Barricades

[ZargonX]

Looking things over, it says that when a fortress is expanded with barricades, that units within it will exert a ZOC. Does this function like the old Civ2 ZOC in that enemy units will no longer be able to just run around them?

[MrWhereItsAt]

I imagine it would be the ZOC that already exists in Civ3 - you know, where armies etc can take a free shot at enemy units moving past them.

However, a confirmation from someone with the game would help...

[vmxa1]

I have not tried that yet, but I wanted to throw this out for Arrian:

Armies heal so fast now, it is too scary. I had a 3 elite horsemen army down to 1 hp (one crummy horse did it) and put in in the city. The city had a barracks and two turn later it was fully healed.
I do not know if that is the norm or I lost a turn, but either way...WoW.

I am going to have to check out a mil civ next.

[Inverse Icarus]

units in fortresses get free shots at units moving past them, and they call that ZOC, i assume it's the same thing.

i miss civ2's ZOC.

[Tiberius]

Originally posted by Uber KruX
i miss civ2's ZOC.

Yeah, me too. Even if not for units, but at least fortresses/barricades should have a civ2-style ZOC. Armies don't bypass fortresses just like that.

[EzInKy]

Originally posted by Tiberius


Yeah, me too. Even if not for units, but at least fortresses/barricades should have a civ2-style ZOC. Armies don't bypass fortresses just like that.

The forces manning the Maginot line didn't even get a passing shot when Germany bypassed them.

[Tiberius]

I'm not saying that you shoulnd't be able to bypass fortresses, but make it one tile away from it. It's not that I can't defend against the AI, but it greatly annoys me when it continuously enters my territorry and I can't do anything about it, except for declaring war.

[asleepathewheel]

barricades look fairly useful, just that they take so damn long to build. build a fortress and then a barricade on top of that?: I think the barricade takes 16 turns? I wish they had a cheaper early version that would keep the ai out. by the time I have worker power to barricade my lines, I don't really need to, due to army strenght.

[Willem]

Fortresses already had ZOC so there's not going to be any difference in that regard. What's changed it that units can no longer sweep past your position, they lose all movement until the next turn. Nice adition IMO.

[ZargonX]

What's changed it that units can no longer sweep past your position, they lose all movement until the next turn. Nice adition IMO.

Ah, that's what I was looking for! No more cavalry run-bys! Fortresses may finally be useful. Are building barricades that expensive, though? That may require some mod adjustment...

[asleepathewheel]

Originally posted by ZargonX


Ah, that's what I was looking for! No more cavalry run-bys! Fortresses may finally be useful. Are building barricades that expensive, though? That may require some mod adjustment...

I think a barricade is 16 turns. add in the fortress build time and thats a lot of turns.

[PogueMahone]

Does that mean AI units won't be able to pass BY the barrcade in one turn or THROUGH it?

[Inverse Icarus]

right, they lose all movement points on it, BUT when they get onto it, they get +100% defence. this does nothing but push the invasion back a turn, and get them 1 move CLOSER to your cities. a savvy player will drop 15 horsemen and 2 spears in that tile (with a defence of 4.2), and if it's on a hill (defence of 5), forget about attacking them.

so you're going to be stuck manning all the barricades with piles of units anyway. the only way i can even BEGIN to see the utility of these is with a large bombardment force waiting behind the lines, ready to bombard the hell out of the unattackable stack.

[RobC]

Originally posted by Uber KruX
right, they lose all movement points on it, BUT when they get onto it, they get +100% defence. this does nothing but push the invasion back a turn, and get them 1 move CLOSER to your cities. a savvy player will drop 15 horsemen and 2 spears in that tile (with a defence of 4.2), and if it's on a hill (defence of 5), forget about attacking them.

so you're going to be stuck manning all the barricades with piles of units anyway. the only way i can even BEGIN to see the utility of these is with a large bombardment force waiting behind the lines, ready to bombard the hell out of the unattackable stack.

...or if they allowed the option at least of modding it so you could build barricades without building forts first...

[Kull]

I first encountered these things in the Middle Ages scenario, where there's a line of three between England and Wales. I garrisoned the one in my territory, but the AI ignored the ones on his side, which were on hills and would have made my life miserable. Instead, they turned into a nice staging area for my invasion force.

This is a major AI problem IMHO, because if they fail to use these it's just one more advantage for the human player. It's also worth noting that I had a veteran spearman (D2) fortified inside my barricade (on grassland), and yet an AI Vet Swordsman (A3) wiped him out easily. That's not much of a sample size, but it definitely raised an eyebrow.