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  • Scenario art

    I'm (slowly) working on gathering graphics and ideas for a fantasy scenario.

    There are many graphic collections and scenarios to raid, um, borrow, units from, with or without modifications, but the problem is putting it together in a way that works well.

    This is sort of a "Crisis of the Empire/Kingdom" scenario, so there is definately going to be a heavy war element.

    Inspired by Hannibal's War (although the idea has been used elsewhere as well, it is the scenario that introduced me to it), "technology" represents various events more than true research, as this seems to allow for the feel I want without eliminating that side of things.

    Of those interested in medieval/fantasy era scenarios, what unit designers would you suggest using for art?

    My original, prior to looking into the creations of others, basis is strongly tied to the Master of Magic and Midgard scenarios in terms of art style, though there may be far better choices.

    Questions, comments?

    I'm not sure exactly on theme or civilizations at this point, so my first priority is to figure out the "easy" part, the art. Easy in the sense, more "this looks good' and less complicated thinking ("work" in other words).

  • #2
    Re: Scenario art

    Originally posted by Elensar
    I'm (slowly) working on gathering graphics and ideas for a fantasy scenario.
    Excellent news! (apart from the "slowly" )

    I'm not sure exactly on theme or civilizations at this point, so my first priority is to figure out the "easy" part, the art. Easy in the sense, more "this looks good' and less complicated thinking ("work" in other words).
    I would recommend to know what you want first (even if determining it is more "work" ) and only then go looking for the requested units: if you define your needs, people will be able (and willing) to help, but if you keep too abstract, then you might well be on your own, and then needing to do the work twice because the units which will work in the scenario are not those for which you found the graphics!

    But that's just my opinion, so do as you like!
    Ankh-Morpork, we have an orangutan...
    Discworld Scenario: http://apolyton.net/forums/showthrea...8&pagenumber=1
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    • #3
      Well, the "Work" part is things like "Okay, the Kingdom of (Name) is ruled by King (Name)..." That's fun in a way, but I don't want to do it as much as I want to look at pretty pictures. : p (I may have some files somewhere listing more detailed ideas along those lines, but they may be lost. If I find them I'll post them.)

      Regarding what kind of graphics, this is the current list of sorts...

      Swordsmen (human)
      Swordsmen (elven)
      Dwarves (standard infantry)
      Dwarves (elite/heavy infantry)
      Archers (human)
      Archers (Elven)
      Spearmen (human)
      Light Cavalry (human)
      Medium Cavalry (human)
      Knights (human)
      Cavalry (elven)
      Orcs (standard)
      Orcs (horde)
      Orcs (defenders)
      Siege equipment (human)
      Siege equipment (orcish/Dark)
      Hero units (varies by race)

      Note: "Medium" is something like the Rohirrim in the various LotR scenarios. Knights are a more iffy element.

      This is set in what if on Earth would be roughly the time of the Crusades or earlier, so no full plate stuff (though cataphracts may be very fitting)

      I am not at all sure what to do regarding settlers, and diplomats are not a part of this scenario.

      And yes, slowly is not so good, but I'm also working on other things, though none of them can't be put on hold if this takes interest.

      This is not LotR, but strong influences come from it (mostly from the Silmarilion and thusly the Dagor Bragollach scenarios)

      Various "elite" units (Royal Guard, Rangers, etc.) are also desired but I don't have a clear enough idea what I'm designing yet. That part will come as graphics that make something seem appealing to include come up.

      Incidently, does anyone have any (or all) of these three scenarios?

      Heptarchy: The Conquest of the Saxon Kingdoms (designer: John Mavin)
      The Holy Immortals (same)
      The Fall of Beleriand (designer: Johan Thelander)

      I used to have at least the first two, but my computer died a while back and I lost those files, among others.

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      • #4
        Just thought of this while editing some unit art already possessed .

        Most of us with Multiplayer Gold (or whichever earlier version, if any, had Masters of Magic Jr.) have seen the Phantom Warriors unit. Its not exactly a marvel of artistic awesomeness.

        For some reason, I decided to try and use that as the "framework" behind which I would color and mold to create a living sword-and-shield warrior in what appears to have been chainmail.

        Well, with the (indirect) assistance of Fairline, to produce realistic appearing chainmail (I'm just...staggered..at how good it looks. Why can't the standard game have graphics this impressive?), the result, including a shield borrowed from a unit by David Morovan (Holy Wars scenario) as the existing one doesn't quite fit...the effect is very nice.

        However, its also nothing like my work.
        For those interested, I can save it (and my other recolored and patched together "creations" and post the file, size permiting here, to show off the best I can "create". I may wind up using units directly created by others, or a mix of that and my editing. Opinions desired.
        Many, many, many thanks to the designers who actually can make unit art.

        Note, incidently: As this stands, the scenario is designed for Multiplayer Gold, though as the only actual work beyond ideas scattered here and there is really unit art, I have no desire to commit to using it over ToT or vice-versa.

        Size aside, unit art seems to work close enough to the same way that it isn't urgent to decide. Yet.

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        • #5
          Try Curt's Bitterfrost series for a huge top quality fantasy gfx collection, ranging from units to people gfx.

          Try Catfish's site as well for excellent LOR/fantasy graphics.

          As for the horsemen i think that Knights Templar or Hospitaler would be far more fitting than Cataphracts.

          Follow Curt's signature for the Bitterfrost series, but ,inexcusably i might add i, i currently lack Catfish's Cave adress.
          "Military training has three purposes: 1)To save ourselves from becoming subjects to others, 2)to win for our own city a possition of leadership, exercised for the benefit of others and 3)to exercise the rule of a master over those who deserve to be treated as slaves."-Aristotle, The Politics, Book VII

          All those who want to die, follow me!
          Last words of Emperor Constantine XII Palaiologos, before charging the Turkish hordes, on the 29th of May 1453AD.

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          • #6
            Catfish's Cave: A truly excellent Civ2 TOT site.

            Check out his links to the low CPU usage patches for MGE and TOT. They really work!


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            • #7
              In no particular order.

              Curt's Bitterfrost scenarios are very nice, including the art, but I don't think it quite matchs what I'm thinking of visually (though it works wonderfully for his scenarios)

              Catfish's art, similarly, does not match what I'm imaging visually (its beautiful all the same though), and is hard for me (as someone who doesn't quite rate amateur status at unit creation, as opposed to editing) to fine tune.

              I'm not sure about Templars/Hospitalers vs. Cataphracts for the heavier cavalry. I may not even really have it, other than some Royal Guard type unit.
              Medium Cavalry after all is basically "the knights of William the Conquerer".

              My own "creation", the result of some paitence and other people's creativity. My sincerest thanks to Fairline and the MoM scenario designer.

              Last edited by Elensar; April 29, 2007, 22:11.

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              • #8
                Catfish cave:


                If it havn't been pointed out yet; try Favoured Flight's Lord of the Rings scenarios:
                "Peace cannot be kept by force.
                It can only be achieved by understanding"

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                • #9
                  Favored Flight's units are very nice, although they don't quite reflect what I'm looking for (very close, I think, so the artist, if he's not busy.)

                  Closest matches:

                  Eowyn, Gondorians, Gimli, Legolas Rohan H. Cav, Theoden, Uruk-Hai (maybe?).

                  Not quite good (but nicely drawn all the same)
                  Archers, Elven Archers, Faramir, Goblins, Orc Archers, Orcs, Rangers, Rohirrim Axe, Warriors

                  This is something of an "off the top of my head" judgment call on the Return of the King's scenario art, but for those interested in fine-tuning my "this sounds good" list, those are the closest matches and the things that have a style that, however beautifully drawn, doesn't work with me personally for my scenario.

                  I've attempted (with success everywhere but the head) to modify the ranger part of Harlan's LotR scenario, how do I share the image of that and my Warrior edit for the site? In a message, I mean.

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                  • #10
                    Save the file as a PNG and attach using Browse...

                    Some screenshots of what you are trying to do would help. They do say that a picture paints a thousand words
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                    • #11
                      You only need to use a png if you're using Test of Time's 15-bit colour palette; if your unit is for mge, save as a gif and attach to your post as Werd says (there's an 'attach file' option a little bit below the text box you type a message in which allows you to browse your HD for the unit gif via th 'choose' button)
                      http://sleague.apolyton.net/index.ph...ory:Civ2_Units

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                      • #12
                        Most of this is "my work" in only a very loose sense, but its an example of what I've done on my own with what I've downloaded so far.

                        In order of left to right:

                        (Human) Warrior, Elven Warrior, heavily armored Guardsman, Huscarl, female horsewoman, ranger (light colored shirt), ranger (darker colored shirt)

                        Last edited by Elensar; April 30, 2007, 15:23.

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                        • #13
                          Nice work -
                          I can see you have this one thought out!
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                          • #14
                            You seem to have a very specific idea of what you want your units to look like, but I'm not sure what you mean with the style.

                            Those 7 units you attached are drawn in 4 very different styles, while FavouredFlight's units all have a similar style...

                            The 2nd, 3rd and 4th unit of yours are based on units made by Erwan, though. Have you seen his entire collection?

                            Are you also using units from the MoM and Midgard scenarios? Have you had a look at the extra graphics library for FW as well? There are a few more units there in a similar style.
                            Civilization II: maps, guides, links, scenarios, patches and utilities (+ Civ2Tech and CivEngineer)

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                            • #15
                              Basically units that I can put next to each other and feel are more or less compatible. Mixing recolored Standard Civilization units with Favoured Flight's units with Master of Magic units would feel a little off. I truly admire FF's units, or those in Bitterfrost, but what seems to work for me is closer to Fairline's work.
                              I know that my posted things hardly fit a true style, but it was the only word that came to mind at the time.

                              Yes, I've seen Erwan's collection. Some of it is very nice, others of it not so much (to me). But I've worked on a few different twists with the spear holding warrior models and some are posted here because I like the effects, though its really his work with different colors at most.

                              I've been tempted to use Midgard and Master of Magic (the first unit, on the left, is an extensively tinkered revision of the Phantom Warriors unit from MoM), but its not working out smoothly. May improve with effort, may not. As other possibilities are worked on and modified as desired, I'll show them to see what people think.

                              Extra graphics library? I've downloaded a generous number of different fantasy and medieval scenarios from MPG, but I'm not sure I know what you mean.

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