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Peloponnesian War Review: Will This Scenario Sink to the Bottom of the Aegean?

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  • Peloponnesian War Review: Will This Scenario Sink to the Bottom of the Aegean?

    This is the first of the new scenarios that I have played through to completion and I am pleased to say that it shows a high level of polish and potentially a very respectable amount of replay value, worthy of the Civ IV name

    I was intially intrigued by some of the early previews that described it as a chess-like scenario, and after playing, I find that to be a very fitting description.The interesting thing about the scenario is in order to win, you have to capture Athens/Sparta, and only have 100 turns to do so. So you have to think long and hard about building certain long term investments. Wonders are powerful and add to your score, but they are expensive as well, and may leave you weak enough military-wise that you are overwhelmed by your opponent. Even settlers are a risky gambit in the context of this scenario. There are several spots on the map that would be great to build an extra city, but considering they take 15-20 turns to build and then at least that long to grow and build basic infastucture in, they may end up being a red herring. You can achieve a time victory, but upon loading up the game, they describe this as a draw.

    Given the limited resources that have you access to, and the scenario's brevity, every single unit is very valuable, reinforcing the chess-like quality of the scenario. I played as the Delian League (Athens) who has the advantages of a stronger navy and wealthier, more cultured cities. The Athenians get triremes which of course own galleys for free and start off with strong techs that reinforce their science/naval focus like the one enabling triremes and constitution, The Spartans have a inland empire with more backwards cities, but they have a more powerful army. The Spartans start the game off with the dreaded Phalanxs which I had to spend a lot of time researching to gain access to as Athens. Overall though, my impression was that the two sides were pretty well balanced.

    The naval aspect of the scenario is actually interesting as there is are three seafood specials within Athens' fat cross, and several other cities have some too. The Spartans do a good job of using their modest navy to harass your fishing boats. Moreover, some of your cities are on far flung islands that will require galleys to ship troops that they produce to the front lines around Athens. There is also a possibility of launching a seaborne invasion of the territory around Sparta, bypassing several tough cities that are on the way.

    I think there is enough strategic diversity with the potential for a large variety of opening gambits and late-game strategies to make this scenario highly replayable. It's highly polished chess-like quality would make it a blast in multiplayer. Overall, I give this scenario two thumbs up and urge all Warlords owners to check it out. It really is a fun change of pace from the core game.
    http://monkspider.blogspot.com/

  • #2
    There is only one water resource in Athens's fat cross, but two more are just outside of it. I do have one queston how do you defend Athens? Should you try to defend all of Athens or just the major resources?
    USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA!
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    • #3
      I was pretty much able to defend all of Athens. You can keep a decent line of defense behind the river to the west of Athens. If you have to fall back, then you can. But doing this I was able to keep the whole of Athens defended until late.

      What happened for me is that I managed to push an offensive that took Corinth and was on it's way to Sparta, thinking that I had all the momentum in the world and victory was within reach. The Spartans crushed my army with a host of catapults and horse archers, and then retook Corinth after defeating my respectably sized defense force there and pushed me all the way back to Athens. I had to quickly poprush a defense force and managed to save the day by only the most narrow of margins. Pretty memorable.
      http://monkspider.blogspot.com/

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      • #4
        That's strange, I set up a line there. The first invasion simply looked at my defenders then left. I beat the second invasion. The third invasion broke through. By that the Spartan navy had destroyed my navy since their's was more focused so I quit.
        USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA!
        The video may avatar is from

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        • #5
          This is the only scenario I think I've seen favourable comments about. I've been meaning to try one out - maybe I'll choose this.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by DrSpike
            This is the only scenario I think I've seen favourable comments about. I've been meaning to try one out - maybe I'll choose this.
            Why don't you try Rise Of Rome as Augustus caesar (at least on Emperor ) . looks a bit like a RTS game , but it can be really fun ( and hard to win )

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            • #7
              RTS games are fun...

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Prussia
                RTS games are fun...
                I didn't mean RTS were no fun

                Just said that the way to victory in this scenario is kind of like "Praetorian,Praetorian,Praetorian,Praetorian and Praetorian again" which is quite restrictive compared to what cIV can offer...

                But it is a very good way to figure out how to use the GG ( you get quite a lot of them ) and to measure the power of the new Vassal feature..

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                • #9
                  I've only played three all the way through: Rise of Rome, Omens and Chinese Unification.

                  Rise of Rome is well made and appears to have replay value - depending in part if the Victory Resources move each game or if they remain in the same place - as does Chinese Unification. I enjoyed the latter quite a bit, although it felt a tiny bit short. Omens, on the other hand is (in my opinion) not very challenging and really only worth one play through, if that.

                  I played just a few turns of Peloponnesian War to get a feel. It looks to be a good one.
                  "Guess what? I got a fever! And the only prescription is ... more cow bell!"

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                  • #10
                    Well, this scenerio looks like one that would drive me nuts as the Doreans; dispite being a navy brat, I'm much more comfortable with comanding armies than navys in the Civ series.

                    As Sparta, I think it amounts to send a SOD over to Athens while watching your back, with the main benifits of many fall back possibilites if your SOD isn't big enough.

                    Athens does have potential flexibility to have their offensive force bypass most of the Spartan army and land in Southern Greece and stike north, but this is too much all or nothing for my tastes.

                    I do agree with an earlier poster that building settlers is almost certaintely a waste of time.

                    I'm currently playing Alexander and having a blast. I have a couple of task froces in front of my army pillaging the Persians ruining their economy (along with cutting off any reinforcements) in advance of my main army. The poor AI doesn't realize how quickly catapults even pre-accuracy reduces city walls to uselessness.
                    1st C3DG Term 7 Science Advisor 1st C3DG Term 8 Domestic Minister
                    Templar Science Minister
                    AI: I sure wish Jon would hurry up and complete his turn, he's been at it for over 1,200,000 milliseconds now.

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                    • #11
                      Hmm...

                      After the recommendations here for the scenario I decided to give it a try...and was pretty dissapointed. There wasn't much added in the way of unique or custom units, wonders like the Pyramids and Chitcen Izta(sp?) could be built. And finally it just wasn't that hard. As the Delians I just built a row of forts to protect Athens and stocked them with troops while building up my forces. Once I had enough I took my uberfleet and landed south of Sparta, pushed north and took the city easily. Now admittedly this did take me 67 turns, but most of that was spent waiting on units to get produced(I used 18 to take Sparta).

                      With the map so large Sparta does what the AI usually does when faced with large maps...trickles units in. Not to mention the ones it wasted up on Larissa instead of just going straight for Athens. The scenario would be alot better I think on a smaller map and more active allies. So far the only scenario i've liked has been Chinese Reunification, Omens and the Peloponnesian War have been letdowns. Still need to try the rest.
                      "Every good communist should know political power grows out of the barrel of a gun." - Mao tse-Tung

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                      • #12
                        Play on a harder level?

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                        • #13
                          FWIW, in my game on prince level I did see massive combined arms stacks from the Spartans.
                          http://monkspider.blogspot.com/

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                          • #14
                            I played on Monarch and I did see two to three large(around 10 units) stacks from the Spartans over the years while building up. But with the river, hills, and fortresses they were beat back. The worst I had happen was one of my fortresses get taken and destroyed once. I could play on an even higher level but the base problem is with the AI not focusing properly on its goals, not getting too little advantages.
                            "Every good communist should know political power grows out of the barrel of a gun." - Mao tse-Tung

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                            • #15
                              It feels like an arcade game, not chess. Waves of enemies and all that.

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