Atomic Eagle II: The Price of Freedom Development

[jim panse]

Well .... I´d like to do some nit-picking too if you two gentlemen do not mind after all

I do strongly believe that a possible WW3/enlengthened WW2 would have serious consequences on both sides of the Atlantic. For instance, official War Dept. documents from 1944/45 state it could possibly cost up to 500.000 G.I.s to invade and secure alone Honshu.

Considering D-Day never occurred there are two ways in my imagination about the huge U.S. industrial output and its weapons:

(1) The U.S. are sitting on loads and loads of their equipment which would have gone to Europe. Well, basically not to bad though the G.I.s would never have reported how bad the Shermans would have been doing against Tigers or Panthers - which would mean the U.S. equipment would have to be some kind of obsolete by then.

(This would be rather Red Front like, don´t you think so? I mean: Huge numbers of obsolete weaponry against the German Juggernaut.)

(2) Enlenghtened WW2/WW3 would have done the same thing to the U.S. society as fighting Hitler had done to the British society. I mean: instituting a universal draft, gung-ho patriotism (remember Churchill stating the Brits would fight on land, sea, air, beaches, etc and never surrender? I can imagine something like that.) If you look to what Britain was struggling with in the aftermath of real WW2 you can say it eroded its society I guess.

Concerning these points it would be highly possible the U.S. would adopt some kind of more autoritarian goverment style itself fighting on its homeland, maybe stating it would fight its 2nd War of Independence ...

Just some thoughts ...

[curtsibling]

Keep in mind too - That While the USA had her massed industry -
With the vast rescources of Europe under it's control, the 3rd Reich would too be a powerhouse.

Even while both sides would be depleted from years of war -
This world would already be one of mass famine, conscription, 25-year old generals and ruination.

Personally, I love it!

And keep in mind too, by this time, the German Axis forces
are no longer a titanic 'black corps' or blonde SS 'supermen.'

There would thousands of foreign and auxillary soldiers under Hitler's banner.
Probably plenty of Western Europeans, Russians and perhaps even British.

And don't forget - Germany has the lead in ballistic/jet science...!
And there was no Von Braun helping the USA in this timeline!

Will the atom bomb be a factor?
And will it be countered, or all-conquering?

This scenario will no doubt rule!

[jim panse]

Please take also into account that the German supply lines would be more than long and overstretched.

It is one thing to drive from the Eiffel to Abbeville but another one driving armoured columns through New Mexico and Texas into the heartland of the United States ...

And besides, Germany would also have an edge when it comes to submarine technology - which would result to operate under a sky totally dominated by the USAAF's heavy bombers

[curtsibling]

Without the UK as a base, there would be no USAAF bomber campaign - In Harry's world,
the 8th would have withdrawn long ago to the pacific or for US home defence.

[Sarsstock]

Personally Curt I love your line about twenty-five year old generals the best, hell that means I could have made at least Major by now. Now I don't doubt that Germany is indeed a true industrial superpower, quite possibly the greatest industrial power on earth. I still think the sabateour units are a good idea if only to reflect the fact that German war planners would had plans to sabotage the American war industry, as well as create havoc with America's rail lines and highways.

[Sarsstock]

Just how deep into Texas will the Germans be Harry at the time the scenario begins? Will they still be on their beacheads possibly at Galveston and Chorpus Christi or will they have pressed further inland to San Antonio and or Houston? Also what path do you see the Germans taking once they've taken Dallas.

The reason I ask is I can see a couple of different options for them. They could either drive west into New Mexico, Arizona and finally California until they reach the Pacific. Or they could maybe drive north into Oaklahoma, Kansas and Nebraska and possibly pushing further all the way through the Dakota's until they reach the Canadian border, effectivly cutting America in half.

Of course then there's also the option of instread moving east to secure the entire American Gulf Coast.

[Harry Tuttle]

Originally posted by Sarsstock
Just how deep into Texas will the Germans be Harry at the time the scenario begins? Will they still be on their beacheads possibly at Galveston and Chorpus Christi or will they have pressed further inland to San Antonio and or Houston? Also what path do you see the Germans taking once they've taken Dallas.

The reason I ask is I can see a couple of different options for them. They could either drive west into New Mexico, Arizona and finally California until they reach the Pacific. Or they could maybe drive north into Oaklahoma, Kansas and Nebraska and possibly pushing further all the way through the Dakota's until they reach the Canadian border, effectivly cutting America in half.

Of course then there's also the option of instread moving east to secure the entire American Gulf Coast.

I prefer the "Red Dawn" tactic pioneered in Kurt Russel's gripping epic where the invading army drives north cutting the country in half. Of course this is all up to the AI

I think there will be some small inroads into Texas at the start as the Germans come up from Mexico. The main thrust will probably to invade east of the Mississippi and into the main industrial centers.

[curtsibling]

I foresee some thrilling unit stack killing!

[Harry Tuttle]

Originally posted by curtsibling
I foresee some thrilling unit stack killing!

Not around major cities. . The suburbs will have fortress overlays to depict house to house fighting.



On another note, I've looked for any tips on this and I've come up dry. How exactly do I make terrain impassable in ToT? Also, how do I assign a specific unit to be able to pass over impassable terrain. I can see in the rules.txt that I can assign this value to any number of units, but I can't see where I make a certain terrain impassable. Gurus?

[Harry Tuttle]

Wow, Jim I have to give you props, this map is actually very accurate. The only thing I noticed is that the major rivers that the major cities sit on are not ocean squares, which is fine of course, I just have to make sure I place the cities correctly.

I have eliminated more of the unpopulated sections of Canada to cut down on map space, as well as eliminated a good portion of South America, which would just be an AI problem waiting to happen anyways.

Also, I am debating adding a huge land area to the South West of Central America to eliminate the large track of ocean. I hope, if anyone can answer my impassable terrain question, to cordon that off for play, and possibly make that area a staging area to depict American units being "airlifted" from Japan and China. This would be a similar idea to what Yoshi had in his "Battle for the Aplha Quadrant" scenario where Dominion units had to "Travel through the wormhole" to get to the main map area.

[curtsibling]

Originally posted by Harry Tuttle


Not around major cities. . The suburbs will have fortress overlays to depict house to house fighting.



On another note, I've looked for any tips on this and I've come up dry. How exactly do I make terrain impassable in ToT? Also, how do I assign a specific unit to be able to pass over impassable terrain. I can see in the rules.txt that I can assign this value to any number of units, but I can't see where I make a certain terrain impassable. Gurus?

Here is an example of my terrain section of Bitterfrost rules.txt -
Notice how mountains and dark forest have 'yes' as the second last entry.

This denotes them as impassable...

@TERRAIN
Enchanted, 1,2, 2,1,4, no, 0, 0, 0, no, 0, 0, 0, no,no, ; Drt
Thawland, 1,2, 1,1,0, yes, 0, 6, 1, no, 0, 0, 0, no,no, ; Pln
Hearthland, 1,2, 2,1,0, yes, 2, 4, 1, no, 0, 0, 0, no,no, ; Grs
Forest, 3,3, 1,2,0, no, 0, 0, 0, Pln, 0,12, 2, no,no, ; For
Hills, 2,4, 1,1,0, yes, 1, 6, 1, yes, 2, 6, 1, no,no, ; Hil
Mountains, 3,6, 0,1,0, no, 0, 0, 0, yes, 2, 6, 1, no,yes, ; Mou
Frostland, 2,2, 1,0,0, no, 0, 0, 0, yes, 1,12, 2, no,no, ; Tun
Deathland, 2,2, 0,0,0, no, 0, 0, 0, yes, 1,12, 2, no,no, ; Gla
Barren, 1,3, 0,1,0, no, 0, 0, 0, no, 0, 0, 0, no,no, ; Swa
Dark Forest,4,4, 1,0,0, For, 0,24, 2, For, 0,24, 2, no,yes, ; Jun
Cold Sea, 1,2, 1,0,2, no, 0, 0, 0, no, 0, 0, 0, no,no, ; Oce
Artefacts, 1,2, 1,1,9,
Hilve Tubes,1,2, 1,2,2,
Hearthland, 1,2, 2,1,0,
Timber, 2,3, 1,3,1,
Jibestone, 1,2, 1,2,2,
Gold, 3,6, 0,1,6,
Forna Berries, 2,2, 2,1,1,
Bones, 2,3, 0,1,1,
Evil Pool, 2,3, 0,1,0,
Ancient Idol, 2,2, 0,1,4,
Fish, 1,2, 3,0,2,
Lodestones, 1,2, 1,3,6,
Flupper Fruit, 1,2, 3,1,1,
Hearthland, 1,2, 2,1,0,
Porcine Game, 2,3, 2,2,2,
Frogstools, 1,2, 3,0,0,
Meteoric Iron, 3,6, 0,3,4,
Durnbeetles,2,2, 2,1,1,
Doomed Ruins, 2,3, 0,1,1,
Ivory Bones, 2,3, 0,2,1,
Jikker Fruit, 2,3, 3,0,0,
Seabirds, 1,2, 2,2,2,

Now to make our units get by these impassable terrains -
Go down the ToT rules until you come to '; Advanced unit fields' -
Don't be scared by these sections - This is where the fun happens!

Now look at the columns of 0s and 1s.
You will notice that each has a letter (A to G) assigned at the top,
The one you are interested in is G, and you will notice these columns
work the same way as unit powers in the regular MGE units list.
This is the extra cool stuff that you can add in ToT.

What you do is look at the key at the top of the list.
You will see that
the 'unit may enter impassable terrain:' property is:

00010000 - This goes under the G section, corresponding with your unit on the list...

Also - You may find it easier to rename the default units in the advanced list to match your scenario units.

If you study this and other advancedsection in rules, you will
that you can do awesome stuff -
Like make units into stealth, and also restrict units to certain civs -

...Without any tech tree tweaking!

Hope this has helped!

[jim panse]

Originally posted by curtsibling
Without the UK as a base, there would be no USAAF bomber campaign - In Harry's world,
the 8th would have withdrawn long ago to the pacific or for US home defence.

@ Curt, (Harry too): If the 8th USAAF would have been deployed to England I agree it would have been withdrawn in the events preceding a German victory/cease-fire.

Though I guess the US would have relocated it to Iceland, Greenland, maybe Newfoundland to secure the Eastern approaches to America ...

I also want to point out that Germany might have far superior equipment when it comes to fighters and tanks but that the bombing business would be in Yankee hands - meaning it would be quite difficult to operate under the carpet bombing of the Americans (maybe a bit like the Battle of the Bulge ...?)

Please take into account that Germany is heading for the oil wells in Texas as some kind of primary objective to cut the Yankees off their raw oil supplies.

And btw, what about the US preventing further Nazi reinforcements with the 8th USAAF stationed on the Bermudas, Greenland, maybe Iceland too - until the Nazis rocketeer attacks upon New York and other East coast cities (randomturn events?) ...

Or ... even more weird: like in Red Alert 2 .... trigger some psyops causing havoc in the rear of the US forces by psycho-control ...?

[Harry Tuttle]

Sweet, thanks Curt. I can now finish the map.

As for Jim's idea about cutting off Nazi reinforcements, I have been toying with the idea of creating "super cities" that inhabit fictional islands off the coast of Central America and off the coast of Bermuda. Basicaly these cities would represent China, Japan, and Europe with their respective American and Nazi troops.

The cities would be surrounded with the high production shield terrain tiles and would all have airports. They could produce a number of units and airlift them over enemy territory simulating reinforcements being flown in from over the ocean. All the cities would be surrounded by impassable terrain and would be unable to produce sea units.

What do you guys think?

[curtsibling]

It solves the issue of where the reinforcements are coming from!

I think you should go for it - !

PS
Will there be any Japanese units making a guest appearance...

Perhaps some troops who escaped the fall of the home islands?

[Sarsstock]

Harry I think its a great idea to have those "Super Cities". I also think it might be an interesting idea of having Japanese troops fighting on the American side, after the Americans took the Japanese home islands. Or do you think there simply wouldn't be enough Japanese willing to fight for America after one of the bloddiest land wars in history on the Japanese mainland?

Also Harry, I forget how Korea plays the storyline. Has the Korean Penninsula also been liberated by Amierca? I ask because it might be interesting to see Korean troops as well. Might we see some Australian forces as well in the fight for the America's?