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Planning thread for the Blitz Mod: Conquests Version

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  • Planning thread for the Blitz Mod: Conquests Version

    I got my hands on conquests a week or so, and I've played it some, and I've had some fun so far. However, I think it's time to update the Blitz Mod. All of the work I've done on the various versions of the Blitz Mod has helped me to create a Blitz Mod philosophy which is:

    *Combat should be interesting, it should emphasize combined arms, strategy, and planning. While combat should involve some uncertainty, better preparation should lead to victory.
    *Culture should have an increased role in the game, and winning a cultural victory should take strategy.
    *Scarcity and limited resources will help make the choices in the game harder, and this will increase the strategic depth of Civ3.
    *Military aggression should have repercussions, and it shouldn't always be the easiest answer.
    *Units balance should be a priority.
    *Unique Units should be more powerful than normal units, but all UU's should have the same impact on the game.
    *The governments should all have strengths and weaknesses, and should exhibit balance as well.
    *Nothing should come easy.
    *Don't be afraid to experiment, and hopefully push the editors to its limits.

    That's what guides me, and I try to stay loyal to those principles. Here is the readme, broken down by editor tabs, of what I've finished editing so far. As I complete more sections I'll add them to the readme.

    __________________________
    Conquests Blitz Mod Readme
    __________________________

    General Settings Changes

    *Chance of Rioting is now 50%
    *Citizen value in shields is now 25
    *Minimum population for we love the king day is now 7
    *Future Tech Cost now 500
    *Minimum Research Time now 1 turn
    *Cities Needed to Support an Army now 3
    *Chance to Intercept Enemy Air Missions now 75%
    *Chance to Intercept Enemy Stealth Missions now 4%
    *Fortification Defense Bonus now 50%
    *Town Defense Bonus now 50%
    *City Defense Bonus now 100%
    *Metro Defense Bonus now 150%
    *Citizen Defensive Bonus now 12
    *Building Defensive Bonus now 12
    *Basic Barbarian is now a Swordsman
    *Advanced Barbarian is now a Knight
    __________________________

    Changes to Governments

    Anarchy
    0 police
    1/1/1 1 support
    0 draft
    tile penalty
    no building upkeep
    high war weariness
    1 worker rate
    0 assimilation
    catastrophic corruption
    conscript spies
    immune to build embassy

    Despotism
    2 police (4 citizens quelled)
    3/3/3 1 support
    2 draft
    tile penalty
    no war weariness
    1 worker rate
    forced labor
    0 assimilation
    rampant corruption
    regular spies

    Republic
    0 police
    0/0/0 3 support +20 free units
    1 draft
    high war weariness
    trade bonus
    2 worker rate
    paid labor
    2 assimilation
    problematic corruption
    regular spies

    Monarchy
    1 police (2 citizens quelled)
    2/3/4 2 support
    2 draft
    low war weariness
    2 worker rate
    paid labor
    1 assimilation
    problematic corruption
    regular spies

    Feudalism
    2 police (4 citizens quelled)
    4/1/0 3 support
    2 draft
    no war weariness
    1 worker rate
    forced labor
    0 assimilation
    communal corruption
    regular spies

    Democracy
    0 police
    1/2/3 2 support
    1 draft
    high war weariness
    trade bonus
    3 worker rate
    paid labor
    5 assimilation
    minimal corruption
    regular spies
    immune to propaganda

    Communism
    2 police (4 citizens quelled)
    2/2/2 1 support
    3 draft
    no building upkeep
    no war weariness
    4 worker rate
    cannot hurry
    3 assimilation
    communal corruption
    elite spies
    immune to investigate city

    Fascism
    3 police (6 citizens quelled)
    3/4/6 3 support
    3 draft
    no war weariness
    trade bonus
    3 worker rate
    forced labor
    0 assimilation
    nuisance corruption
    regular spies
    immune to tech steal
    __________________________

    Changes to Terrain

    *Removed defensive terrain bonus for all terrain types with a 10% bonus. Left all others unchanged.
    *Jungle changed to 1.1.0
    *Mountains changed to 0.2.0
    *Tundra changed to 0.1.0
    *Marsh changed to 0.2.0
    *Jungle move cost changed to 4
    *Mountain’s move cost changed to 4
    *Marsh's move cost changed to 3
    *Sea’s move cost changed to 2
    *Ocean’s move cost changed to 2
    *Ocean is now impassable to wheeled units
    __________________________

    Changes to Citizens

    *Scientist now come with Education
    *Tax Collector now provides 3 taxes and come with Currency
    __________________________

    Changes to Civilization Advances

    *Bronze Working, Masonry, Alphabet, Pottery, The Wheel, Warrior Code, and Ceremonial Burial cannot be traded
    *Horseback Riding is now an optional tech
    *Gunpowder now has Education as a prereq in addition to invention
    *Economics is now a required tech
    *Printing Press now provides a free tech to the first civ to discover it
    *Advanced Flight is now a required tech
    *Moved Mutual Protection Pacts from Nationalism to Espionage
    *Combined Communism and Fascism into a single tech called Totalitarianism, which provides police stations, and the governments communism and fascism
    *Created a new tech called antiquities, that has atomic theory as a prerequisit and provides museums
    *Amphibious warfare prerequisit is now combustion
    *Motorized Transport no longer requires electronics
    *Advanced Flight no longer requires motorized transport
    __________________________

    Changes to Combat Experience

    Conscript 3hp 35% retreat
    Regular 4hp 50% retreat
    Veteran 6hp 60% retreat
    Elite 9hp 75% retreat
    __________________________

    Changes to Difficulty Level

    *Military units now quell two unhappy citizens on all levels
    *Attack bonus against barbarians reduced to 100% for chieftain, and removed at all other difficulty levels.
    *All difficulty levels except for chieftain have one less default happy citizen (note: emperor and above start out with 0 default happy citizens)
    __________________________
    Last edited by korn469; December 17, 2003, 23:19.

  • #2
    here are some raw readme files, this is subject to changes, especially the units

    Changes to Units

    Non-combat Units
    Settler 0.0.1 50/3 {Colonist}
    *Colonist 0.0.2 50/3 Navigation
    Worker 0.0.1 10/1 {Engineer}
    *Engineer 0.0.1 10/1 (all terrain as roads) Steam Power
    Scout 0.0.2 10 (invisible, hidden nationality, free upkeep) {Conquistador}
    Chasqui Scout 1.1.2 10 (imc: hills, mountains) {Scout}
    Explorer 0.0.2 20 (invisible, hidden nationality, free upkeep) Astronomy
    **Conquistador 4.2.2 40 (invisible, all terrain as roads, blitz, zoc) horses Astronomy {Explorer}
    **Army 0.0.2|3 150 (blitz, zoc, pillage, radar +6 hp)

    Ancient Land Units
    Warrior 2.1.1 20 {Legion}
    Enkidu Warrior
    Jaguar Warrior 2.1.2 20 (imc: forest, jungle) {Warrior}
    Archer 3.1.1 20 {Bezerk}
    Bowman 3.2.1 20 {Archer}
    Javelineer 4.1.1 20 (enslave) {Bowman}
    Swordsman 4.2.1 30 iron {Medieval Infantry}
    Gallic Swordsman 5.2.2 40 iron {Swordsman}
    Immortal 4.2.1 20 (-1 hp) iron {Gallic Swordsman}
    Legion 4.2.1 30 (+2 hp) iron {Immortal}
    Spearman 2.2.1 20 {Pikeman}
    Hoplite 2.3.1 20 {Spearman}
    Impi 2.2.2 20 {Hoplite}
    Numideon Mercenary 3.4.1 30 (free upkeep) {Impi}
    Chariot 3.1.2 30 (wheeled, zoc) horses {Mounted Warrior}
    Three Man Chariot
    War Chariot 3.1.2 30 (wheeled, zoc, +2 hp) horses {Chariot}
    Horseman 3.1.3 40 (zoc) horses {War Elephant}
    Mounted Warrior 3.1.3 40 (blitz, zoc, +1 hp) horses {Horseman}

    Middle Age Land Units
    Longbowman 7.2.1 40 {Musketeer}
    Bezerk 12.4.1 60 (Amphibious, +1 hp) {Longbowman}
    Medieval Infantry 8.5.1 50 iron {Rifleman} Chivalry
    Pikeman 5.5.1 40 {Musketeer}
    Swiss Mercenary 5.8.1 40 {Pikeman}
    Musketman 11.11.1 60/1 saltpeter {Rifleman}
    Musketeer 14.14.1 60/1 saltpeter {Musketman}
    Knight 8.4.2 60 (zoc) iron, horses {Siphai}
    Ansar Warrior 9.3.2 50 (blitz, zoc) iron, horses {Knight}
    Keshik 8.2.2 40 (imc: mountains, hills, zoc) horses {Ansar Warrior}
    Rider 8.4.3 60 (zoc) iron, horses {Keshik}
    Samurai 8.6.2 60 (zoc) iron {Rider}
    War Elephant 14.10.1 80 (zoc) {Samurai}
    Cavalry 15.6.3 80/1 (zoc) horses, saltpeter {Panzer}
    Cossack 15.8.4 (zoc) horses, saltpeter {Cavalry}
    Siphai 22.6.3 80/1 (zoc) horses, saltpeter {Cossack}

    Industrial Era Land Units
    Guerrilla 4.1.3 15/1/3 10/2 (invisible, hidden nationality, lethal land bombardment, -3 hp, free upkeep, imc:all) Replaceable parts
    Marine 30.15.2 120/1 (amphibious, zoc) rubber
    Paratrooper 25.20.2 120/1 (10 air drop range, zoc) rubber
    Rifleman 15.15.2 80/1 {Infantry}
    Infantry 20.20.2 100/1 rubber
    Tank 40.16.3 140/1 (wheeled, blitz, zoc, cannot airlift) iron, oil {Modern Armor}
    Panzer 40.16.4 140/1 (wheeled, blitz, zoc, cannot airlift, +1hp, imc:forest) iron, oil {Tank}

    Modern Land Units
    *Special Forces 40.20.4 150 (amphibious, invisible, see invisible, 10 air drop range, blitz, -4 hp, imc:all) Computers
    Tow Infantry 25.25.2 120|1 Computers
    Mech Infantry 40.40.4 160/1 (wheeled, blitz, zoc, cannot airlift) iron, oil, rubber Miniturization
    Modern Armor 60.20.4 180/1 (wheeled, blitz, zoc, cannot airlift) iron, oil, aluminum

    Seige
    Catapult 0.1.1 8/1/4 40 (wheeled) iron {Cannon}
    Trebuchet
    Cannon 0.1.1 18/1/6 80 (wheeled) iron, saltpeter {Artillary}
    Hwacha 0.1.1 24/1/6 80 (wheeled) saltpeter
    Artillary 0.2.2 25/2/8 120 (helicopter transportable) iron
    Radar Artillary 0.2.3 30/2/5 160 (wheeled, blitz, cannot airlift) aluminum, oil

    Missile
    Cruise Missile 0.0.1 60 40/5/2 (leathal land, leathal sea, can load into Aegis Cruisers and nuclear subs) aluminum
    Tactical Nuke 0.0.1 180 10 aluminum, uranium
    ICBM 0.0.1 250 aluminum, uranium

    Ancient Naval Units
    Curragh
    Galley 2.2.4 30|2 (wheeled, sink in sea, sink in ocean) {Sloop}
    Dromon

    Middle Age Naval Units
    *Sloop 5.3.5 50 (sink in ocean, imc: sea) {Man-o-War} Astronomy
    Caravel 2.3.4 60|3 (-1 hp, sink in ocean, imc: sea) {Galleon}
    Carrack
    Galleon 2.3.5 80|4 (-1 hp, imc: sea, ocean) {Transport}
    Frigate 12.9.2 12/1/1 100 (all terrain as roads, blitz) {Ironclad}
    Man-o-War 16.12.2 12/1/1 100 (all terrain as roads, blitz)
    Privateer 8.2.7 40 (hidden nationality, imc: sea, ocean) Navigation

    Industrial Era Naval Units
    Ironclad 20.16.3 20/1/1 120 (all terrain as roads, blitz) iron, coal Steel {Battleship}
    Transport 2.5.8 100 (-1 hp, imc: sea, ocean) oil
    Battleship 48.38.3 30/2/2 240 (all terrain as roads, blitz) iron, coal, oil
    Destroyer 16.26.4 16/1/1 120 (all terrain as roads, blitz) oil {Aegis Cruiser}
    Submarine 16.6.3 120 (all terrain as roads, blitz, invisible, detect invisible)
    Aircraft Carrier 2.8.3 200|5 (all terrain as roads, blitz, radar) iron, rubber Advanced Flight

    Modern Naval Units
    Nuclear Sub 16.20.3 180|3 (all terrain as roads, blitz, invisible, detect invisible)
    Aegis Cruiser 25.35.4 25/1/1 160|2 (all terrain as roads, blitz, radar, detect invisible, *transport cruise missiles) aluminum, oil

    Industrial Era Air Units
    Fighter 5.5.2 25/6/2 120 (blitz, lethal sea bombard, *foot soldier) oil {F-15}
    Bomber 0.2.1 20/10/6 150 oil, rubber {Jet Bomber}
    Helicopter 0.2.3 0/6/0 100 oil, rubber

    Modern Air Units
    Jet Fighter 20.20.3 35/8/2 180 (blitz, radar, lethal sea bombard) aluminum, oil
    F-15 30.30.3 35/8/2 180 (blitz, radar, lethal sea bombard, precision strike, *foot soldier) aluminum, oil {Jet Fighter}
    *Jet Bomber 0.6.2 30/14/6 220 (blitz, radar) aluminum, oil Rocketry
    Stealth Fighter 0.1.2 32/12/4 250 (blitz, stealth, radar, precision strike) aluminum, oil, uranium
    Stealth Bomber 0.1.1 65/120/10 450 (stealth, radar, precision strike) aluminum, oil, uranium
    __________________________

    Changes to Diplomats and Spies
    *Build an Embassy cost 15
    *Investigate City cost 5
    *Steal Technology cost 8
    *Steal World Map cost 1
    *Plant Spy cost 45
    *Steal Plans cost 5
    *Initiate Propaganda cost 60
    *Sabotage Production cost 8
    *Expose Enemy Mole cost 60
    __________________________

    Changes to Culture

    In awe of
    Culture Ratio 5:1
    Chance of Successful Propaganda: 60%
    Initial Resistance Chance: 20%
    Continued Resistance Chance: 10%

    Admirers of
    Culture Ratio 3:1
    Chance of Successful Propaganda: 45%
    Initial Resistance Chance: 35%
    Continued Resistance Chance: 25%

    Impressed with
    Culture Ratio 5:4
    Chance of Successful Propaganda: 30%
    Initial Resistance Chance: 50%
    Continued Resistance Chance: 40%

    On par with
    Culture Ratio 4:5
    Chance of Successful Propaganda: 25%
    Initial Resistance Chance: 60%
    Continued Resistance Chance: 55%

    Unimpressed by
    Culture Ratio 1:3
    Chance of Successful Propaganda: 15%
    Initial Resistance Chance: 75%
    Continued Resistance Chance: 70%

    Dismissive of
    Culture Ratio 1:5
    Chance of Successful Propaganda: 5%
    Initial Resistance Chance: 90%
    Continued Resistance Chance: 85%

    Disdainful of
    Culture Ratio 1:10
    Chance of Successful Propaganda: 1%
    Initial Resistance Chance: 100%
    Continued Resistance Chance: 98%
    __________________________

    Changes to Improvements and Wonders

    Improvements
    Capital
    Palace 100/1/0 Center of Empire, +1 Happy

    Happiness
    Temple 60/1/1 +1 Happy (Religious)
    Coliseum 120/2/2 +2 Happy
    Cathedral 160/2/2 +3 Happy [Temple] (Religious)

    Economic
    Marketplace 100/0/1 +50% Tax Output, Increases Luxury Trade (Commercial)
    Bank 150/0/3 +50% Tax Output [Marketplace] (Commercial)
    *Stock Exchange 220/0/4 +50% Tax Output [Bank] (Commercial) The Corporation

    Trade
    Harbor 80/0/1 Allows Water Trade, Increases Food in Water (Commercial, Coastal)
    Air Port 160/0/2 Allows Air Trade, +50% Luxury Output 1 Pollution {Oil} (Commercial)

    Military
    Walls 20/0/0 +50% Defense, 12 Bombard Defense (Militaristic)
    Coastal Fortress 40/0/1 16 Naval Power, 12 Naval Bombard Defense {Iron, Saltpeter} (Militaristic, Coastal)
    Barracks 80/0/2 Veteran Ground Units (Militaristic) Warrior Code
    *Naval Base 120/0/3 Veteran Sea Units [Harbor] (Militaristic, Coastal) Astronomy
    *Airforce Installation 160/0/4 Veteran Air Units {Oil} (Militaristic) Flight
    SAM Missile Battery 120/0/2 Airpower 12 (Militaristic)

    Production
    *Mill 160/0/2 +25% Production, Must be Near a River; Engineering
    Factory 240/0/4 +50% Production, 2 Pollution {Iron}
    Manufacturing Plant 320/0/5 +50% Production, 1 Pollution [Factory] {Aluminum}
    Coal Plant 160/0/4 +50% Production, 3 Pollution [Factory] {Coal}
    Hydro Plant 240/0/4 +50% Production, Must be Near a River [Factory] {Iron}
    Solar Plant 320/0/4 +50% Production [Factory] {Rubber}
    Nuclear Plant 240/0/4 +100% Production, 1 Pollution, Must be Near Water, Can Explode or Meltdown [Factory] {Uranium}
    Offshore Platform 240/0/3 Increases Shields in Water, 2 Pollution (Coastal)

    Research
    Library 80/1/1 +50% Research Output (Scientific) Writing
    University 200/3/3 +50% Research Output [Library] (Scientific)
    Research Lab 240/1/4 +50% Research Output [University] (Scientific)

    Corruption
    Courthouse 80/1/1 Reduces Corruption
    *Newspaper 120/1/2 Reduces Corruption, Resistant to Propaganda [Library] Printing Press
    Police Station 180/1/2 Reduces Corruption, Reduces War Weariness [Courthouse]

    Growth
    Granary 60/0/1 Doubles City Growth Rate
    Aqueduct 100/0/1 Allows City Size Level 2
    Hospital 160/0/2 Allows City Size Level 3

    Pollution
    Mass Transit 200/0/3 Removes Population Pollution {Rubber}
    Recycling Center 200/0/3 Removes Building Pollution

    Cultural
    *Amphitheater 80/3/1 Literature
    *Opera 160/8/2 [Amphitheater] Music Theory
    *Museum 240/14/4 [Opera] Atomic Theory
    **Obelisk 0/2/0 cannot be built only appears through the Pyramids
    __________________________

    Wonders
    Happiness
    Hanging Gardens 300/4/0 3 happy, 1 happy in all cities expires with Steam Power {Ind}
    Oracle 300/4/0 [2x Temple] Doubles happiness of temples expires with Theology {Rel}
    Sistine Chapel 600/6/0 [2x Cathedral] Doubles happiness of Cathedrals {Rel}
    JS Bach's Cathedral 600/6/0 [2x Cathedral] 2 happy, 2 happy in all cities expires with Genetics {Rel, Con}
    Cure for Cancer 1000/8/0 [2x Research Lab] 6 happy, 2 happy in all cities {Sci}

    Economic
    Colossus 200/2/0 +1 trade in all trade producing squares expires with Mass Production {Ex, Com, Coastal)
    Wall Street 300/1/0 [4x Stock Exchange] Treasury Earns 5% {Com}

    Trade
    Great Lighthouse 300/2/0 [2x Harbor] Safe Sea Travel, +1 Ship Movement expires with Magnetism {Exp, Com, Coa}
    Magellan's Voyage [2x Harbor] 400/3/0 +1 Ship Movement expires with Nuclear Power {Exp, Com, Coa}
    Smith's Trading Company 600/4/0 Pays Maintenance for trade Installations {Com}

    Military
    Great Wall 200/2/0 Doubles combat vs. Barbs, Doubles City Defense expires with Metallurgy {Mil, Ind}
    Sun Tzu's Art of War 600/3/0 Barracks in every city on the continent expires with Motorized Transport{Mil}
    Leonardo's Workshop 600/3/0 Halves upgrade cost {Mil}
    Universal Suffrage 900/4/0 Reduces war weariness in all cities {Mil}
    Manhattan Project 800/2/0 [2x University] Allows all civs to build Nukes {Mil, Sci, Ind} Uranium
    Heroic Epic 200/4/0 Increased chance of leaders, Requires a victorious army expires with Military Tradition {Mil, Rel} (note: The Heroic Epic is now a great wonder)
    Military Academy 400/1/0 Build armies without leaders {Mil} (note: victorious army requirement removed)
    Pentagon 400/1/0 Build larger armies, requires 4 armies, requires a victorious army {Mil}
    Strategic Missile Defense 800/1/0 [5x SAM batteries] Decreased chance of missile attacks {Mil, Sci}
    Intelligence Agency 400/1/0 Allows spy missions {Mil, Sci}
    Battlefield Medicine 500/1/0 [5x Hospital] Healing in enemy territory {Mil}

    Production
    Hoover Dam 1200/3/0 gain hydro plant in every city on continent, must be near a river {Ind}
    Iron Works 400/1/0 +100% production, 4 pollution, requires coal and iron in city radius {Ind}

    Research
    Great Library 400/4/0 [2x Library] Gain any advances owned by two civs expires with Education {Sci}
    Copernicus's Observatory 400/4/0 doubles research output expires with Space Flight {Exp, Sci}
    Newton's University 500/5/0 [2x University] doubles research output {Sci}
    Theory of Evolution 600/6/0 +2 free advances {Sci}
    SETI Program 1200/8/0 [3x University] doubles research output {Sci, Exp}
    Apollo Program 500/3/0 build spaceship parts {Sci, Ind} Aluminum

    Corruption
    Forbidden Palace 150/1/0 reduces corruption {Exp, Rel}

    Growth
    Longevity 1200/8/0 [2x research Lab] city growth causes +2 pop {Sci, Exp}

    Pollution
    N/A

    Cultural
    Pyramids 200/4/0 gives an obelisk in each city on the continent expires with Monotheism {Ind, Rel}
    Shakespeare's Theater 400/16/0 [2x Opera] 2 happy, +50% Luxury Output
    United Nations 1200/15/0 Allows diplomatic victory {Exp, Com}
    __________________________

    Space Ship Parts
    SS Thrusters 600 Aluminum
    SS Engine 1200 Aluminum, Uranium
    SS Docking Bay 300 Oil, Rubber
    SS Cockpit 600 Aluminum
    SS Fuel Cells 300 Uranium, Rubber
    SS Life Support System 600 Aluminum
    SS Stasis Chamber 600 Aluminum
    SS Storage/Supply 300 Oil, Rubber
    SS Planetary Party Lounge 300 Oil, Rubber
    SS Exterior Casing 1200 Aluminum, Uranium
    __________________________

    Changes to Resources

    *All strategic resources set to have a disappearance rate of 900
    *Uranium's Appearance ratio changed from 100 to 80
    *Oil can now be in plains
    *Game can now be in jungle
    *moved appearance of uranium to atomic theory
    *moved appearance of aluminum to mass production
    __________________________
    Last edited by korn469; November 23, 2003, 07:37.

    Comment


    • #3
      Ok besides actually using the editor to make all of the changes, I need to look over the units again. My thoughts are this

      *no lethal land bombard, with 3-4-6-9 hitpoints a 1 hp unit is as good as dead, but in the spirit of combined arms players should need ground units
      *I need to do some more work on UU balance
      *I need to probably make armies more expensive in light of their new powers.
      *Just check everything one last time

      Some things I'm thinking of experimenting with
      *moving the luxury bonus from markets and giving it to stock exchanges
      *making either the first seven start techs untradable or making every ancient tech untradable. I think early tech trading and whoring disrupts the flow of the game, and I'd like to combat this some
      *add plauge to the Blitz Mod

      Comment


      • #4
        Hi Korn,

        I probably won't have any time to playtest the new version of your mod, but I'll try to partipate in the discussion of the new features. I'm especially interested in making 'cultural dominance' a distinctive strategy, as opposed to culture as a nice side-effect.

        Just one error in your readme: You don't have to list the Stock Exchange as a new building anymore. It has been here since PtW.

        Anyhow, good luck!
        "As far as general advice on mod-making: Go slow as far as adding new things to the game until you have the basic game all smoothed out ... Make sure the things you change are really imbalances and not just something that doesn't fit with your particular style of play." - WesW

        Comment


        • #5
          thanks lockstep, maybe when I get the blitz mod to a fairly final stage you can play a game or two for fun

          Comment


          • #6
            add lots of moderm units, like all thosewwii and others - ai does kool things when given lots of options that change frequently as a result of new techs.


            example - i modded the crap out of teturkhan, reassigning all those animations, creating a situation where beginning in early/mid industrial age thgimgs start hoppin in terms o units made available by techs. i did things like give fantasy modern uus to some of the added ai civs, and some units were only buildable for a couple of researh tech periods. thats ok, cause low upgrade price made it kool and ai friendly, and since the upgraded version was only marginally superior, so what? it felt more realistic, better for a almost modern era assault infantry, feprersented by the at animation, fight a wwi era machinew gunner, repped by the same named unit. i had to monkey w/ the tech tree to do this.

            in the mod i'm doing now, i plan to add some more techs to lengthen certain, esp the industrial, age. now i get all those kool napoleonic animations to monkey with. nice
            "Please don't go. The drones need you. They look up to you." No they don't! They're just nerve stapled.

            i like ibble blibble

            Comment


            • #7
              Ahhhh too much info at once. I don't know where to start looking at first.

              I'll just do a quick run down on some of my thoughts. I don't think that all those cultural buildings are necessary. They clutter the game with too many improvements to build. The only one I would recommend keeping is the Opera under Music Theory to add a bit more flavor to the game. The Pyramids should go back to it's old function of buidling a granary in each city instead of the obelisk. The Temple of Artemis sort of does a similar function except even better.

              I don't like the Engineer since it only adds more late game tedium. The Engineer will be getting things done faster only increasing the amount of time you have to deal with engineers. If I trusted automation more I would probably like the addition. Otherwise I don't.

              3-4-6-9 is too high for HPs if you ask me. If you're going to increase the levels then I would only do it to 2-3-5-7 at most. Battles will take longer with an increase in HP, and I think 3-4-6-9 is too much for that reason. Also, artillery will not be as useful. Currently an elite unit that is bombarded once in the early game will lose one HP making that unit 4/5. Now it would be 8/9 which doesn't give as much of an advantage to artillery. With 2-3-5-7 it wouldn't be such a bad ratio at 6/7 (better than both 4/5 and 8/9 imo).

              Get rid of the mill. There is enough production as is. The mill only increases the amount of improvements you can build, and improvements can be built quickly enough as is even in the middle ages.

              The Colonist is only redundant to the Settler.

              *Gunpowder now has Education as a prereq in addition to invention
              This I like. Although, the units before Gunpowder need to be equally balanced including UUs, which I still have to look at. Such as in current rules of Civ. The Berserker would be way too powerful with this rule in effect. Since it has 6 attack and the only defense against for a long time would be 3 at best (or 4 considering other UUs) it would be even more unbalancing than what I think it is now.

              As for the units I don't particularly like drastic changes in unit values. I don't like there being such large of a gap between units that are of the same time period.

              I like the changes to combat experience in regards to retreat bonuses.

              Just looking at Republic and Monarchy I would say Monarchy is extremely better than the Republic. Far better support, no ww, and lower corruption. I recommend addressing that.

              -------

              It all looks good, but a lot of getting used to (again). My main opinion is that there are too many drastic changes and toning them down a bit would be more beneficial. I would give more feedback, but there is just too much to look at it all at once. At any rate good job on all the work you've done.
              However, it is difficult to believe that 2 times 2 does not equal 4; does that make it true? On the other hand, is it really so difficult simply to accept everything that one has been brought up on and that has gradually struck deep roots – what is considered truth in the circle of moreover, really comforts and elevates man? Is that more difficult than to strike new paths, fighting the habitual, experiencing the insecurity of independence and the frequent wavering of one’s feelings and even one’s conscience, proceeding often without any consolation, but ever with the eternal goal of the true, the beautiful, and the good? - F.N.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by TechWins
                I don't think that all those cultural buildings are necessary. They clutter the game with too many improvements to build. The only one I would recommend keeping is the Opera under Music Theory to add a bit more flavor to the game.
                IMO, additional buildings that solely yield a large amount of culture (combined with the lower cultural value of happiness and science buildings) are everything BUT flavour. As I said, cultural dominance needs to be a distinctive strategy that also comes with opportunity costs.

                Originally posted by korn 469
                Cultural
                *Amphitheater 80/3/1 Literature
                *Opera 160/8/2 [Amphitheater] Music Theory
                *Museum 240/14/4 [Opera] Atomic Theory
                korn, you may remember our discussions about the appropriate prerequisite for Museums. I suggested Communism (because IMO cultural buildings should only come with optional techs), but you argued that Communism was already too attractive for the AI. Conquests may offer a solution to this dilemma: attach Museums to Fascism.
                "As far as general advice on mod-making: Go slow as far as adding new things to the game until you have the basic game all smoothed out ... Make sure the things you change are really imbalances and not just something that doesn't fit with your particular style of play." - WesW

                Comment


                • #9
                  TechWins,

                  Culture only buildings are a big part of the Blitz Mod so I'm going to leave them in. Though I'm thinking of changing the Amphitheater to 50/2/1, and then possibly changing the colliseum's cultural value to 1, so that Amphitheaters would still be the most potent culture producing improvement in the ancient era.

                  Point taken about engineers and colonists, I think I'll go with you and drop them.

                  As far as hit points go I'm not changing them. 3-4-6-9 is the first 2hp heal plateua. Anything lower means they only heal 1hp per turn. Because of that, anything between normal civ3 and 3-4-6-9 takes too long for units to recover imo. Also with the changes in hps vet and elite units are worth more, which coresponds directly to military building that are more expensive. Your point about bombard units being less effective doesn't hold true, since I've increased RoF.

                  I may or may not keep the mill. If I do I'll make it go obsolete with steam power.

                  Monarchy does have low war weariness (feudalism doesn't), and Republic out supports it untill you have either 11 towns or 7 cities. Though if republic is too weak I could always increase the free units from 20 to 25.

                  Lockstep,

                  Neat suggestion. I think I'll do that, except move Police Stations to Fascism and Museums to Communism (which to me makes more sense). I'm also thinking of giving democracy a small wonder called Bill of Rights that provides 2 happiness in all cities to counterbalance the power of both communism and fascism.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    (combined with the lower cultural value of happiness and science buildings)
                    I forgot to take that into consideration. So disregard my previous comments about taking the cultural buildings away.

                    *making either the first seven start techs untradable or making every ancient tech untradable. I think early tech trading and whoring disrupts the flow of the game, and I'd like to combat this some
                    I was thinking of the doing the same for my personal mod. Possibly keeping it as the early part of the ancient age throwing in a few middle ages techs. Truly representing the dark ages more by disallowing certain techs not to be traded.
                    However, it is difficult to believe that 2 times 2 does not equal 4; does that make it true? On the other hand, is it really so difficult simply to accept everything that one has been brought up on and that has gradually struck deep roots – what is considered truth in the circle of moreover, really comforts and elevates man? Is that more difficult than to strike new paths, fighting the habitual, experiencing the insecurity of independence and the frequent wavering of one’s feelings and even one’s conscience, proceeding often without any consolation, but ever with the eternal goal of the true, the beautiful, and the good? - F.N.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Korn, I'm currently drafting a little mod called 'Cultural Dominance'. The idea is to add culture only-buildings and (for aesthetic reasons) symmetric cultural levels, but besides that leave the epic game as it is. Some thoughts:
                      • I won't mess with cultural values of Great and Small Wonders (ranging from 1 to 8),
                      • I will slightly reduce the cultural values of scientific buildings and of the colosseum (but not mess with temples because players are used to the 5-turn border expansion),
                      • Amphitheatre, Opera and Museum will have cultural values of either 4/5/6 or 4/6/8 (so that the Museum is at most on par with Shakespeare's), with appropriately balanced shield costs.
                      So I'd be interested in your reasoning for amplifying the cultural value of the new buildings up to 14 in the blitz mod (which, at least to me, would strongly favor a 'cultural dominance' strategy), but also upping the culture of most Great Wonders (which somewhat counters said strategy).

                      P.S.: The reason I want to attach Museums to Fascism is to change as little as possible.
                      "As far as general advice on mod-making: Go slow as far as adding new things to the game until you have the basic game all smoothed out ... Make sure the things you change are really imbalances and not just something that doesn't fit with your particular style of play." - WesW

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        lockstep,

                        The reason I upped the cultural value of Opera's and Museums is for the following two reasons. My first reason is because of the age multiplier for cultural buildings. If you build a temple, amphitheater, etc in 500bc for example, it would produce 2 extra culture by 1500ad. A cultural improvement built in 1000ad wouldn't add any extra culture until 2000ad. Because of uneven turns per year, early cheaper structures can outproduce new cultural structures on a per shield basis if you build them quick enough. A museum costs three times as much as an amphitheater (before any changes). An amphitheater produces 1 culture per about 27 shields, whereas a museum produces 1 culture per about 17 shields. If an amphitheater has a one or two culture bonus from age it would go down to 20 and 16 shields per culture point. Does that make sense?

                        My second reason builds on that. If you get behind in the cultural race, it'd be hard to build your way out of it. Whoever gets the early lead could coast on in to a cultural victory. In my system a strong empire could turn to culture later on and surpass a civ that started strong culturally then switched to another strategy (without needing to burn down all of the enemy's cities).

                        As far as great wonders went, I tried to give them about an even amount of culture based on their shield costs, except for the "cultural" wonders.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          lockstep,

                          Also you may want to take the religious ability into account. If you don't change the stats on temples any at all then they provide 1 culture per 15 shields. That's one of the big reasons I nerfed them to an extent.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by korn469
                            Because of uneven turns per year, early cheaper structures can outproduce new cultural structures on a per shield basis if you build them quick enough ... Does that make sense?
                            If you build an amphitheater 'quick enough' - say, after beelining to Literature - your cities will be typically size 6 or lower, perhaps save your capital. Building a museum should typically take place in cities of about size 12 and with higher production (perhaps no factories yet, but at least some railroads). So, I'd be perfectly willing to spend more shields per culture point simply because I have more shields.

                            BTW, if you're really worried about the low shields-per-culture ratio of ancient buildings, you'd also have to make drastically changes to cathedrals (80 SPC) vs. culture-doubled temples (30 SPC) and universities vs. libraries.

                            In my system a strong empire could turn to culture later on and surpass a civ that started strong culturally then switched to another strategy (without needing to burn down all of the enemy's cities).
                            While I generally agree with you, I wouldn't want to enable a strategy to get your culture up and running really late - say, in the mid-industrial age - and still be able to surpass a civ that started their culture buildings much earlier. And I suspect that your Museum's massive cultural value does exactly that. OTOH, I need to do some more thorough calculations.

                            P.S.: I noticed this just now - what's the point of giving cultural value to anti-corruption buildings, at least gameplay-wise?
                            "As far as general advice on mod-making: Go slow as far as adding new things to the game until you have the basic game all smoothed out ... Make sure the things you change are really imbalances and not just something that doesn't fit with your particular style of play." - WesW

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              lockstep,

                              If you build an amphitheater 'quick enough' - say, after beelining to Literature - your cities will be typically size 6 or lower, perhaps save your capital. Building a museum should typically take place in cities of about size 12 and with higher production (perhaps no factories yet, but at least some railroads). So, I'd be perfectly willing to spend more shields per culture point simply because I have more shields.
                              also remember at this point it takes longer and longer for cultural expansion to occur

                              While I generally agree with you, I wouldn't want to enable a strategy to get your culture up and running really late - say, in the mid-industrial age - and still be able to surpass a civ that started their culture buildings much earlier.
                              this is only a worry if one civ stops building cultural buildings and the other doesn't. if a civ has a lead and continues to build cultural buildings it will be hard to catch up. also museums require both amphitheaters and opera's so that also slows done cultural laggards from catching up as quickly

                              I noticed this just now - what's the point of giving cultural value to anti-corruption buildings, at least gameplay-wise?
                              two reasons

                              1. I consider buildings such as courthouses etc, a powerful tool of political socialization, which in Civ terms (imo) is one of the components of culture. Because of that it should fall under culture buildings. Additionally it lowers the relative cultural value for science and happiness buildings.

                              2. It slows down war mongering. The cities you take over take longer to get back up to speed.

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