Ruleset Discussion

[DNK]

Whatever.

[Dinner]

You want them to put oil under each capital city? What if we already have something else under our capital city?

[Hercules]

At long last this from Ruff_hi

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Here is the latest rule set reflecting the past few posts. New or changed in this post:
01f - Game Admin ruling communication
3c split into 3c, 3d - war order reshuffles
3e formalized - war order reshuffle appeal
4d - map images added
various re-lettering based on the above
Comments regarding 3c and 3d ...
everyone is saying that order isn't important - because going first or last has its advantages and disadvantages
however, a large group still think that going second is more important and want some rule to address loss of resources
the suggestion to reshuffle the order so that teams can move down the order to 'protect' their resources at the cost of a double move gained acceptance
but what if everyone is wrong and going first ends up being the kick ass strategy
so ... we also need a rule saying that teams could move up the list (just in case)
but that opens up a rule enabled double move that I am unsure how to codify
I think that 3c will gain lots of support during the voting stage
but I expect 3d to be voted down


Quote:
ISDG 2012 Rules
Preamble
Rule Infringing
In Game Actions (excluding sequential game items)
In Game Actions (sequential game items)
Out of Game Actions
Administration

Preamble
We the undersigned, celebrating the game that is Civ4 and, given the male / female Civ4 ratio is at least 10:1 if not 20:1, have gathered together to play ISDG 2012 in the hope of:
Impressing the few females that we actually find in Civ4
Winning the game
Demonstrating our mastery of Civ4 in all of its aspects
Testing our interpersonal skills via diplomacy
Resisting the urge to rule lawyer everyone to death
Planning to eliminate all other teams and especially savouring the opportunity of causing others to suffer the might of our forces more than once
And, finally, standing victorious on the broken bones and crushed skulls of our opponents

With these aims, we collectively agree to:
Play with honour
Make our mothers proud that they could trust us to 'Be Good'
Offer respect to the other teams and expect the return of same
Further, we also acknowledge that this preamble is not a rule and is merely a representations of our intent and hopes.


01. Rule Infringing
a. Infringing on the rules is not allowed.

b. When an allegation of rule infringement has been leveled at one or more teams by one or more teams, the game will be paused.

c. Each side of the alleged rule infringement will appoint a spokesperson. 'Prosecutor' for the alleging team or teams, 'Defender' for the alleged rule infringer.

c. Evidence of alleged rule infringement will be collected and forwarded to the Game Admin together with any accompanying explanatory text by the Prosecutor.

d. The Game Admin will forward this information to the Defender and ask for feedback.

e. Upon receiving feedback (or after a reasonable amount of time at the Game Admin's discretion), the Game Admin will rule on the alleged infringement, determine the penalty (if any), the resolution (if any) and those determinations will be acted upon.

f. The Game Admin should start a thread that communicates allegations of rule infringements, parties involved, rule(s) allegedly infringed, evidence of infringement (providing proprietary information is not disclosed) and Game Admin ruling.

g. All rulings under this rule by the Game Admin are final.


02. In Game Actions
a. The following in-game action rules apply at all times.

b. Suicide Training - Knowingly sacrificing a unit to an ally in order to yield experience points to the victorious unit is not allowed.

c. City Gifting - Conquest, culture flip, UN resolution, and AP resolution are the only permitted methods of city transfer.

d. Unit Gifting, Unlock Building - Gifting a unit with experience that would remove the unit experience restriction for the Heroic Epic is not allowed. Gifting a unit with experience that would remove the unit experience restriction for West Point is not allowed.

e. Unit Gifting, war ally support - A team can only gift units to a war ally during the war ally's portion of the turn.

f. Bugs and Exploits - The use of any bug or exploit is not allowed. The decision about exactly what constitutes a bug or exploit rests solely with the admin. Consult with the admin if any action you are considering may be a bug or exploit.

g. In-Game Pausing - Any Team may pause the game. Any team encountering a paused game should consult the CFC based turn-tracker thread. If a team has not requested a pause in that thread, the game may be unpaused.

h. Abusing Pauses - No team should abuse the game pause rule.


03. In Game Actions (war edition)
a. Civilizations that are at war must observe turn order. Turn order is automatically fixed by the APT Mod on the first turn of war.

b. Teams must also observe turn order on the turn immediately prior to the first turn of War.

b1. Declarer Desires First Half Example: If the declarer desires to move first during the war phase turns, they must move before their 'target' in the turn preceding their war declaration.

b2. Declarer Desires Second Half Example: If the declarer desires to move second during the war phase turns, they must move after their 'target' in the war declaration turn.

c. Turn Order Shuffle to later slot - All teams at war have the right to request an order shuffle to a later slot providing at least 3 turns have elapsed since the declaration of war or the last order shuffle. If order requests conflict, the priority for a later position goes to the team that is currently earlier in the turn. The team moving ‘down’ the order acknowledges that they are giving the team moving ‘up’ a double move against them.

d. Turn Order Shuffle to earlier slot – All teams at war have the right to request an order shuffle to an earlier slot providing at least 3 turns have elapsed since the declaration of war or the last order shuffle. If order requests conflict, the priority for an earlier position goes to the team that is currently later in the turn.

e. Turn Order Appeals – A team can appeal to the Game Admin that the shuffle order is unfair and that the Game Admin can adjust the shuffle order at his discretion.

f. Joining an existing war - Teams will exercise care so as to avoid any double move when joining an ally in an existing war.

g. Care should be exercised on the war declaration turn so that the mod can correctly assign war turn order. This means that teams should not leave the game without finishing the turn on the turn that they declare war or the team being declared on should not enter the game until the declarer has finished their turn.

h. Teams can't declare war on a team that is currently online. Teams cannot permanently stay online just to avoid being declared on.


04. Out of Game Actions
a. Team Espionage - All external forms of intelligence gathering against opposing teams are not allowed.
Non-exhaustive list of example: Entering Team Forums, joining multiple teams using different accounts, actively petitioning other players for information, looking around on the CFC (or a 3rd party website) image database for screenshots and save uploads.

b. Game / Pitboss / Save Manipulation or Disruption - Editing the save file (with or without a utility) is not allowed. Intentionally disrupting access to the Pitboss host server is not allowed. Intentionally opening Diplomacy screens and then pausing, intending to lock teams out of playing their turn is not allowed.

c. Pre In-Game Contact - Teams making diplomatic contact before they have met in-game is not allowed. Non-exhaustive list of example: meeting privately to discuss in-game actions, game-related deals, in-game agreements, etc.). Note that teams meeting to discuss rules, ramifications of the impact of votes or rules are allowed.

d. Sharing of Map Images – Map images / screenshots cannot be shared outside of the game until it is possible to share maps in-game.

e. Game Pause Requests - Any team may request a pause by posting in the CFC turn-tracker thread. The purpose of the pause must be included in the pause request.

f. Abusing Pause Requests - No team should abuse the Game Pause Requests rule.


05 - Administration
a. Game Administrator - r_rolo1 has sole authority as game administrator. Replacement of the game administrator must be agreed to by all teams.

b. Victory - The winner of the game is the first team recognized as winner by in-game victory dialog.

c. Defeated Teams - Player on teams that are eliminated are permitted to join another team. These "refugee" players are free to share any information from their old team with their new team. They may NOT engage in team espionage by reporting information on their new team to any other team.

e. Game Setup Votes - Items determined during the voting phase of the game cannot be changed by rules or subsequent team votes.

f. Game Rules - Rules can be changed by 2/3 majority of teams with admin consent or by 100% majority of teams (regardless of admin consent) or by admin ruling.

g. Game Reloads - All game reloads will trigger an automatic game pause (game admin will post such in game pause thread) for a minimum of 24 hours or until each team that logged in to the game after the reload point has stated in the game pause thread that they are ready to continue.

[Hercules]

And this from Admin r_rolo1

Moderator Action: Ok, I did not wanted to intervene with a heavy hand, but we are taking too much time discussing rules. I know that rulesets are important and such, but being in bizantine discussions about a single point or two will only serve to delay the game start.

So:

- I give 72h from this moment to end the discussions on the ruleset

- If the teams do not agree on the ruletset, I will pick the proposal posted by ruff above ( that seems to be balanced enough and apparently most teams agree with the majority of the points ) and will pick it with the alterations that the teams might have agreed on in the next 72h

I know there will be people less than happy with the overall result if there is no consensus, but the game must start soon enough ... summer is coming and all of that

So are we in agreement?

[DNK]

I've discussed my issues on that forum, and he's actually responded well to those other than the whole sabotaging thing. So, yeah, I'm agreed enough to not disagree anymore

[mzprox]

yeah, let's start the game already.. too many useless rules, but if that makes them happy

[Hercules]

I was looking what the progress was and Gold_ Ergo_Sum (From Team RB- Ruff_hi's team) makes a very good point about Rule 5f above.

Any scenario where less than a unanimous consent of teams can change the game rules is rife with far too many possibilities for manipulation. Even with the caveat that the game admin has final authority, there are too many scenarios where greater than 2/3s of the teams are aligned in a coalition and thus gain free reign to manipulate the rule set in ways that favor their side of the coalition.

e. Game Setup Votes - Items determined during the voting phase of the game cannot be changed by rules or subsequent team votes.

f. Game Rules - Rules can be changed by 2/3 majority of teams with admin consent or by 100% majority of teams (regardless of admin consent) or by admin ruling.

This was added rather late in the thread discussion by Ruff_hi himself along with some other changes. But it is a big change from even what R_Rolo1 suggested, which was rules can only be changed by unanimous agreement.

Rule 5f doesn't specify 'remaining' teams playing or the full 9 teams participating. Say there were 3 left 18 months from now, 2 of them could argue for change of the rules.

But crucially, 5f would allow 5e above to be changed.

This can be discussed further but should not delay the start of the game.

[Calanthian]

I would make it "Unanimous minus One". Otherwise absolutely nothing will change, while it may be that something is needed.

[DNK]

unanimous minus one or four, whichever is greater.

[Dinner]

I still think most of the rules are pretty ****ty and designed specifically for partisan advantage but I recognize that this turd isn't going to change so I guess I have no choice other than continuing until it becomes obvious one side is cheating and attempting to stack the rules.

[OzzyKP]

Well it looks like the rules have been finalized. We're almost ready to start the game!!

[Calanthian]

I propose Mzprox is the turn player in the upcoming 3 weeks..

I am on holiday then.
I will still be playing my games, but as there is a small chance I'll be missing some turns so I think it's best that Mz plays..

[mzprox]

I can play in this month then someone should take over for August.

[Calanthian]

That's fine. I'll be back July 28th.

[OzzyKP]

Perfect.