Warring (and preventing a war) for builders (SP)

[LarryM]

This is mostly an attempt to spark discussion, and perhaps get some answers, but I also have some information which may be helpful to less experienced players.

In perusing Vel's excellent guide and the related thread, one subject, though discussed, seems to get inadequate discussion. That's warfare for people who prefer peaceful buildup to warfare. Two sub topics: (1) preventing computer civs from attacking you, and (2) when you need (or should) abandon your peaceful building strategy for a little war.

(1) Preventing attacks - as a long time Civ 1, 2, and 3 player, I really needed to unlearn old habits. It's not enough to build up a decent army of, say, 2-4 units per city and maintain good relationships with your neighbors. You really need to keep an eye on where your military ranks vis a vis the computer civs. If it's weak, they will attack you, even if you enjoy very good relations with them. And the computer civs seem to build armies more aggressively than in prior games in the series.

Even if you win, an attack by a numerically superior army can set your progress back a lot, between the need to switch gears to military production on an emergency basis, loss of units, and pillaging. So best to avoid war except when you start it.

Queries for the more experienced players: (a) does the computer look solely to number of units, or does quality factor in? My experience suggests it's just numbers and not quality, but I am not at all certain of this. (b) All else being equal, what is the threshold that invites attack? I tend to be attacked when I'm ranked last, and/or when a neighbor has twice as many troops or thereabouts.

(2) When should you attack other civs as a builder? In prior games in the series, I usually waited until late game when I had a tech advantage and modern units. I get the sense that this strategy, which I've carried over to Civ 4, is not ideal for Civ 4. With the obvious caveat that it depends in part on the circumstances, how often do peaceful builders feel compelled to go to war, and at what point in the game?

Thank you for any comments or advice.

[rjmatsleepers]

One of the key factors to take account of is religion. Religious differences increase the chance of war - particularly with leaders such as Catherine. It can be worth changing religion simply to stay on the good side of a difficult civ.

Have you thought about dropping down a difficulty level and trying to win a diplomatic victory? This should give you some practice at managing relations with the AI.

Many players rely on their knowledge of the traits of the AI leaders to predict who will attack them - and perhaps get their retaliation in first. If you think this is meta gaming, you can play using one of the random options.

RJM

[LarryM]

As you say, religion does make a huge difference - I paid more attention to it (and diplomacy generally) last game, waiting until I was in the position to adopt the religion of two of the three other civs on my continent, and it made a huge difference (my second win at Prince; first Spaceship win at that level, as my other was a cultural victory). That being said, I've been attacked several times by Civs with the same religion and good relations. It may also be related to being ahead in victory points; being ahead in points but with a weak military seems to make one a tempting target for understandable reasons.

In any event, thanks for the response.

[couerdelion]

All of the answer to these questions are at a strategic level and three aspects spring to mind

a) Diplomacy – Keeping friends with your close neighbours will discourage them form attacking you. Depending on the situation, you might want to pick and choose your friends so as not to ally with nations who dislike each other. Lots of factors will determine which are the nations you need to keep close but more weight should be given to those where your relationship is more borderline and their military strength is greatest. For those civs who detest you or those that love you, you don’t need to make so much effort

b) Military strength – Keep your military fairly strong. The more powerful you are, the less likely they will attack. Be careful though, not to leave a weak link in your defences. An opportunist AI will spot a weakness and strike at it if you are not paying attention. It is easier to defend a city than to capture one.

c) Be prepared for war – Even if they do attack, a well constructed defence can turn a temporary weakness to your advantage. Even the best laid plans will sometimes go amiss and sometimes it might not even be possible for you to be certain that your neighbours will not strike suddenly. A few tips here are

i) Get yourself some insurance (either money in the bank to allow units to be upgraded, part-built units that can be instantly whipped, or a mobile defensive force that can quickly move to different cities depending on where the attack occurs)
ii) For defence, varied units provides a stronger defence (a spear and an axe gives much greater security than just a couple of archers)
iii) Know what resources your neighbours have (eg if they have ivory, then prepare to have some spears available – jumbos tend to trample everything else)
iv) Look for strategically sound city placement. Ideally, you want your enemy to attack you through a single defensible tile (a “choke point”). If this is a forested hill then a couple of fortified archers (with guerrilla promotions) will make life very difficult for your enemy
v) To counter stacks, build catapults.

[jbp26]

the strength of the units is factored in along with the numbers. you can test this by looking at your power graph before and after upgrading a bunch of units.

when you will be attacked is a mixture of the personality of the leader in question, your relations with them, and your relative strength. i think strength is the most important, if you havea big enough power lead, no one will ever declare war on you.

as for when to attack, its a matter of opprotunity. good terrain, resources, wonders, or a nearby capitol are always good reasons. so is a pre-emptive war.

[rah]

Yeah, a quick look at the power graph usually tells the tail. If they like you and you're ahead of them on the power graph, (not the score) they will not attack you.

If you're on the bottom of the power graph, expect to be attacked early and often regardless if they like you or not.

[LarryM]

Thanks for the answers guys. I must say that the need to build a fairly large army to prevent attacks was the biggest adjustment for me from prior Civ games.

I will also say that staying ahead of Neighbors on the power graph doesn't seem to be necessary (assuming good relations, and setting aside some of the more aggressive leaders), as long as you are not too far behind. At least that seems to be true on Prince. Which is a good thing, as keeping up with some of these Civs on the power graph would put a serious crimp in a peaceful build strategy.

And heck, if you have an army as strong or stronger than a neighbor, you might as well attack. Given equal numbers/quality of troops, a human should stomp an AI every time.