Apolyton's next top Roman

[Pitboss Rome]

My old thread was deleted by moderator Nazi's.

Anyway, who wants to play Rome?

[Pitboss Vikings]

please play on... I have great ideas to make the gmae fun for you..

[Pitboss Maya]

What exactly is the issue?

Why do you want to switch/quit???

And I question the title of this thread. Rome has never been on top this game.

[MMC]

Since there is only one Rome in the game, they have always been the top Roman.

[OzzyKP]

There are two actually. A holy rome and a rome full of godless heathens.

[Pitboss Rome]

Originally posted by Pitboss Maya
What exactly is the issue?

Why do you want to switch/quit???

I wish for the simple life of runing a quaint little civ.

Bahh, It seems I will have to entertain myself in the mean time by being a mad dictator and force of evil.

Originally posted by Pitboss Maya

And I question the title of this thread. Rome has never been on top this game.

I never said I was, but then again America's next top model isn't either.

[Pitboss Rome]

Originally posted by Pitboss Vikings
please play on... I have great ideas to make the gmae fun for you..

Post them or PM me whatever you think is more appropriate.

Originally posted by MMC
Since there is only one Rome in the game, they have always been the top Roman.

Ahww thanks.

Originally posted by OzzyKP
There are two actually. A holy rome and a rome full of godless heathens.

We have more gods than the "Holy" Romans!

[Pitboss Korea]

The Holy Romans are not really Romans. While their name may be Holy Roman Empire they are in actuality Germans and Italians for the most part.

Although their leader was called King of the Romans.

[Robert]

More French then Italian.

[Pitboss Korea]

How are they more French? I'm talking about the whole thing, not just the begining when the Franks (who weren't, at the time, French) ran it, but the whole history.

[MMC]

I always associated the HRE with modern day Austria (the one which contains NO kangaroos ), rather than France or Germany, although I'm sure the empire did span those regions.

[OzzyKP]

Definitely more Germany than Austria.

[Robert]

Originally posted by Pitboss Korea
How are they more French? I'm talking about the whole thing, not just the begining when the Franks (who weren't, at the time, French) ran it, but the whole history.

Ok, Franks is better indeed then French, (in dutch France is named "Frankrijk", rijk (empire) of the Frankisch).

I don't really know that much about the HRE, but I don't get the idea that there was much Italian in it.

[Pitboss Persia]

HRE was something that emerged from the Frankish Kingdom founded by Charlemagne ( = Carl the Great ). His Kindom was born in today's northern France and a part of today's Belgium, in the fifth century. Conquests and political influence made the kingdom grow in size, reaching from the atlantic coast to the center today's germany. His captial was established at Aachen / Aix la Chapelle. That city is in germany today, next to the French border. He managed to grow in size mainly by adopting christianity and using this religion to unite frankish, roman and germanic noble families and thereby assuring cohesion to the kingdom.

Most of the representations you can see of Carl the great are based on assumptions from the renaissance era, not on actual historical knowledge. It is known today that he didn't look like the "bearded king" of the germanic tradition, but really seeked to be recognized as the pursuer of the roman imperial tradition. He was dressed with the white and red imprerial roman robes, and even the crown of leafes.

The name "Holy Roman Empire" was used centuries after the dead of Charlemagne, once the part that lied in today's France was no longer under frankish control, that's why you may think it has much to do with germany. European historians however, see Charlemagne as the foundator of both, Germany and France.

However, it definitively has nothing to do at all with Austria.

You can't even say there is much italian in it because of the vatican. In fact, the kings of the HRE didn't hesitate to take the Pope as a hostage to get Vaticans blessings to what they intended to do .

[OzzyKP]

Well they are related but kinda separate. The Frankish Kingdom (or Empire) was the one Charlemagne was in. That was around roughly from the 400's-800's. It was, as noted, very France based:



But then some emperor decided to divide the empire into three sections ruled by three of his sons. The western part became France and the eastern part became the Holy Roman Empire. (they both kinda gobbled up the middle bit). The HRE lasted from the 800's till the 1800's. But for much of that time it was a loose confederation of independent German principalities and other countries. So Austria was indeed a part of HRE but still independent at the same time. Northern Italy was in there as well.

Map from around 1630:


So the Kingdom of the Franks was more France, and the Holy Roman Empire was more Germany. They are closely related but not exactly the same.

Also, the Netherlands were part of both of these empires, so CS you have no excuse for not knowing about them.