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The Green (peace??) free-for-all succession game

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  • The Green (peace??) free-for-all succession game

    As discussed in the Revival Game thread... a semi-silly rules game for your consideration.

    - Free-for-all Succession Game format.
    --- The last player may not play again.
    --- The previous player must allow 36 hours before they step in.
    --- i.e. if A plays and then B plays, A must wait to allow any possible C to pick up the game, but if no-one does then A can play after the 36 hours are up.
    --- Post here when you grab the game and ideally play your (initially 20) turns - or as far as you get in 3 days if things go badly for you - and then post your current save
    --- Attached is a 2.42 custom (80x80) map, deity, raging hordes start. We will stay with 2.42 unless someone only has MGE (n.b. MGE can be obtained cheap these days, and there is a conversion to MGE available at civfanatics... hint, hint ).

    SPECIAL RULES... please read carefully

    The underlying concept is... respect for the environment, animal rights, avoidance of techs and improvements that are, or could be, bad for the environment. When in doubt, the rules below will be interpreted with this concept in mind.

    (disclaimer: The "Greenpeace" reference was selected because it makes for a good play on words. I am not commenting on the merits of Greenpeace the organization through this idea.)

    So...

    1. No building cities with the following in the radius: Whales, Pheasant, Silk, Buffalo, Furs, Muskox, Ivory. Fishing for subsistence is permitted (but no mass netting - see below re: Harbours being banned). If a city is accidentally built with one of these specials in the radius, it must be starved down to size 1 and disbanded by building a Settler.

    2. No terrain improvement or terraforming with the exception of roads, and RR along the shortest path between cities. No mining or irrigation allowed. No fortresses or airfields. Pollution clean-up is OK.

    3. Mounted units (horse slavery!) are barred. This includes Camel units. Nuclear Missiles are barred, as are Carriers, Battleships and Submarines following the discovery of Nuclear Power.

    4. The following city improvements may NOT be built: Factory (pollution), Manufacturing Plant (pollution), Power Plant (pollution), Nuclear Plant (waste), Harbour (mass netting - bad for dolphins), Offshore Platform (drilling offshore=bad), Superhighways (car culture=bad), Supermarket (sells product of factory farms), Research Lab (animal testing).

    5. The following city improvements MUST be built in preference to other improvements once available: Solar Plant, Mass Transit.

    6. The following Wonders may NOT be built: Hoover Dam (hugely disruptive to local ecosystem), Manhattan Project (should be obvious why not), Cure for Cancer (animal testing!).

    7. The following advances must be delayed as long as possible (in practice, this means that where they show up on a list of choices, they may not be selected unless no other choices are available. We don't have to guide our research to avoid their prerequisites): Steam Engine, Railroad, Industrialization, Corporation, Refrigeration, Refining, Combustion, Automobile, Nuclear Fission, Nuclear Power, Plastics. Technology advances may be stolen, but once Spies are available, they must be directed to steal an advance OTHER THAN the ones noted above. Where the AI only knows the barred advances noted above, a tech cannot be stolen.

    8. Spies may not poison the water supply or plant nukes. When destroying city improvements, the primary target MUST be an offending improvement (one listed above in point #4.). Once all offending improvements are destroyed in the city, other improvements can be targeted.

    9. Where an AI city is captured, all offending improvements must be sold, starting immediately. Terrain improvements (except as noted above) must be pillaged within 10 turns. If an offending terrain special is in the radius, it must not be worked. Forbidden units captured or bribed must be disbanded (set free).

    Win could by conquest or by spaceship, whichever seems most expedient

    Save to follow.
    Last edited by Six Thousand Year Old Man; November 26, 2005, 19:27.
    "I'm a guy - I take everything seriously except other people's emotions"

    "Never play cards with any man named 'Doc'. Never eat at any place called 'Mom's'. And never, ever...sleep with anyone whose troubles are worse than your own." - Nelson Algren
    "A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic." - Joseph Stalin (attr.)

  • #2
    Savegame

    And the save...

    n.b. please be careful not to build our capital near a prohibited special, it would be quite vexing to have to starve and disband it
    Attached Files
    "I'm a guy - I take everything seriously except other people's emotions"

    "Never play cards with any man named 'Doc'. Never eat at any place called 'Mom's'. And never, ever...sleep with anyone whose troubles are worse than your own." - Nelson Algren
    "A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic." - Joseph Stalin (attr.)

    Comment


    • #3
      Okay, I have grabbed the save and played 20 moves, so will post the next save for whoever's next.

      Here is my summary:

      4000 Little Bighorn founded immediately, since no forbidden specials are within sight.

      3750 The other settler scouts another allowable site and founds Wounded Knee. Warrior produced and starts exploring.

      3700 Alphabet

      3400 hut - archer

      3300 Code of Laws

      We are now known to be on a small island with only room for two more good cities. Whales prevent settling in the best site to the northeast. So it's time for Map Making, to get triremes to settle somewhere new.

      2900 settlers

      2800 Cedar Creek founded to the southeast to catch some fish.

      2750 Settlers

      2560 Map Making

      2350 Slim Buttes to take care of the northeast section of our home island. Must avoid two whales. A connecting road was built by the settler while in transit.

      2200 Settlers

      2150 Trireme produced, settler and warrior will hop aboard to look for new places to settle. Some land is within view to the southeast.

      2100 Ceremonial Burial

      2050 Hut found in the New World, a barb horseman was found within. So much for my warrior.

      2000 The barb horseman runs away. Load up lucky warrior and continue scouting with the trireme around what appears to be a small island.

      Monarchy will be coming in a few turns. Another settler and trireme are being produced as well as a barracks. Well that's it for the starting 20 moves.
      Attached Files
      Last edited by solo; November 26, 2005, 21:25.

      Comment


      • #4
        (I had prepared a starting map analysis, but Solo beat me to it)

        I'll take a look at Solo's save and see if I can do any further damage.

        Comment


        • #5
          Nice start solo... you are forgiven for playing 40 turns, as opposed to 20 I should have specified 20 turns to start. Once everyone's had a turn, we may want to drop to 10 turns.

          Good use of available terrain without violating the rules.

          One question - why isn't Cedar Creek working the rivered forest as opposed to the nonrivered forest?
          "I'm a guy - I take everything seriously except other people's emotions"

          "Never play cards with any man named 'Doc'. Never eat at any place called 'Mom's'. And never, ever...sleep with anyone whose troubles are worse than your own." - Nelson Algren
          "A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic." - Joseph Stalin (attr.)

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Six Thousand Year Old Man
            I should have specified 20 turns to start. Once everyone's had a turn, we may want to drop to 10 turns.

            Good use of available terrain without violating the rules.

            One question - why isn't Cedar Creek working the rivered forest as opposed to the nonrivered forest?
            Oops, on two counts. I was playing too quickly to notice and worrying too much about making sure your rules were not being violated.

            Next time I play, I will use only 5 turns to help compensate and diligently use rivers as requested!

            I actually like playing with these rules quite a bit. It makes things very interesting.

            Comment


            • #7
              Looking at the start and playing a little map analysis, I had figured out five Resource Seed possibilities. Looking at Solo's 2000BC save it quickly narrows to one: 8. Actually, as soon as you slid down the river to the Fish it becomes pretty easy, what with the shortage of huts.

              At 2000BC we have 4 cities, with a Settler in a ship exploring a small island to the southeast and more in production. This far into the game our research rate is starting up into the double digits, and the special rules make it seem like we will have major trouble with research and wonder-building. The obvious answer to this is ICS, so my initial moves were to accelerate settler building and city founding. Planting the capital on Plains, while advantageous because we cannot irrigate those tiles, does have the disadvantage that when we get to Monarchy it will not add a third food.

              The other looming issue is the problem with building wonders without caravans. Cities will have to be started well in advance of anything we really want. Since I don't understand what Solo was planning with the capital building a Barracks (we have no military techs now or in the near future to build anyway, and we might as well go for SunTzu or build a few Barracks close to our front lines), I switched it to LightHouse and traded food for shields while I worked toward Pottery. The rest of the cities are switched to Settler building but also shuffled a bit for more beakers.

              1900BC: Three Forks on southeast island; res=10 turns
              1850BC: Stony Lake on southwest promontory; res=9 turns
              1800BC: found land northward
              1700BC: Archer starts exploring northern island
              1650BC: missed Oedo by one turn; Hut yields supported Legion, so no one is nearby but someone has Iron Working.
              MONARCHY, start Pottery; res=10 turns
              1550BC: uhoh, Egypt starts Colossus; build Settlers, res=12 turns
              1500BC: Revolt
              1450BC: Monarchy, KillDeer, res=9 turns
              1350BC: Bear Paw on northern island
              1150BC: several cities grow, reshuffle, res=7 turns
              POTTERY; start Bronze; res=9 turns
              1100BC: Big Mound east of Bear Paw; res=8 turns
              1000BC: We've got 16 gold and 35 beakers; next tech is 105b. We added 5 cities, lowered the research rate, got halfway to HG, and explored the northern island, which seems to lead elsewhere.

              Quick question to the dungeon-master: wouldn't planting forests be enviro-friendly? The northern part of the home island could really use some, and the plains are just wasted space...

              And the save:
              Attached Files
              Last edited by Elephant; November 27, 2005, 16:02.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Elephant

                Quick question to the dungeon-master:
                cool, haven't been called that in a while

                wouldn't planting forests be enviro-friendly? The northern part of the home island could really use some, and the plains are just wasted space...

                And the save:
                Ahh, but wouldn't planting forests be harmful to the indigenous herds of gazelle that inhabit the plains?

                And wouldn't planting forests be just another means of changing the virgin lands to suit our crass human needs?



                Good progress. This may be easier than expected!
                "I'm a guy - I take everything seriously except other people's emotions"

                "Never play cards with any man named 'Doc'. Never eat at any place called 'Mom's'. And never, ever...sleep with anyone whose troubles are worse than your own." - Nelson Algren
                "A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic." - Joseph Stalin (attr.)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hey whatever happened to the rest of this game? you guys give up?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Umm, I think we've just begun playing it!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      If no-one else joins I will probably play some turns on Wednesday or Thursday... the early part of the week looks pretty messy.
                      "I'm a guy - I take everything seriously except other people's emotions"

                      "Never play cards with any man named 'Doc'. Never eat at any place called 'Mom's'. And never, ever...sleep with anyone whose troubles are worse than your own." - Nelson Algren
                      "A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic." - Joseph Stalin (attr.)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Well, look at what my fellow Civ players have gotten themselves into! This game looks interesting I will have to join in later (when grad school is finally over for the semester I suspect).

                        Things appear to be going well, but I have a few rules that seem to be a natural addition to our tree-hugging succession game.

                        1) Once we can trade (via bio-diesel trucks of course), should we allow ourselves to trade in Oil, Uranium, and Hides? No I say! It is all Beads, Wool, and Wine for us!

                        2) Should we be more hostile towards our strip-mining adversaries? Should we demand tribute for environmental reclaimation? Reparations for environmental suffering?

                        3) Should we allow our cities to be grouped closely together creating a great urban sprawl? Or should we force all subsequent cities at least X spaces apart? (current cities excluded of course)

                        4) Should we avoid attacking the native-peoples (barbarians) when possible, and

                        5) interrupting their peaceful, nature-loving way of life (no huts).

                        6) Should we really allow railroads to be built? I mean think of how the train noises will disrupt the mating rituals of the various animals near the train tracks!

                        Ok I better stop before I suggest that researching technology takes us away from our natural state of ignorance and thus seperates us further from nature

                        StuporMan
                        Man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much - the wheel, New York, wars and so on - whilst all the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent than man - for precisely the same reasons.

                        StuporMan's Supply and Demand Calculator
                        Supply and Demand Calculator 2.0.1 Beta Now loading savegames!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          The restriction on Hides is a must (plus Wool, Dye, and Silk?). We could always claim the Oil was bubbling out of the ground (desert and glacier?), but you have a point on Uranium (but then, how shall we fuel our emissions-reducing Nuke Plants?). I didn't think we were hugging "native peoples", in fact most of these restrictions just make life harder for all peoples, so that kind of goes against the logic (?) of the theme.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I am not really attached to any of the rules I proposed. I was just tossing out all of the needlessly complex rules I could that were remotely related to the environment. I based my proposed rules on WWLSD (what would Lisa Simpson do?)

                            I will admit I probably took things a bit far, and I even acknowledged that at the end of my post with the bit on technology. But hey, it is fun to come up with overly complicated nonsensical rules.

                            I still have yet to look at any of the saves for this game, but I hopefully will soon. This game looks interesting.

                            StuporMan
                            Man had always assumed that he was more intelligent than dolphins because he had achieved so much - the wheel, New York, wars and so on - whilst all the dolphins had ever done was muck about in the water having a good time. But conversely, the dolphins had always believed that they were far more intelligent than man - for precisely the same reasons.

                            StuporMan's Supply and Demand Calculator
                            Supply and Demand Calculator 2.0.1 Beta Now loading savegames!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Ahh, clearly I did not consider all the possible ramifications of our green lifestyle!

                              I fully agree with points 1 and 6.

                              Points 3, 4, and 5 are good ones. However, given that we've already violated them, I think that we can allow ourselves a little bit of environmental unfriendliness on those issues.

                              Point 2 - well, we ought to be demanding tribute wherever possible, anyway

                              What does everyone else think?

                              Originally posted by StuporMan
                              Well, look at what my fellow Civ players have gotten themselves into! This game looks interesting I will have to join in later (when grad school is finally over for the semester I suspect).

                              Things appear to be going well, but I have a few rules that seem to be a natural addition to our tree-hugging succession game.

                              1) Once we can trade (via bio-diesel trucks of course), should we allow ourselves to trade in Oil, Uranium, and Hides? No I say! It is all Beads, Wool, and Wine for us!

                              2) Should we be more hostile towards our strip-mining adversaries? Should we demand tribute for environmental reclaimation? Reparations for environmental suffering?

                              3) Should we allow our cities to be grouped closely together creating a great urban sprawl? Or should we force all subsequent cities at least X spaces apart? (current cities excluded of course)

                              4) Should we avoid attacking the native-peoples (barbarians) when possible, and

                              5) interrupting their peaceful, nature-loving way of life (no huts).

                              6) Should we really allow railroads to be built? I mean think of how the train noises will disrupt the mating rituals of the various animals near the train tracks!

                              Ok I better stop before I suggest that researching technology takes us away from our natural state of ignorance and thus seperates us further from nature

                              StuporMan
                              "I'm a guy - I take everything seriously except other people's emotions"

                              "Never play cards with any man named 'Doc'. Never eat at any place called 'Mom's'. And never, ever...sleep with anyone whose troubles are worse than your own." - Nelson Algren
                              "A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic." - Joseph Stalin (attr.)

                              Comment

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