Destiny of Empires [Diplo Game] [Organization Thread]

[India (DoE)]

this game suffers from what most diplogames suffer from, top heavy alliances. the top players see far more gain in working together than fighting eachother, causing the minor civs who are trying to get up to meet an unstoppable wall. Now India has smashed through that wall by killing Chinese cities and the other great powers friendly to China says that this is unacceptable.

Not a single one of you have responded to my IMO inescapable logical argumentsin my posts that show that there should be no reason China should complain about being reduced to the size of India. If it is ok for India to be reduced to that size then give me a single good reason that this should not also happen to China?

I evened the odds to be able to fight a war. Simple as that. China is still in a better position, but they are not now twice my size. Nothing unfair here, move along.

[India (DoE)]

Part of the game is to play for victory not to let your ally win

You would be surprised at the amount of players who have absolutely no understanding of that concept. It has been an annoyance to me in every diplogame I have been in.

In this game Japan has been nothing but a 100% puppet of China since the beginning. They could have made huge gains by taking valuable lands on the Chinese coast, but chose to be China's retarted little brother stuck on their crappy islands in return for gifts that they would have owned themselves in the first place if they had bothered to take the lands in question.

[Arabia2 (doe)]

Hey guys, please don't talk about the game as it was finished. I've joined for the sole purpose to win the game, I expect you to try to stop me . Seriously though cheer up, there are always nukes :P

[Aztecs (DoE)]

* One point I'd like to see in another diplo game is to somehow limit the size of an alliance.
My limit would be 25% of the players in the game (and that's a huge alliance).


* Furthermore I'd like to limit the amount of troops one can receive as gifts.
The Ottomans never even invented rifling. Pretty ridiculous from a historical / gaming point of view..



Some additional remarks:
From my point of view: I tried to keep independent as long as possible. And hoped for a couple of alliances from which to choose later depending on playing style etc. etc.
The main reason I sided against Russia was the kindergarten bully style : you do what I tell you or else.. and I knew before I chose that it would be the hardest path..

[Japan (DoE)]

You would be surprised at the amount of players who have absolutely no understanding of that concept. It has been an annoyance to me in every diplogame I have been in.

In this game Japan has been nothing but a 100% puppet of China since the beginning. They could have made huge gains by taking valuable lands on the Chinese coast, but chose to be China's retarted little brother stuck on their crappy islands in return for gifts that they would have owned themselves in the first place if they had bothered to take the lands in question.

This is untrue. I have never been a puppet. I wanted to get some cities on the mainland but china grabbed everything before i even had sailing. So to avoid war I stayed to my islands and in return got a great prophet to creat my holy shrine. Other then that I have not received much of anything for me.

[Japan (DoE)]

Also I cant beleive Im going to say this but I have to side with India on this one. There is nothing wrong with attacking a larger power and burning down some cities. It is exqctly what I would have done where I to have attacked a large power like china.

[Russia (DoE)]

Hey guys, please don't talk about the game as it was finished. I've joined for the sole purpose to win the game, I expect you to try to stop me . Seriously though cheer up, there are always nukes :P

One manly statement!

If you - the others who talk about how there is not to be done anymore in the game - despair so easy - then it is not anyone else's fault.

[Russia (DoE)]

Guys, guys, I know what you are trying to do - the game is far from being finished or pointless, nor you think about it like this, but you are trying to lure me and other nations (just like Japan did already) in disclosing things, which should be kept away of the public until the game really ends, as people in affection tend to lose control. You are trying to set the things and expose some private thoughts. Also, by bending the truth (as I see 3 absolutely not true statements in these last couple of pages) you are trying to see which is secret and which is known to your rivals, and to add to this, you are trying to set or change the opinion and feelings of some players with out-of-game arguments for taking in-game decisions now or in the near future

Lets leave all the analysis and dissections for after the game. I am quite sure there will be lot of surprises and things to amaze, indignate and taught us when anyone can speak in open for things that happened in the game.

[India (DoE)]

I am not bending any truths.

As I see it, Japan would have done much better had they challenged China rather than join them. They chose instead to stay friendly resulting in their alliance becoming so lopsided that I now consider Japan a puppet rather than any form of equal partner in that alliance. That is my honest opinion. Had Japan done the logical thing and gone after the valuable Asian mainland (by force, allying itself with me and even the Mongols would have had an interest here), then both China and Japan would have been major powers instead of China being a superpower and Japan being backwards. Not doing the logical thing because of loyalty to a far superior ally is in my opinion the same as being a puppet. Being the ruler of a nation means playing after the rules of Realpolitik, principles are for the vanquished.

As for revealing secrets, I am fairly sure already that it was Russia, not China that gave Japan its Riflemen upgrades, so no great secrets revealed for my sake, but that is OOC, not IC. IC India still blames China for this, and now we are taking our revenge, but that belongs in the story thread. Only question is, when is China coming back?

[India (DoE)]

also, @ Russia, this game is over. You have won, I am only playing on to see who comes 2nd.

And I did not start this discussion, I started a war and then China's friends have said that "oh, that is unreasonable", while similar things have been done to others before without them speaking out. I am not trying to get anyone to reveal anything aside from their hypocrisy. The org thread is supposed to be OOC and whatever our desires ingame should be kept out of it. Japan has the decency to say what he believes despite the fact that it goes against his ingame interests. Too bad that other players do not have such integrity.

[Russia (DoE)]

I am not bending any truths.

I was not pointing at you - we, the Russians say " The guilty one runs away without anyone actually chasing him"

[mzprox]

Being a "puppet" is not necessarily a bad thing except it sounds degradatory . There always will be small and big powers and I think it's perfectly normal that alliances consist of bigger and smaller nations instead of only big ones. The top powers should kill each other instead of allying, but this is also not a rule.. the players should have some basic sense of balance and act according to that.

[Russia (DoE)]

No, no, no - I wont start answering to all of this. When the game is over (about half an year from now maybe ) we will write, write, argue, condemn, praise, and between many "crucify him" and "hosanna", everyone will take his moral of the story, the truth will take shape and I hope a valuable lessons for future diplo-games will be learned.

Too bad a lot of the current fascination will be passed away, the things and feelings will be faded somewhat and most of those things will just remain unspoken

[Russia (DoE)]

Also,

unstoppable wall

is an oxymoron - it must be "insuperable wall" or "unstoppable power"

[Russia (DoE)]

BTW, I do miss the old Neanderthal King Veneta... He was such a sly mastermind and a zealous rhetorician, that now when he is gone, in the vacuum on the international scene even my humble and quite straightforward persona shines.