Civs that never amount to anything

[Rogerdude]

In my first Warlods game after installing the 2.08 patch, Isabella discovered Hinduism , as world's fisrt religion. Maybe she got lucky on a goody hut, or this is one of the changes brought to the AI.

[trev]

I have found Tokagawa makes a very good vassal, so eager to help you in wars, gives him the techs to fight with and he takes front foot in all wars, protecting your own units.

[sparkyal]

Consistently weak AI? I'd have to go with Tokagawa, Izzy, and Monty (although he is very annoying).

sparky

[zeace]

Tok and Izzy are very weak if they don't get into a good religious block. Often they research their own religions, and if someone has a different religion, the hatred is immediate. They'll never trade with another religion, so they fall behind unless a lot of civs share their religion.

AI like Gandhi or Saladin also found religions, but since they'll play nicely with others they don't tend to fall behind as badly.


The converse is that if Izzy does convert a lot of the world to her religion she can be crazy strong. I once changed my religion to hers even though I only had one fishing village that had the religion. It was the only way to keep her and her 4 allies from dog-pilling me.

[MasterDave]

I have had a couple of games where Monty got big and strong, and he can be a real pain in the arse when he has a tech and power lead.

I have only seen Tokugawa get strong once, most of the time he is a cellar dweller.

Wang Kon as an AI is also weak, although I think that his traits, starting techs, and his UU (I tend to get aggressive the moment I get construction) makes him one of my favorite leaders to play in multiplayer. A stack of Hwachas with a couple axes and spears really pwns human players, who tend to defend cities with axes and spears rather than archers.

[Virdrago]

Tokugawa is always weak in my games. It's very rare that he isn't someone's vassal by the end, because when he isn't he's dead. Isabella, too. They generally don't like me (even with the same religion), and someone usually squashes them (including me, if they are silly enough to attack me when I am waaaay ahead of them in the endgame... isolationists! ).

Saladin doesn't seem to do much in my games either. Usually someone has vassalized him, or he gets outmaneuvered for land, and doesn't catch up. Stalin doesn't go anywhere, either (but Peter and Catherine can do some damage).

Ashoka always gets three or four religions, but never has a military and gets dogpiled in the midgame. Everytime Ashoka is in my game, by the modern era, India has been partitioned by three or four other civs, and there's battles for the scraps. there's been more than one game where Ashoka had the highest score at the start of the medieval age, then had no score by the industrial age. Even with the highest score, he has a worse military than me!

[Dis]

He's weak in about 99% of my games. Only one game he managed to conquer most of America, and amounted to a halfway decent civilization.

[Diadem]

Strange, strange. Why is he weak for everybody but me?

I'm serious. I never got the impression that Tokugawa was weak. He seems to consistently be in the upper half for me. Never on top, but never on the bottom either.

[VonSharma]

I'd say the way to Tokugawa's heart is by giving him some gifts to butter him up. I do that with the Incan as well. Just give a tech or two and in about 5-20 turns, you might be able to get them to open up to you. Of course, having the same religion is cash $ as well.

[Henrik]

Originally posted by Diadem
Strange, strange. Why is he weak for everybody but me?

I'm serious. I never got the impression that Tokugawa was weak. He seems to consistently be in the upper half for me. Never on top, but never on the bottom either.

Perhaps you tend to play different map types than the rest of us?

[MilesGregarius]

Tokugawa and Izzy tend to be the weakest in my games, but Cyrus seems to get exterminated more often than any of the others. I can't remember how many times I've seen "The Persian civilization is destroyed" pop up early to mid game.

[Alexander I]

Originally posted by MilesGregarius
Tokugawa and Izzy tend to be the weakest in my games, but Cyrus seems to get exterminated more often than any of the others. I can't remember how many times I've seen "The Persian civilization is destroyed" pop up early to mid game.

Cyrus doesn't usually die in my games. He's too busy kissing my butt.

[Saurus]

Originally posted by MasterDave
I have had a couple of games where Monty got big and strong, and he can be a real pain in the arse when he has a tech and power lead.

As surprising as it may seem, Monty may get big if he can manage to win some ground early one.
Though I cannot remember him ever really having a tech-lead at the same time.
Even during one of my pangea-games were Monty had seized cotroll of half the landmass (and was heading toward a conqeust/domination victory), he was tehconolgicaly backward. However, his units just kept on coming. Wave after wave in a never ending stream until he wore down everything in his path. He took one city from this civ, then one city from that civ.. until his empire was so large there were no way of stopping him.