Fortress Europe

[AGRICOLA]

@Jerec

2) I suspect that doing what you suggest would allow stacking a/c with freighters and, depending on the range of the a/c, make it much safer to run the Atlantic convoys.

4) When playing I found that the crews on my freighters had little wish to be the targets of torpedoes. They lost little time in scuttling the rustbuckets and taking their chances in lifeboats.

@ McMonkey
Regarding the missing units in the civilopedia, check that you have a DESCRIBE file and that it is one with 80 entries in the @@UNIT_INDEX section. Using a MGE file limits you to 62 units in the civilopedia.

[McMonkey]

Thanks for the feedback Jerec

The AA will be set to NONE or disbanded

1) The Fleet Air Arm Aircraft should have been given the sub flag the same as the Maritime Bomber. I have been trying to figure out a way of getting US aircraft to Britain without using Carriers. I don't want to add airbase islands in the Atlantic as they will make the battle against the U-Boats too easy. I may just spawn the US aircraft in Northern Ireland.

2) The reason I gave the submarines the ability to attack aircraft was to prevent the player from simply stacking convoys under aircraft making them impossible to sink.
The alternative solution to this problem is to make all aircraft range 1. I am reluctant to do this as I like aircraft having to spend a turn outside of cities vulnerable to enemy fighters. Any good ideas welcome!

4) I thought there would be just enough money in the starting treasury to cover the deficit. I think I will just increase the treasury enough to cover the initial losses.

5/6) I am glad the U-Boats are a threat. I may need to tweak the cost of allied ships down, I don't want the game to be impossible, but I don't want a battle of the Atlantic with no allied losses. Some more move unit events should prevent the U-Boats from lingering near Ireland. If you spot any other areas where they lurk please let me know. I will also look at the rate at which the U boats are created.

7) Only Allied armour is impeded by defences. I thought it would be unfair to block Axis or Soviet mobile units as the AI will have no idea how to clear paths using engineers. It will also allow the Axis to counterattack vulnerable units trying to clear a path in defences as the defence value of that terrain is low and it is non stackable.

@AGRICOLA

2) Precisely. I know not many Allied aircraft would have been shot down by U-Boats but this is the only way I could prevent invulnerable stacks. I am sure that the Allies lost maritime aircraft for a number of different reasons so I am happy for the U-Boat attacks to represent this attrition, unless anyone can come up with a better idea.

4) Which is why I made disbanding Freighters impossible. Got to love the ToT rules file

Just to explain what is going on with this project at the moment. I asked Jerec to take a look at the game as it is now to get some input and initial feedback. It is not quite ready for a proper playtest but it is getting there. When I think I have ironed out all the major bugs and things are running smoothly I will be looking for some playtesters if anyone is interested. I have been very busy for the past couple of weeks but hope to get a lot of work done from tomorrow onwards.

[Jerec]

Originally posted by McMonkey
... I am reluctant to do this as I like aircraft having to spend a turn outside of cities vulnerable to enemy fighters. ...

Quite right. Wouldn't a house rule work? Something like, "Atlantic convoys cannot be covered by air units?"

7) ... and it is non stackable.

That makes up for the Axis ability. I will have a very warm RAF welcome for any stacked Germans monkeying around on the Normandy beaches.

2) Precisely. I know not many Allied aircraft would have been shot down by U-Boats but this is the only way I could prevent invulnerable stacks. I am sure that the Allies lost maritime aircraft for a number of different reasons so I am happy for the U-Boat attacks to represent this attrition, unless anyone can come up with a better idea.

Attrition?? You mean annihilation! Maritime bombers simply cannot be used in the Mediterranean at all for risk of being promptly torpedoed by the dominant Axis navy in those waters. I even lost a RAF bomber after it destroyed an Axis Panzer on the French coast.

4) Which is why I made disbanding Freighters impossible. Got to love the ToT rules file

Yep, McMonkey made sure to throw all life-rafts overboard. All the poor sailors can do now is pray.

[McMonkey]

OK then, you have convinced me. I will remove the U-Boats ability to attack aircraft and include a house rule forbidding the player from protecting ships with aircraft stacks. I don't like to make too many house rules but I can't see any other way around this one other than making all aircraft range 1 which would make air combat a bit dull.

[GhostOfDisco]

Well, as for the "aircraft protecting ships" thing, I could see that as "realistic," as ASW planes escorting ships and thus submarines avoiding them...

[McMonkey]

Yes it would be realistic in one sense but then the battle of the Atlantic would be very easy for the Allied player. I wanted it to be a struggle as it was in WWII.

[McMonkey]

Jerec
I have started making the fixes you suggested as well as ones on my list. The civlopedia entries were fixed by importing a ToT describe file as Agricola suggested. I have extended the Atlantic wall from the Spanish border up to the Coast of Denmark.

I figured out a way to change the terrain under cities to allow tanks into them. I realised that Allied tanks can't even enter Allied cities!

What I am going to do is cheat an engineer in every city and change terrain to plains (luckily this happens immediately). Then I will destroy the engineers. It is a bit of a lengthy task but I feel it is essential. Unfortunately all cities were built on town terrain which I later decided to use as defences

[Jerec]

Originally posted by McMonkey
Jerec
I have started making the fixes you suggested as well as ones on my list. The civlopedia entries were fixed by importing a ToT describe file as Agricola suggested. I have extended the Atlantic wall from the Spanish border up to the Coast of Denmark.

It might not exactly be historical, but this will definitely force the player to confront the defences terrain in his European amphibious invasion.

I figured out a way to change the terrain under cities to allow tanks into them. I realised that Allied tanks can't even enter Allied cities!

Yep. My heavy tanks produced in England were pot shots for Axis bombers that stormed England on the second turn, since they couldn't hide in cities.

What I am going to do is cheat an engineer in every city and change terrain to plains (luckily this happens immediately). Then I will destroy the engineers. It is a bit of a lengthy task but I feel it is essential. Unfortunately all cities were built on town terrain which I later decided to use as defences

This conversion is very essential. Previously, armour was next-to-useless; I was actually considering changing all armour production to infantry production.

When will the patched version be ready?

[Jerec]

And before I forget, what was your estimation on how much each Lend-Lease will bring in cash wise? 100-150 apiece? After my first 6 Lend Lease arrived, I was barely able to break even, with just enough cash to last one more turn.

The barbs are the Neutrals, correct? Hex-edited to be allied with everyone?

[McMonkey]

Ah, when I tested before the revenue for Lend Lease to Glasgow or Belfast was about 200 gold. Just tested again and they are only yielding 90-100! Not sure what has changed. Maybe I gave the Allies a tech that reduced gold payouts when I was sorting out the city/people styles. I will need to check that out! Should be able to fix it by swapping some techs around. I could just double the number of traders produced, though this will just make the Freighter problem worse.

The Neutrals are a proper nation, there are no barbarian cities.

I have converted the terrain under all cities except the Axis. It did not take as long as I thought. I may leave some key Axis cities with defences to slow down the Allied advance (IE Calais/Cassino etc...)

The patched up version should be ready tomorrow. I will e-mail you the new rules/describe and save as soon as they are ready.

[McMonkey]

Thinking about it, I could change the Neutrals to barbarian cities. This would free a space for another civ, such as Italy, Romania or Vichy France? I will have a think about that.

[Jerec]

Originally posted by McMonkey
Ah, when I tested before the revenue for Lend Lease to Glasgow or Belfast was about 200 gold. Just tested again and they are only yielding 90-100! Not sure what has changed. Maybe I gave the Allies a tech that reduced gold payouts when I was sorting out the city/people styles. I will need to check that out! Should be able to fix it by swapping some techs around. I could just double the number of traders produced, though this will just make the Freighter problem worse.

You might want to try the idea MacGalleo worked out on page 2- have some immobile barb "port" unit that the Lend Lease unit (probably a ship in this case) attacks, triggering an event when the ship is destroyed that gives a solid, fixed amount of money. Say, 200 g. The barbs would be allied to all civs but the Allies, to make sure that Axis bombers don't destroy the "port."

[McMonkey]

Interesting idea, but whats to stop other allied units from attacking the "port"?

If I were a sneaky player (which I'm not ) I would simply send my bombers to repeatedly attack the port for unlimited funds. Or have I missed a key factor?

Or is the loss of the Lend Lease the trigger, in which case why wouldn't the Allies get cash every time a U-Boat sinks a Lend Lease ship?

[Jerec]

An example-

@IF
UNITKILLED
unit=Freighter
attacker=Barbarians
defender=Allies
@THEN
CHANGEMONEY
receiver=Allies
amount=200
@ENDIF

Only if the Lend Lease ship is killed will the Allies recieve cash, and only if the Lend Lease kills itself against a barb unit. Since you haven't used the barbs at all yet, it should work with no loopholes. Just make sure to ally the barbs with all civs except the Allies. And make sure to give the Lend Lease 1 attack point, so it is actually able to attack.

Note, the attacker and defender in the example event might have to be switched around to make it trigger.

[McMonkey]

I will test it out. If it works it will certainly solve a few problems! Thanks for taking the time. Fingers crossed.