix? Do you try to build workers as improved tiles become available to be worked?

One thing you could consider is the value of making spears. In many games this is not as effective as making warriors.

The build will be a function of the map and your plan for it. If you are comfortable with a lean military, you can cut back on the troops in favor of more settlers/workers.

I make workers at a pace that allows me to keep my worked tile improved with the growth.

[Lambiorix_be]

I did play another game with this new information and it went very well. Not only was I the most advanced civilizaton, I was also the strongest. I did not go after the earlier wonders except great Library (which did help me in the earlier days). Later on I was able to do almost all wonders (like the important theory of evolution, woman suffr., United nations...etc)

At first I manually managed the workers and the cities. I had to relinquish the power quickly to the governors though since almost everytime the city grew there was civil disorder. I did however change the governor's mix. Now it only manages the mood of the people and focuses solely on production and no longer manages the 'build' (so now every time a list of values appeared which forced me to evaluate what was most needed...)

I continued a long time with manually managing the workers and then progressively started them to work automatically. (When i was sure that there were suffcient roads/mines ). At about the time I researched railroad they were all automatic. I did also created more military so I was less appealing to the other civ's. In the end I got a diplomatic victory (united nations). Also I am the only one that has a spaceship (already 5/10) so a spaceship victory is also inevitable (my favorite) + I have sufficient nukes (tactical and icbm) to wipe out all other civ's in one go.

This game was NOT on AP and I suspect that this makes a very big difference in the progress of the AI civ's

Thx everybody for their fatastic advice...at least now I no longer have to be embarrassed that I only win on the chieftain/warlord levels

[mkqest]

I started a new game too and have had good results so far though I am not very far into it yet. But the first civ I met had comparable techs and gold in the bank.

I came to the same conclusion about city governors too. Managing moods is OK until you want to add a specialist then its manual control time.

One thing I found myself doing early on is over building city improvements because I wasn't sure what to build. This added extra upkeep expenses before I had the extra cash around. You really don't need a barracks in every city early on and even granaries in some cities.

I will try to focus on granaries in the big food cities and barracks in the shield cities in the early going. But here is where the question comes in.

What to build when you don't know what to build? Early on when you have barracks in some cities, granaries or harbors in your other cities and you don't want to add upkeep costs until your workers catch up connecting and improving?

Wealth? Military units for future use?

What is average position of science slider? I feel like I am not doing enough if it hits 50% or less and yet I see it also as a fast way to raise cash if needed. Should it be adjusted/evaluated each turn?

[ErikM]

Originally posted by mkqest
What to build when you don't know what to build? Early on when you have barracks in some cities, granaries or harbors in your other cities and you don't want to add upkeep costs until your workers catch up connecting and improving?

Wealth? Military units for future use?

If you don't know what to build and there is still room for expansion, build a settler. Otherwise, build a worker. There is no such thing as too many workers. You can always add them to your better cities after terrain is improved, so think of them not just as workers, but also as a way to store population points. A rule of thumb is that if any of your citizens works an unimproved tile, build a worker.

Also, regarding your earlier question, a very good tutorial on the early game is Cracker's "Improving your opening game skills" (or something like that) on CFC. There is a link to it in the "Must read..." thread.

What is average position of science slider? I feel like I am not doing enough if it hits 50% or less and yet I see it also as a fast way to raise cash if needed. Should it be adjusted/evaluated each turn?

This depends on too many things, especially
(i) difficulty level
(ii) time period
(iii) whether you have a GreatLib.

Very early in the game (first 20-30 turns) min science research may be a good idea, since you may be able to trade your starting techs with other civs. Later on, on Emperor you should be able to reach parity with the AIs by the end of the Ancient Era (or early Medieval) and stay ahead technologically afterwards. In Republic, after building Universities in your core cities, you should be able to research at 4turns/tech (max speed) at ~70-80% science until Modern Era. Finance your research by selling some techs for AIs.

On higher difficulties it is a bit more complicated, but if you play a couple of games on Monarch/Emperor, you will get a feel for the general speed of tech advancement, "tradeable" techs, and so such.

Important thing to remember is to adjust your tech slider once you are one or two turns away from discovery. Oftentimes, you will be able to lower your science expenditures and still get a tech next turn.

[mkqest]

Thats the great thing about this game. Everything is dependent on so many factors so that the rule of thumb trumps the ironclad rules.

Thanks for the advice. It does sound like I don't have enough workers if they are playing catchup and I have completed the initial round of city improvements.

[The Hack]

When I moved to Regent I was able to dominate by setting the governers to manage mood and emphasize production. I mined everything. I had the setting set so I had to ok all things built. When I moved to Monarch I still kept the governer to manage mood but assigned all workers and usually won also. I hadn't learned about the power of food production. Moved up to Emperor and could only win with lot's of rivers! So I had to learn to manage the cities took a few games but well worth it. I played with A.P. on but think it is unbailancing in favor of the human. Especially in the modern age when you hit peak production. So I went down to monarch to get a feel for the game without A.P. Much better game it makes your choices more important. Now I play Emperor and do ok usually. But the key to Emperor seems to be using your tribes traits, research choices, oportunistic trading, giving in to extortion, and wise wars with limited goals. So in short I think the key is to learn how to play without the governers even though it is tedious, especially when RR come along. I can't compare to all the expert players here but was able to have fun games at Monarch in about 6 months of playing by reading all the threads and trying the strategies with catastropic results sometimes. The game I learned the most from was a loss but it was my first game at Monarch that I lasted to the end. It was a Space race loss but I played through and learned the mechanics of not ruining your reputation. I saved it and went back much later and won a U.N. victory but didn't blow my reputation when I played it through the second time so when playing and you are at a criticle junction replay it with the different decisions and you can learn alot!
The game is for fun and as long as you have fun play on what ever level you enjoy! With whatever settings you like. And always try to learn from your losses.
I play C3C 115 beta. Can't wait for the official patch!
Good gaming to all!

[The Hack]

By the way I never looked at your game and think that the specific game advice was all covered very well and tried to be generic on how I evolved my game. LOL!