Beyond the Pit [Pitboss Diplomacy Thread] [Warfare-Turn Timer Issue Discussion]

[Pitboss Japan]

is it me or are we getting nowhere with all this rule enforcing?

[Pitboss Korea]

We are getting nowhere.

[Robert]

We are getting everywhere. Nobody is cheating and everybody is enjoying the game.
You guys are too deep into the "we must prevent any possible crime by giving huge penalties"

That has already been proven wrong.
Nations that have the death row also have the highest crime rates.

[The Capo]

Originally posted by CyberShy
We are getting everywhere. Nobody is cheating and everybody is enjoying the game.
You guys are too deep into the "we must prevent any possible crime by giving huge penalties"

That has already been proven wrong.
Nations that have the death row also have the highest crime rates.

Nobody HAS cheated, and the only war going on right now invovles one player who doesn't even take his turns.

And I can't believe I have to say this gain, this is not REAL LIFE this is civilization. Whoever tries to say there is a correlation between countries with death penalties/crime rates and civilization cheating is a complete idiot. I'm sorry, but you are.

[Robert]

People remain people.
If people will murder even if they may face death row, then people will cheat even if they face a 25% vote reduction.

You'd better come with arguments then claiming that I'm an idiot.

You say: huge penalties will prevent people from ignoring the rules. Reality is: people will ignore the rules, even if the worst penalties are given.
People remain people.

[Pitboss Vikings]

the reason people still murder despite the Death penalty is simply too many Defnece lawyers. looking for technicalties to get the guilty off.

You knowthe type.

"Oh it was just an accident , i got no advantage from that murder therefore it wasnt really a murder , let me go free."

[Pitboss Korea]

Yeah but I don't think they will in a game like this. There are real personal reasons for murder (usually its somebody that knows you) whereas in a videogame you cheat in order to win. If you lose points, which allow you to win, then there is no point to cheat. That's the idea. Going to jail does not remove the benefit of killing some ******* that you hate. There IS a difference, you are comparing apples to oranges.

[Pinchak]

We ever come to a consensus about how the double move is going to work going forward?

[Pinchak]

Oh it was just an accident , i got no advantage from that murder therefore it wasnt really a murder , let me go free.

Actually in that case, at least in American law, you would get a manslaughter charge, which carries a possible 10 year term.

So there is a difference in penalty based on intent.

Of course if no law was decided on about killing people (or taking double moves) then I don't see how there could be a penalty.

Your F-ing dumb Raz.

[Pitboss Korea]

Like I've said before, we can't compare the two crimes because they are not similar.

It should be compared more to insider trading, or fraud, not murder.

But it doesn't matter, I don't understand the point of arguing about it like this. Most people dont' get away with murder because of defense lawyers, that's just simply an untrue statement. If you want to get technical MOST people get away with murder because of lack of evidence (and if we are saying get away with, that implies guilt, most people who "get away" with murder in the sense you are describing actually didn't committ the crime). So we aren't in a situation where you wouldn't be able to prove it, its clear a crime was comitted because we can see it on the chart.

What we are debating here are accidental double-moves, but I think the situation is such that everyone knows the rule to begin with and I doubt anyone will legitimately break the rule on accident. We could always remind people, on top of that I've already come up with an exemption if you HAVE TO TAKE YOUR TURN just in case there is no other time you can move. I sincerely doubt a mistake will be made in this regard. Especially now that its been discussed so fervently.

[Robert]

I'm not compare crimes, I'm comparing people. People are people, and it has been proven that a harder punishment doesn't prevent new crimes.

I'm not saying that punisments shouldn't be hard for that reason, they should be for other reasons, rightiousness.

I'm not going to repeat my arguments.
I don't think that this debate will lead us anywhere, and since 14 players of this game aren't participating in this debate, I think that they're fine with the current situation.

[Pitboss Vikings]

i agree with cyber. majority are not concerned so lets let this die a death.

[Pitboss Korea]

Look man, I've studied criminal justice and the simple statement "harsher punishments do not prevent crimes" is not a fact. You can't just say it and its true, its true that murder isn't stopped by harsher penalties, that is true, but murder is a different crime than say embezzlement, insider trading, fraud, burglary, drunk driving etc.

But that is also, AGAIN, not pertinent to this issue at all. They are not even close to the same thing, its ludicrous that you keep bringing it up.

Just because 14 people aren't talking about it doesn't mean its a non-issue. More than 14 people voted, so its not like its totally irrelevant. I don't understand why you don't want a penalty in the game? We have no recourse for anything going wrong, and that is just careless. There's no harm in discussing it either, so there's no reason to stop. If we're just not going to have anything happen if you break the rule then what's to stop me or anyone else from breaking the rule all the time?

[Robert]

I have no problem with a pre-set range of penalties, but I fear that we won't be able to come to an agreement with the 3/4 of us, not to mention that 18 of us.

And I have no problem with you continuing the discussion.
I simply stop this discussion myself.

[Pitboss Vikings]

just rember cyber the rules orginalyl were agreed to by less than half the posters.. the rest were silent so in the original Org Thread this silence was taken as agreement.

so we dont need to get 18 people to agree only the ones that are noisy.

but you are right the ones posting here cannot come to an udnerstanding so the rule remains as is with no penalties.