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  • UBs

    What are your thoughts regarding the newly-announced Unique Buildings?

    I'm refering to the IGN preview at http://pc.ign.com/articles/717/717727p1.html


    I'm running out the door to go to work, but I will edit this myself with some commentary when I get the chance. (Probably at work, if nobody's over my shoulder.)

    edit: OK, here we go...


    Mall (American) - modest, but respectable. Happiness from the late culture wonders is appropriate, but amusing. In spite of Washington's re-attribution to Charismatic from Financial, I'd be skeptical if an American player would be likely to build these for the culture.

    Madrassa (Arabian) - The ability to convert priests is going to be of great benefit to Saladin, especially for anyone who's going to slingshot, and possibly take Philosophy instead of CS. +2 culture is ok, but clearly a secondary benefit.

    Sacrificial Altar (Aztec) - Not being a huge proponent of whipping, I don't get the same excitement over this as the pop rushers. I'm willing to bet it will be a favorite, though.

    Cothon (Carthage) - +1 trade routes is an unbelievable boon for a Carthage played towards it. We're talking strictly oceanic cities, and trade routes are significantly hampered by poor diplomatic conditions, but potentially incredible with the Lighthouse and the Colossus on an archipelago.

    Dun (Celtic) - Free Guerilla I from your walls, a structure you aren't likely to build much anyway...am I the only one who thinks this sucks?

    Pavilion (Chinese) - The change to both Chinese leaders as protective is going to be quite a shock in strategem for China. The +25% culture bonus on top of that is possibly going to skew their style dramatically.

    Obelisk (Egyptian) - Helps get an early GP, and might be nice on an Earth map with all that flood plain, but otherwise not too important.

    Stock Exchange (English) - A strong financial bonus for an already-financial civilization. Too bad Financial doesn't halve bank building any more.

    Salon (French) - Not an incredibly strong bonus unless you're shooting for culture, and even then, it's a little on the meh side. I suppose Louis is a strong contender for that victory condition, at least.

    Assembly Plant (German) - Doesn't do anything other than add Engineer potential...this *could* be incredibly powerful, or incredibly weak, depending on your ability to support specialists. A Mercantile Germany with Statue of Liberty could be productive, indeed, however.

    Odeon (Greek) - Culture for colosseum makes it slightly more likely to get built, I guess.

    Terrace (Incan) - +2 culture on granaries lets you kill two birds with one stone. A very practical, if not overwhelming bonus.

    Masoleum (sic) (India) - lol at bonus from building a jail?

    Shale Plant (Japanese) - soso, I suppose. 10% production is never something to complain about, but you're still only looking at a boost to cities that you've built a factory in.

    Seowon (Korean) - solid. +10% research is like having another Monastery...including past Scientific Method.

    Mint (Mali) - +10% commerce is a fitting bonus for Mali, if a bit surprising on such an essential and early building.

    Ger (Mongolian) - I must have missed the memo...what's a Stables? Should that say it's replacing Barracks?

    Hammam (Ottoman) - Extremely nice bonus, especially for an expansive civ that could use the extra happiness more than the health from their aqueduct.

    Apothecary (Persian) - I'll assume this is in addition to the normal Grocer benefits. Ironic that the Persian UB comes well after the Persian empire itself, historically, but this helps make up for the loss of Cyrus's Expansive trait.

    Forum (Roman) - ...25% birth rate? Meaning contribution of extra food, I'm guessing?

    Research Institute (Russian) - would be rather overpowering if it didn't come so darn late in the game...kinda like the Internet. Guess all Great Library bonuses are destined to be relegated to late game minor effects.

    Citadel (Spanish) - Is that an extra 50% to the defense bonus, (150% total)? The siege weapon bonus is underwhelming, imho.

    Trading Post (Viking) - Awesome bonus for a seafaring people.

    Ikhanda (Zulu) - 20% to...city maintenance, like a courthouse? That would be most impressive for maintaining large empires, if you can get -70% to all cities' expenditure with a barracks and a courthouse.



    And for good measure...

    The Great Wall - 2 culture is rather ineffective for a great wonder, however the bonus is very nice for a game with those pesky barbs pestering you, and for protective leaders in general.

    Temple of Artemis - Remember what I said about the Carthaginian building? Yeah, have them build this, too.

    University of Sankore - unless the numbers get tweaked, a mere 2 research to each city doesn't sound like much in the scope of most of your developed cities having 30+, and a Bureaucracy capital having maybe well over 100.
    Last edited by Azuarc; July 12, 2006, 18:15.

  • #2
    Awsome! The only mistake I think Firaxis made (that is if it isn't a typo) is that Odeons replaces Colosseums instead of Theaters. In fact the image for theaters looks just like an Odeon.
    Last edited by Will9; July 12, 2006, 16:32.
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    • #3
      Here are my general thoughts on a few random UBs. We are pretty busy at work today, so I won't be able to write anything in depth.

      Aztec Sacrificial Altar - -50% unhappiness from whipping? Are you kidding me? That's great! Having always been a firm believer in the Aztecs, even considering the Jaguar to be a great UU, it pleased me greatly that they are getting one of the best UBs.

      Carthaginian Cothon- The extra trade route is huge, and can make Carthage into a commericial powerhouse is leveraged correctly.

      German Assembly Plant- +50% production to a factory is really great, while it comes pretty late in the game, combined with Germany's panzers it can really make a difference. I am pleased with Firaxis making Germany into a late-game nightmare.

      Japanese Shale Plant- While +10% production to a coal plant is horrible on several levels, including the fact that coal plants are often replaced by nuke or hydro plants, and that +10% is puny compared to the 50% offered by the easier to build factory. There has to be something else to this UB. The most logical choices are removing the health penalties or removing the coal requirement. I would prefer removing the health penalties myself. If this was done, the Shale Plant could be a good UB.

      Arabian Madrassa- One of the bottom tier UBs I would say. By the time I have built libraries, I generally have several options for getting great prophet points. The +2 culture is okay but nothing that can turn the tide of the game. While I can imagine a few scenarios where it could be nice, it is definitely one of the worst UBs.

      Greek Odeon- Another bottom tier UB. The colosseum is one of my least favorite buildings. There are many games where I don't build them period, and if I do, only in a couple cities at most. Not only does it replace a rarely used building, the effects of "+1 happiness from hit singles, +3 culture, and can turn two citizens into artists" aren't very exciting, to say the least.

      Spanish Citadel- I like it! Some have not had positive views of this UB, but the extra experience and the slowing down of enemies bombardment efforts make it pretty nifty. I can definitely see this UB coming in handy quite a bit.

      Chinese Pavillion- The +25% culture is very powerful, and should make China one of the top Civs for the cultural victory.
      http://monkspider.blogspot.com/

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      • #4
        The Japanese UB is clearly the weakest, it comes late in the game and it's a very modest gain, but I understand they needed a weaker UB to balance out the great trait combination they have.

        The German UB is clearly the strongest, it may come late in the game but it's incredably strong, makes a factory +75% with coal, and allows for 6 more engineers.

        The Russian is pretty weak, by the time you get computers there's not many more techs to reashearch, and I don't really need several future techs.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Qwertqwert
          The Japanese UB is clearly the weakest, it comes late in the game and it's a very modest gain, but I understand they needed a weaker UB to balance out the great trait combination they have.

          The German UB is clearly the strongest, it may come late in the game but it's incredably strong, makes a factory +75% with coal, and allows for 6 more engineers.

          The Russian is pretty weak, by the time you get computers there's not many more techs to reashearch, and I don't really need several future techs.
          Only 4 engineers.
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          • #6
            Oh, I don't know, I thought the Russian one was pretty good. It can give you a big late game edge. Two scientists per city is big when you add in all the library/uni/observatory/research lab modifiers, possibly even representation, and so on.
            http://monkspider.blogspot.com/

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Will9


              Only 4 engineers.
              Doesn't factory already allow for 2 engineers? Or was that the power plant?

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              • #8
                So far it seems the affects of the AP on ign is overall. Otherwise it would be way to unbalanced. The other UBs affect is probably in addition to the building it replaces.
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                • #9
                  Actually a number of the affects have been edited (like the Mongol Ger and Korean Seowon) The German Assembly Plant remains unchanged so it looks like it could very well grant the ability to make 6 engineers.
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                  • #10
                    Over on CFC, the IGN writer confirmed the bonus of the Shale Plant.
                    " the Shale Plant is just like the Coal Plant except that it provides power WITHOUT needing coal. It still carries the -2 health penalty."

                    I suppose it can be seen as relatively decent now. Still probably one of the weaker UBs.
                    http://monkspider.blogspot.com/

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by monkspider
                      Over on CFC, the IGN writer confirmed the bonus of the Shale Plant.
                      " the Shale Plant is just like the Coal Plant except that it provides power WITHOUT needing coal. It still carries the -2 health penalty."

                      I suppose it can be seen as relatively decent now. Still probably one of the weaker UBs.
                      Hah, I called it!

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                      • #12
                        Re: UBs

                        Originally posted by Azuarc
                        Masoleum (sic) (India) - lol at bonus from building a jail?
                        Great. We get the lamest UB to go with our lame UU.

                        Most Indians get cremated, too
                        Only some Muslim kings would build mausoleums.
                        What they have to do with jails is beyond me, too
                        THEY!!111 OMG WTF LOL LET DA NOMADS AND TEH S3D3NTARY PEOPLA BOTH MAEK BITER AXP3REINCES
                        AND TEH GRAAT SINS OF THERE [DOCTRINAL] INOVATIONS BQU3ATH3D SMAL
                        AND!!1!11!!! LOL JUST IN CAES A DISPUTANT CALS U 2 DISPUT3 ABOUT THEYRE CLAMES
                        DO NOT THAN DISPUT3 ON THEM 3XCAPT BY WAY OF AN 3XTARNAL DISPUTA!!!!11!! WTF

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                        • #13
                          Re: Re: UBs

                          Originally posted by LordShiva


                          Great. We get the lamest UB to go with our lame UU.

                          Most Indians get cremated, too
                          Only some Muslim kings would build mausoleums.
                          What they have to do with jails is beyond me, too
                          QFT

                          There must be balacing in the first patch, or prerealease.

                          Too much of this is bull****.
                          www.neo-geo.com

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                          • #14
                            Re: Re: UBs

                            Originally posted by LordShiva


                            Great. We get the lamest UB to go with our lame UU.

                            Most Indians get cremated, too
                            Only some Muslim kings would build mausoleums.
                            What they have to do with jails is beyond me, too
                            I think you're missing the point. Don't think of it as a special jail, think of it as a new building that has some good uses (happiness) and a lame one (jail effects).

                            It's at least as good as a colliseum...


                            Oh wait, maybe it is weak after all...

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Thedrin
                              Actually a number of the affects have been edited (like the Mongol Ger and Korean Seowon) The German Assembly Plant remains unchanged so it looks like it could very well grant the ability to make 6 engineers.
                              Well I went to CFC and didn't see anything about that so...
                              Last edited by Qwertqwert; July 13, 2006, 21:03.

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