Amphibious attacks always permitted for AI?

[dconner]

I'm getting a little ticked off, as one of my cities has been directly sneak-attacked (no state of war until the attacks began) twice in this game, once by Spain, then later by France. The Spanish had a wholly medieval army, the French with early gunpowder units too.

Each time, like, 20 units all of a sudden are storming ashore like they're Marines or something.

I know you *can* get the Amphibious promotion for non-Marines, but none of the surviving conquerors have ever had it (and even if only the destroyed units did, there'd be at least one cheating unit that takes the city.)

Has anyone else ever seen this? Are there any possible explanations? I set the AI to "Aggressive," but I wasn't under the impression that allowed them to cheat this badly.

EDIT: Oh, wait, anyone can do amphibious assaults now, they just have a penalty? Seems like the penalty doesn't hurt them a heck of a lot, if so.

[snoopy369]

Indeed this is true. The penalty is quite substantial, but certainly can be worth it.

[dregor]

Re: Amphibious attacks always permitted for AI?

Originally posted by dconner
EDIT: Oh, wait, anyone can do amphibious assaults now, they just have a penalty? Seems like the penalty doesn't hurt them a heck of a lot, if so.

It has always been like this, at least in Civ4, and the penalties are indeed pretty large.

[Wiglaf]

Re: Amphibious attacks always permitted for AI?

Originally posted by dconner
I'm getting a little ticked off, as one of my cities has been directly sneak-attacked (no state of war until the attacks began) twice in this game, once by Spain, then later by France. The Spanish had a wholly medieval army, the French with early gunpowder units too.

Each time, like, 20 units all of a sudden are storming ashore like they're Marines or something.

I know you *can* get the Amphibious promotion for non-Marines, but none of the surviving conquerors have ever had it (and even if only the destroyed units did, there'd be at least one cheating unit that takes the city.)

Has anyone else ever seen this? Are there any possible explanations? I set the AI to "Aggressive," but I wasn't under the impression that allowed them to cheat this badly.

EDIT: Oh, wait, anyone can do amphibious assaults now, they just have a penalty? Seems like the penalty doesn't hurt them a heck of a lot, if so.

Yes, there is penalty. Not a big one deal if the city is lightly undefended, or if the city has been weakened in some way.

[eHandel]

Actually the penalty is just 25%. Should be much more.

[Solver]

It's 50%

[snoopy369]

25% for rivers, 50% for offloading from boats. And if i'm not wrong it's a real 50% - ie, subtracts 50% from your attack strength - as opposed to adding 50% to the other guy (which is really only 33%).

[guermantes]

Originally posted by snoopy369
25% for rivers, 50% for offloading from boats. And if i'm not wrong it's a real 50% - ie, subtracts 50% from your attack strength - as opposed to adding 50% to the other guy (which is really only 33%).

Which are the cases when the penalties/bonuses are not 'real' ?

[snoopy369]

Certain bonuses add to your strength, some take away from the other unit's strength. I don't know exactly which though, but just watch when you do combat which adds to which.

[Wiglaf]

For instance an Anti tank gun gets 100% bonus to its attack versus armor.

Attacking across a river means -25% off the attacking units' strength. It is not a bonus for the defender!

This is important because by rule some units get no defensive bonuses. Eg, many horse mounted units.

Bottom line? Attacking a horse across a river isn't a good idea. Hope I have helped here.

[ColdPhoenix]

I think that the AI is a little too keen to attack off boats in the early/mid game. With my slow moving troops and roads I'm not going to be able to get many extra defenders in the city in that additional turn.

[Kuciwalker]

Sounds like the AI is definately keen enough, then.

[ColdPhoenix]

It wastes a lot of troops trying to take the city and then fails because of the penalty. I guess it doesn't know that I don't have a stack of troops ready to run in and help defend but I've had a number of wars which are basically the AI losing a massive stack in an off the boat offensive, I then take out a few of its ships, then it gives me money to make peace.

[Kuciwalker]

Sorry, misread your post.

[dconner]

Originally posted by snoopy369
25% for rivers, 50% for offloading from boats. And if i'm not wrong it's a real 50% - ie, subtracts 50% from your attack strength - as opposed to adding 50% to the other guy (which is really only 33%).

Are these numbers user-moddable, or is this sort of thing hardcoded? (Apologies if it's a dumb question, I've done precisely zero modding of Civ IV.....)