what do you use the Oracle for?

[slnz]

In my book, MC wins the Oracle first prize over CoL, since sometimes it's a pain to get Writing in time to be sure not to have an AI finish Oracle first. Pottery is significantly easer to acquire by the time. CoL is maybe a second and Monarchy a third; all generally speaking, without taking game-specific variables into account.

CoL is surely the best "prereqs cost vs tech usefulness" ratio, though. Using it on Theo is a waste IMO, you can complete it earlier and bulb Theo with the GP you get from Oracle.

[sorinache]

In my book, MC wins the Oracle first prize over CoL, since sometimes it's a pain to get Writing in time to be sure not to have an AI finish Oracle first. Pottery is significantly easer to acquire by the time. CoL is maybe a second and Monarchy a third; all generally speaking, without taking game-specific variables into account.

CoL is surely the best "prereqs cost vs tech usefulness" ratio, though. Using it on Theo is a waste IMO, you can complete it earlier and bulb Theo with the GP you get from Oracle.

I'd rather use the GP I get from Oracle to build the Basilica of Nativity / Temple of Solomon and start to cash in big time from each of the cities where the religion spreads. That way I can keep my tech slider to 80 - 100% while I settle a couple more cities.

[slnz]

That early the pennies you get from the GP don't compare to, say, grabbing CoL from Oracle instead and building Courthouses (not to mention an earlier Civil Service). Better to use the later GPs for the shrines.

[rah]

I like using that first Gpriest for the shrine so I can ramp up science specialists. I like not to pollute the pool since I've gone games where I never got the gpriest.

[slnz]

Good point. Though, if the next one is a scientist you can bulb Philo with it and grind Prophets with AW

[rah]

The first scientist is traditionally used for an academy in my cap. (unless my cap is my production city) Philo isn't a priority in an MP game, construction is. If your opponent can build a stack of cats before you, you have trouble. But maybe I should consider differently.

[slnz]

Yeah I'd imagine Philo is the last tech you'd race for in a MP game.

Total threadjack & MP-newbie post, but aren't HAs, especially NCs or (to a lesser amount) Keshiks a good alternative to racing to Cons? They destroy any cat stack in your territory and can be used to sneak-pillage metals (or more importantly, an Ivory if one exists). With FlankII they have a minimum 50% chance to flank cats, and NCs don't have a hard counter at all before jumbos.

[Ming]

I disagree on them not having a counter before jumbos... A spearman easily counters HA's and it's UU counterparts. You put some spears in the stack, and HA"s are going to have some serious problems. On the other hand, if you can hit a stack with a few cats first and nick the spearman, than a stack of HA's can pretty much finsih off anything

In MP, I may go after Horseback first if I have Elles in my territory, so I can start building stables and Shock Elles the minute I get construction. But I almost always go for construction first. Even in SP (aggressive ai) games, cats are the best defense against a SOD, and make conquest FAR easier in the early game.

[slnz]

I only said NCs (Numidian Cavalry, Carthaginian UU with 5 str, +50% against melee and a free Flanking I) don't have a hard counter, which I feel is true. Sufficient numbers of HAs can decimate any stack without jumbos, as a minimum of half of them survive while severely weakening the enemy (and those who survive get a godly amount of XP). If the enemy knows to prepare for them and makes a ton of Spears, the returns might not be so good, though.

[rah]

I agree if you have horses in your bfc and hook it quick, a stack of NCs is pretty much unstoppable if your opponent is close. On the other hand, in MP if my neighbor has an early UU, you can bet I'm preparing for it.

[Ming]

I only said NCs (Numidian Cavalry, Carthaginian UU with 5 str, +50% against melee and a free Flanking I) don't have a hard counter, which I feel is true.

I still disagree... Without any additional promotion modifiers (yeah, shock added later to well promoted NC or anti horse added to well promoted spearman), you have a 7.5 unit vs an 8. Throw in defensive bonues for hills, forest, jungle, fortification and I would call that a counter.

If the Carthaginians are near me in a game (or the Mongolians and Egyptians) you can bet your sweet life than I'm going to have some spearman built, and probably more than I usually build with more normal neighbors.

[rah]

If it's a neighbor two over you might catch them with their pants down since the ratio of axeman to spearman is higher in normal situations.

[Ming]

True enough... and the same holds true for me. If my direct neighbors don't have a horse UU, I'm usually preparing to defend a melee attack. So if an AI two away comes for me with a horse base attack, I'll probably be caught leaning unless I see it coming with enough time to whip the right units. Once you have cats, it's not much of an issue.

[Theben]

It seems that the Oracle is best used for the "infinite tech" trick...

It's not a bug, it's a feature.

[Ming]

OH CRAP... just what we don't need for MP games. SIGH!