Two cities using one square?

[Father Beast]

OK, so I decided to try something in Civ2, to see if it would work. It didn't work (rehoming caravans), but I found myself playing on anyway, using a combo of super science city and ICS.

a while back, I loked at the squares my cities were using and discovered that San Diego is using one of Washington's squares, but so is Washington at the same time!!!!

I was so astonished I decided to post it here

Does anyone know how this sort of thing can happen, or is it just a random bug.

Using Civ2(not TOT or MPGE), with CiC and FW installed, but those add ons shouldn't make a difference, I don't think...

[-Jrabbit]

Are these cities on opposite sides of the numerical "border" (where the map wraps back on itself)?

Seems to me there was something posted about this glitch awhile back, but I've never experienced it.

[Bloody Monk]

My, you have been a busy little ICSer haven't you. Very impressive. Eighteen cities by 580bc!!

Jr is right. This is known by many names including the dateline effect.

The zero meridian moves thru the western edge of your area. It usually runs thru the ocean, so that may be why you haven't noticed this before. What it boils down to is that the game does not recognize cities on different sides of the line. The zero line runs through the forest tile between Baltimore and St Louis.

By accident you have built your cities to take great advantage of this effect. The cities Baltimore, San Diego, and New Orleans (W's) are on the west side of the line. Washington, St Louis, Boston, and Denver are all on the east side (E's). Any of the W's can use any tiles in the E's city radii, not used by the other W's, irrespective of those tiles being used or not by the E cities. And vice versa.

Note that Baltimore is using the irrigated plains and grass used by the E city St Louis and that New Orleans also sees those tiles but they are unavailable because another W city, Baltimore, is using them.

I was a bit stumpted about how you had so many cities sized 2-4 without temples, but this is a warlord game; very different happiness factors from deity.

Good luck with your game.

Monk

[Father Beast]

OMG! That's exactly what's going on! the three cities on the other side of the International Date Line are sharing squares shamelessly with those on the other side. I had heard of the IDL before, but only as a possible way to get more specials, I didn't know about the sharing squares business....

BTW, One of the reasons I am able to ICS so bad is that I sometimes build settlers before a phalanx. I set the barbarians to Restless Tribes, so the barbs aren't too bad. three times a group has landed on my peninsula and threatened to wipe out an undefended city. each time I was able to buy them off with some gold, and they went away.

Hmmmnn.... Perhaps I should irrigate that swamp just outside washington so it can share squares with St. Louis...

[Bloody Monk]

Father Beast,

I would not say your ICS was bad, rather good, even extraordinary.

Perhaps this is not what you meant to say...

Hmmmnn.... Perhaps I should irrigate that swamp just outside washington so it can share squares with St. Louis...

Those two cities are both on the same side of the IDL, and neither can reach that swamp. It would be helpful for San Diego though.

When are you planning to explore with boats, find the other civs, and trade??

Monk

[duke o' york]

While we're on the subject, what effect does the dateline have on trade routes across it? Are they measured normally as regards distance between the cities, or do you get an unexpected bonus?

[Zenon]

Duke,

you get the normal delivery bonus, but the road/railroad bonus doesn´t work across the date line.

Zenon

[Bloody Monk]

Yep, that was a problem in one of the Early Landing Games.

Here is a good place to ask, as I am losing memory rapidly it seems, what is the distance limit to qualify for the road/RR bonus?? I remember it as 23 steps, but it could be 22, and I don't remember if map size makes a difference.

Monk

[Zedd]

IIRC it is 24< so 23 woould be another way of looking at it.

[solo]

At the dateline the pattern for specials is apt to be unusual, although more than 4 per city has never been demonstrated.

The distance between cities for the r/rr bonuses must be no more than 22 squares apart and may not cross the dateline.

[Bloody Monk]

Ah, the Master speaks. Thanks for clarifying that point, Solo.

Hope you are thriving!!

Monk

[Mercator]

Originally posted by solo
The distance between cities for the r/rr bonuses must be no more than 22 squares apart and may not cross the dateline.

Would it work across the dateline if the map is less than 22 squares wide?

If the distance is simply measured using the two city coordinates, it wouldn't normally work across the dateline because it's too far away.

Or does it really never work across the dateline, because civ2 isn't smart enough to realise the (rail)road connection continues across the dateline?

[solo]

Mercator,

Try a test to know for sure, but I doubt that any route across the dateline will work, since distance calculations are used for caravan payoffs across the line and these work correctly.

Monk,

Good to see you! Except for Zenon and myself, I think interest has waned for now in EL games, but things may change. I have managed 499 BC using another random start, so am happy to rest with that goal accomplished.

[Bloody Monk]

Originally posted by solo
Monk,

Good to see you! Except for Zenon and myself, I think interest has waned for now in EL games, but things may change. I have managed 499 BC using another random start, so am happy to rest with that goal accomplished.

499BC?? (probably, you meant AD). Even so, that's superb!!

I've recently played a set in a SXN game. That's about all I can manage for now. Any gameplay is so much fun!! As for others interest, there is a currunt Strat Forumn thread started by Marcel I that you might be able to add something to the mix. Perhaps you can suggest a map for him to try.

As for this one, Father Beast is playing a very different game than Early Landing. Have you looked at his map?? Looks like fun!!

Monk

[Father Beast]

Monk,
You're right, I meant San Diego.

Originally posted by Zenon
Duke,

you get the normal delivery bonus, but the road/railroad bonus doesn´t work across the date line.

Zenon

OK, I must be a bit out of touch. What's the r/RR bonus?