Strategies against Barbarian Attacks

[Elephant]

WOW- I slipped a Dip in next turn: Viborg had 2 trade arrows, and 34 corruption! It was using the Harbor you left for several ocean tiles, the rest was shielded grass and the pheasant. The reciprocal route for the Barbs was +12.

Hmmm... plant an extra city for deliberate Barb sacrifice... another crazy EL strategy! Maybe we should retitle this thread "Strategies to INVITE Barb Attacks"...

[rah]

Yes, if there's any grassland nearby and some ocean (perfect if it has a food special), it will grow quite quickly.

[solo]

Elephant,

So much of the value of trade routes comes from the SSC's own bountiful supply of trade arrows, it doesn't much matter how poorly off the AI (or barb) city is doing in trade. It's the 100% bonus for a RR connection that provides the boost to total route values.

Along the same lines, is the idea of NOT conducting SSC trade with the best AI trade cities later in the game. SSC arrows are enough to ensure maximum payments for demanded commodities, and the lack of arrows in the target city keeps commodity supply and demand unblocked because new routes are not established to replace existing ones.

One more note: If you still have that save, it also happens to illustrate how the "SCG switch" can be used advantageously. Go into the SSC and remove enough city workers until there are 0 shields. Presto! A new supply of uranium!

[Zenon]

Thank you all for this interesting information. I have run some tests now about the early defense bonus. Some conclusions are quite interesting:

The capital keeps a defense bonus against barbarian attacks when the second city is founded. This defense bonus seems not to expire. It still works in modern times. A fortified warrior has appr. a 70% chance of survival against a barbarian archer (diety level, a short check on king level gave a 100% chance of survival). This works with other units, too. A fortified chariot gives the same results. Chances to get veteran status are appr. 70%, when surviving such an attack. Other cities seem to have no defense bonus. A fortified warrior in another city never survived in the tests. With the additional defense bonus of a river the chance of survival was still below 10%. Phalanxes do surprisingly well. They survived in 75% of all cases with a 50% chance to become veterans. With a defense value of 3 (2 + 50% fort.) versus an attack value of a barbarian archer (3 + diety bonus) this is unexpected. A fortified phalanx in the capital easily survived 2 archers. The chances to win with an attacking warrior or a phalanx against a barbarian archer were appr. 30% each. Chances to become veteran were low, obviously in accordance with the normal 20% chance.

Zenon

[SlowThinker]

Zenon,
I can declare I am a well experienced combat tester and so I can give you an advice:
In rules.txt set hit points to 10 (100 points): then the fortuity will be very low. Also operate with higher attack and defense values (5 and more): then the defender's advantage will be low.
This way you can determine the exact bonus easily.

[SlowThinker]

Once I revealed the map in cheat mode and I observed the game for about first 50 turns.
Pirates arised in years 16, 24, 32, 40... So only every 8th turn. And just one vessel with pirates (is this valid also for a late game?).
I noticed only 1 group of barb rebels (Edit: I mean ground barbs) and this was not in an oedo year.

A barb boat always dissapear right the next turn after the disembark. It won't attack your ship although it is on an adjacent tile.
I have a suspicion that the boat won't attack also before the disembark if it touches a dry land.

I suppose regular barb units cannot act as marines - i.e. a city on a one-tile island needn't to be defended. True?
(I remember a situation where a barb boat came besides such an island and started to 'sleep' there).

[SlowThinker]

See also this:
partisan barbarians won't attack your partisans

[Straybow]

Barbs can appear after Mobile Warfare. I had built Jinjan on a small continent near the Japanese, who did not have Mobile Warfare. Barbs appeared about 6 tiles away after my 1985 turn. (I paradropped into Sapporo the next turn.)

Apparently Mob only stops barbs in your territory, and in this case the spawn point was close enough to the Japs that their tech level controlled.

[Straybow]

Here's another

In our "Nothin' Fancy" Succession Game barbs appeared during my round after my 1840 turn. They were well within Iberian territory, nearest civ over 12 tiles away.

I bribed 2 partisans, killed the other and ransomed the king. Here you see one of the partisans, and the highlighted tile with the spy who did the job. If you load the save file you'll see the second partisan in Ise.

[Straybow]

Lies! It's all lies!

I forgot: looking at the first half of my log, barbs appeared after the 1828 turn East of Bizen, also far from any other civ.

[Six Thousand Year Old Man]

I thought the discovery of Mobile Warfare only banished barb pirates from the seas, rather than banishing barbs altogether?

[rah]

I thought the same thing.

[Straybow]

Ummm, OK.

[SlowThinker]

the defense bonus in cities

I have tested the defense bonus against barbs in cities:
The firepower of the defender in capital (=a city with a Palace) is multiplied by 6.
If the civ has 7 or less cities then the firepower of the defender in a normal (non-capital) city is multiplied by 2.5 .
(It means that fortified warrior on a river in normal city is about equal to an attacking barb archer)

It might be about hitpoints in place of firepower, but I think it is firepower.
This is valid only if you have at least 2 cities.

And it looks that AI defenders have even better bonus.

Edit: added '7 or less cities'

[rah]

Interesting. The theory was in a scc that the capital defender would never lose. Or is your above example only valid after the second city is built?