"School Should Look Like" A.U.

[DanQ]

From ACS' <A HREF="http://civilization4.net" TARGET="_new">CivIV</A> section:

An Associate Professor of English at <B>George Mason University</B> in the United States is the latest individual in the academic world to recognize the efforts of <B>Apolyton Civilization Site</B>`s "Apolyton University" (AU) in published form. In <A HREF="/go.php?http://www.convergemag.com/story.php?catid=231&storyid=95685" TARGET="_new">an article for</A>&nbsp;<B>Converge Online</B> earlier this month entitled "Videogames and Good Teachers", Joel Foreman talks about the <FONT COLOR="#80000">many similarities</FONT> between the two named subjects and the <FONT COLOR="#80000">possibilities</FONT> their combination can bring about. <FONT COLOR="#80000">[W]hat good teachers (with or without technology) do well[: t]hey know how to engage and motivate students to pay attention, and to keep focused for long and productive periods on specific learning activities. In this regard, videogames are unparalleled. [..] But what, we might ask, are the players learning that has any value?</FONT>

The first piece of evidence Foreman uses to answer this question is AU, and the ongoing work of <B>University of Wisconsin</B> professor Kurt Squire. <FONT COLOR="#80000">Like good teachers, the videogames generate social excitement and energy that spill into planned activities. The result: the deep processing of learning in unexpected ways that suit the needs and desires of individual students</FONT>. This author also notes that <I>Civilization IV</I> developer <B>Firaxis Games</B> <FONT COLOR="#80000">sought out the best and brightest of the[se] "students," who "graduated" to employment on the design team</FONT> for the game. Squire is also quoted as saying <FONT COLOR="#80000">[t]his is a model of what school should look like</FONT>.

The other piece of evidence Foreman employs to support his argument is <B>Nesta Futurelab</B>`s "Racing Academy", <FONT COLOR="#80000">an interactive 3D learning game designed to engage student groups with the problematics of engineering design</FONT>.

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Dan; Apolyton CS

[H Tower]

aside from Trip, which apolyton members have been hired by Firaxis?

[Aeson]

Alexman is one.

[Strollen]

Wow what a cool article. I didn't know that Firaxis had hired some of the folks from AU...

At GDC and other places I've meet academic who study video games, but it seems like almost all academics focus on MMPORGs or twitch games not strategy games.

[Harovan]

Originally posted by Aeson
Alexman is one.

A very smart move indeed. Now we have the AU mod compiled into the game.

Oh please please please Alex, don't spoil Republic with a higher corruption setting. ... Oh wait... damn, wrong game.

[Tassadar500]

Glad to hear Alexman is a member of Firaxis.

[Krill]

to hiring Alexman

One of the smartest moves they could make...

[Fried-Psitalon]

Originally posted by Strollen
Wow what a cool article. I didn't know that Firaxis had hired some of the folks from AU...

At GDC and other places I've meet academic who study video games, but it seems like almost all academics focus on MMPORGs or twitch games not strategy games.

This is not entirely correct; as an educator myself (and a consultant of Firaxis who came originally from Apolyton, as far as that goes) many educators recognize that some strategy games are actually quite relevant to learning.

I know a math teacher that swears she can use Age of Mythology to teach proportions, fractions, and in some cases algebra in comparing the "rock, paper, scissors" mentality of the units.

Several history teachers have actually pointed to Civilization III as an excellent source of historical information. Some science teachers also particularly like how Civ shows the evolution of technology, to boot.

The problem is not that educators aren't aware of games like Civ - it's that the educational community as a whole is still very hostile to "video games," that horrible generic label that means "all games, including the ones where you kill hookers and run over policemen. It's a case of one bad apple spoiling the barrel. Admittedly, there's also cost involved - a classroom full of computers capable of playing Civilization III and 25 copies of that game aren't cheap - but that's probably a lesser factor to other problems.

Although it's changing, most teachers are old and near retirement - and lesser known but still true, the teachers who are coming in are trained by the old "Computers are toys" guard, rather than newer thinkers. Result: the advance of gaming as education is slowed even further. I'm 28; a young "hip" teacher to many of my students, particularly with my gaming business connections. I know what gaming has to offer. The lady in the room next to me teaching math has taught in that room longer than I have been alive. There's no way she'll ever use Civ IV - or any other game - as an educational tool, even though the proportional economics of such games could really take some of the most dry parts of math to an all-new plane.

Games and school have a future together, but it won't be for at least another ten years or so, as the effect of the 1950's-educated teachers fades with their retirement, and a new guard takes the floor.

[Fried-Psitalon]

I would point out, though, that the article makes a pretty major misstep - saying that the first major piece of evidence for why gaming should be in education is that you can get hired in the game industry....ugh... not exactly a way to win conservative parents over.

[Stuie]

Originally posted by Krill
to hiring Alexman

One of the smartest moves they could make...

Wow - I had no idea they hired him. That's just plain awesome!! My expectations for Civ 4 have just gone up.

[polarnomad]

Originally posted by Fried-Psitalon
I would point out, though, that the article makes a pretty major misstep - saying that the first major piece of evidence for why gaming should be in education is that you can get hired in the game industry....ugh... not exactly a way to win conservative parents over.

Agreed. I considered sending the link to that article to a very close friend of mine who is an inspiring and dedicated teacher, but that sentence has me hesitating...

[Mace]

Here is, IMO, what is fundamentally wrong with Mr. Foreman's education philosophy:

" [W]hat good teachers (with or without technology) do well[: t]hey know how to engage and motivate students to pay attention, and to keep focused for long and productive periods on specific learning activities."

Students shouldn't need anything to keep them "focused" or "motivated" other than their own desire to learn and better themselves. If they need something (other than their desire) in a classroom to keep them focused or motivated, then they should get out of the classroom and do something they can keep focused on, or do something that does motivate them.

[polarnomad]

Originally posted by Mace
Students shouldn't need anything to keep them "focused" or "motivated" other than their own desire to learn and better themselves. If they need something (other than their desire) in a classroom to keep them focused or motivated, then they should get out of the classroom and do something they can keep focused on, or do something that does motivate them.

While I understand what you're saying, the problem is that many countries require children under a certain age to attend school, and not all of those children actually want to be there.

[Fried-Psitalon]

Originally posted by Mace
Here is, IMO, what is fundamentally wrong with Mr. Foreman's education philosophy:

" [W]hat good teachers (with or without technology) do well[: t]hey know how to engage and motivate students to pay attention, and to keep focused for long and productive periods on specific learning activities."

Students shouldn't need anything to keep them "focused" or "motivated" other than their own desire to learn and better themselves. If they need something (other than their desire) in a classroom to keep them focused or motivated, then they should get out of the classroom and do something they can keep focused on, or do something that does motivate them.

Been out of school awhile, I see.

[Mace]

Originally posted by polarnomad


While I understand what you're saying, the problem is that many countries require children under a certain age to attend school, and not all of those children actually want to be there.

I didn't want to be there either! But I did it because I respected what my parents wanted me to do...which was go to school.

Been out of school awhile, I see.

naah the kids just need a kick in the pants, that's all
I did.