Beyond the Pit [Pitboss Diplomacy Game] [Organization Thread VI]

[Pitboss Russia]

I've got in a couple of times - long enough for new build orders - then it drops.

[St Jon]

At last........phew!

[Heraclitus]

Absolutely!!!!!

Regarding vassalage or capitulation, the disadvantage of vassalage is that the vassal can break vassalage ANY TIME (after 10 turns). Which effectually means that the master still can't be sure. In fact he pays extra maintenance all the time, gives armies and freebies, but in the end he may still be stabbed in his back by his vassal. So what's the point?

And how is this different from the real world? Jebus do you really want vassals who have no possiblity of rebeling?

[Heraclitus]

or otherwise I'll start producing photoshopped statistic screenshots 8)

[Robert]

And how is this different from the real world? Jebus do you really want vassals who have no possiblity of rebeling?

In the real world such a civ would have been destroyed or assimilated. (indians, friesen, all german nations, all greek factions, etc.)

I do want civs that have to option to rebel (normal vassals) but also the option for a civ to capitulate and have a different role in the rest of the game.
What's wrong with a different role? Being a vassal is really not that bad.

I have been a vassal in most games, no rebellion.

[Pitboss Japan]

Any chance that a new turn starts soon?

[Pitboss Russia]

*****VERY IMPORTANT*****

I went into the Diplomacy Screen with Greece to see what was going on and found I had offerred an unretractable Cease Fire offer! I don't want a Cease Fire so please REJECT!!!

I also found that I could not enter Japan's Diplo Screen at all??? If I have made any offer there it also must be rejected!

A Game glitch I suppose but very annoying.

[OzzyKP]

How many times does this need to be said?

You can't negotiate with Japan, they are a vassal you are at war with.

If you open the diplomacy screen with someone you are at war with it'll automatically put up a cease fire offer. Jeeze, you were freaking out about the exact same thing a week ago.

[OzzyKP]

Hah, I found it:

VERY IMPORTANT!!

Greece, something is funny with the Game. I couldn't get to the Diplo-Screen of Japan to check what was going on and it took a while to get to your's. When I did I found a Cease-Fire offer had been made! I didn't make it by mistake as I couldn't retract it and you can't have made it as it didn't come up at the start!

I don't want Peace so please reject the offer or reload the Turn as it must be an error in the Game somewhere. It was really weird as well as couldn't get in with Portugal, Rome or you in there and it was almost impossible to move as everything was jerking around like crazy!

Japan is a vassal who you are war with. You are unable to negotiate anything with them so the diplo screen is blocked.

As for Greece you are also at war with them, you can't negotiate a tech trade or anything else while at war, so there is only one option when opening the diploscreen with someone you are at war with - cease fire. If you clicked "exit diplomacy" instead of "send deal" (or whatever it says) then it won't affect the game and Greece won't get your offer.

So that's all normal.

As for people conflicting... I dunno. I haven't been able to connect to you for months. Now and then I have trouble with others too. I don't know why. Khmer was blocking me the other day and I missed my window to take the turn and had to play it several hours later. I don't understand the complexities of networking or why things work one day and not the next. But it doesn't seem to be anything new or unusual.

So relax.

[Pitboss Russia]

That actually doesn't quite make sense as previous turn I was able to get in and see gold and tech??? It cannot change from turn to turn?

[Heraclitus]

And how is this different from the real world? Jebus do you really want vassals who have no possiblity of rebeling?

In the real world such a civ would have been destroyed or assimilated. (indians, friesen, all german nations, all greek factions, etc.)

I do want civs that have to option to rebel (normal vassals) but also the option for a civ to capitulate and have a different role in the rest of the game.
What's wrong with a different role? Being a vassal is really not that bad.

I have been a vassal in most games, no rebellion.

If we are talking about the real world why don't we mention nations like Poland, India, Bulgaria, Greece? All these at one point (or severa) in their history where conquered but they regained their independance.

[Robert]

Those are normal vassals.
I'd say there should be room for both normal vassals and capitulated vassals.

To a nation it can be interesting to capitulate. Of course it should be aware of the full concequences of their decision. But another nation cannot start a "capitulate or die" war.
Things should be reasonable. But perhaps a master and slave can arrange something that makes it interesting for both to end the war with a capitulation.

So a war can end with:
- normal peace
- peace at a price
- civ a lost some cities to civ b
- vassalage
- capitulation

[Robert]

Voted so far:
- Sparta
- Maya
- Spain

4 more days for voting.

[Pitboss Russia]

Russia has voted this morning - please confirm receipt

[Robert]

I'm sorry, no votes received from Russia. What address did you use?