Expansionist Trait

[anteos]

What do people think of this trait in conquests.

Is it a bit of a duff trait. Once the map has been exposed and the civilisations settled, it has no further use. Whilst other traits function continuously?

I've just played my first game with this trait and it did allow me (via a scout) to obtain a large swathe of land. Expanding in the right places etc

[Jeem]

It's a bit too random for my liking.

It's very, very powerful in the hands of the AI though. Most MP games I play, the AI's with expansionist can run away with the game at the start simply due to finding settlers and cities. If the first opened hut is a settler or city, it's already got twice the economy and growth potential of the rest.

For the player, you usually know when you're going to win the game quickly when using expansionist. A couple of settlers/a city/4 techs and you're laughing. 4 maps and a couple of units means you've just wasted a trait.

It's also a double edged sword in that it opens up land quickly, so there's more chance of barbarians appearing.

[Tall Stranger]

There is a bit of debate about how good expansionist is.

Conventional wisdom is that it is more valuable at larger map sizes (more unknown to explore) and on pangaea maps. In addition to allowing you to figure out where to expand, it also helps you make earlier contact with other civs, expanding your options for tech/ lux trading. Later, you may also make a bundle off contact trading, assuming many of the civs still don't know each other. You also have a slightly better chances of getting good stuff from huts.

All in all, a pretty good trait. Better than some, not as good as others.

[anteos]

I've never had a settler or city from a hut? Is this only on the harder levels?

[CerberusIV]

Originally posted by anteos
I've never had a settler or city from a hut? Is this only on the harder levels?

IIRC it only happens if you are level or behind on number of cities - so it is more likely on the harder levels.

[Tall Stranger]

You also can't generate a settler from a hut if you either currently have a settler built or are building one in any of your cities.

[CerberusIV]

Originally posted by Tall Stranger
You also can't generate a settler from a hut if you either currently have a settler built or are building one in any of your cities.

Yes, although having one stacked in a build queue doesn't prevent you getting a settler from a hut.

[SirOsis]

This information is good to know. Before popping a hut I'll make sure to change my queue if building a settler.

[vmxa1]

Yes do change the built to a non settler before popping a hut, even if you are not expansionist. Switch back after you pop it.

[Spaced Cowboy]

I've given up on expansionist. I've also given up on huts and barbarians.

[Puma]

OMG!!! What a nice surprise. It makes so much sense now that I think back on some settler finds.

[pauli]

as i have a tendency to play on oversized maps, i'm something of a fan of expansionist civs. my last game... i knew all five other civs before more than two of them had made contact with each other. i also had a crazy tech lead early on (and again later on).

never got a single sgl despite getting nearly all techs first, though... but that's another issue.

[Sarxis]

Wow! That is a nice thing to know.

Now I know.

The one thing that annoys me about Expansionist is the increased cost when you get Explorers.

[Rhothaerill]

Originally posted by SirOsis
This information is good to know. Before popping a hut I'll make sure to change my queue if building a settler.

I'm in a PBEM with SirOsis and now you guys have gone and given it away to him.

On topic...I have found the expanionist trait to be more and more useful the more "experienced" I get playing this game. I played with expansionist a lot when I first began playing Civ3 a few years ago and bungled it badly (basically I played it like the AI does. ). I stopped playing expansionist civs and ranked the trait at the bottom of the first six traits.

But after a while I started realizing that early expansion with granaries, etc. and especially early information are the key to this trait, as much or more so than the better hut popping. A couple of scouts (not just one) can quickly uncover the map around you and find the other civs for early tech trading. This is even more crucial in Conquests where map and contact trading have been pushed back (rightly so in my opinion).

[Tall Stranger]

Originally posted by Rhothaerill

I'm in a PBEM with SirOsis and now you guys have gone and given it away to him.

Yeah, I know. I traded this information to him in exchange for Gems, Furs and 60gpt. (With the gpt bug still around, I'm rolling in dough )

On topic...I have found the expanionist trait to be more and more useful the more "experienced" I get playing this game. I played with expansionist a lot when I first began playing Civ3 a few years ago and bungled it badly (basically I played it like the AI does. ). I stopped playing expansionist civs and ranked the trait at the bottom of the first six traits.

But after a while I started realizing that early expansion with granaries, etc. and especially early information are the key to this trait, as much or more so than the better hut popping. A couple of scouts (not just one) can quickly uncover the map around you and find the other civs for early tech trading. This is even more crucial in Conquests where map and contact trading have been pushed back (rightly so in my opinion).

I definitely agree that Conquests has made this trait potentially more valuable if you're in the right spot (roughly in the middle of a pangaea, for example).