Some ideas for the expansion

[MadDjinn]

Originally posted by Adagio
Future: 100 years into the future would be nice (and thereby delaying the space race victory)

add some things, like manned travel to Mars, etc as things to do would be good as well.

jumping from hitting the moon once (and not even setting up shop!!) to going far far away is a bit too quick.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Solomwi
You can switch to Organized Religion. It allows missionaries without monastaries.

Only for your state religion, IIRC.

[Willem]

Originally posted by djpsychonaut
Right, I know that, but if you go to a war with a Buddhist nation and you have no Buddhism in your other cities, you aren't able to spread the religion if the war takes place after Scientific Method. I think you should be able to.

Why would you want to spread someone else's religion, especially if it's an enemy? Every city that has that religion gives the founding civ 1 gold, plus if he/she has anything but Free Religion, they can see every unit you have there. You're just giving an enemy an advantage by spreading their religion for them. It doesn't make any sense.

[Willem]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger


Only for your state religion, IIRC.

No, for any religion that's in a city. At least if you also have your state religion established there as well.

[Jabutron]

Originally posted by Adagio
What I'd like to see in an expansion pack: ...

Future: 100 years into the future would be nice (and thereby delaying the space race victory)

Absolutely. They can find a few more techs: quantum computers, string theory/unified field theory, superconductors, etc. We don't need far-out techs like in CtP2, but some additonal ones along the lines of current research would be nice.

And why the heck does an interstellar vessel use chemical rockets?! Thrusters shouldn't come until fusion - at the earliest.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Willem
Every city that has that religion gives the founding civ 1 gold, plus if he/she has anything but Free Religion, they can see every unit you have there. You're just giving an enemy an advantage by spreading their religion for them. It doesn't make any sense.

Only if he has the holy shrine built. If you are on your way to Free Religion it's nice to have another one in your cities.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Jabutron
And why the heck does an interstellar vessel use chemical rockets?! Thrusters shouldn't come until fusion - at the earliest.

It could use ion drives. We already have these.

[Adagio]

Originally posted by Solomwi
Adagio: I like the idea of a religious victory condition, but requiring the ownership of all holy cities makes it, in part, yet another "semi-conquest" condition, like domination. Maybe lowering that requirement to two or three shrines/holy cities and compensating somewhere else, or allowing for victory through intense spread of a single religion would do the trick. Or maybe my concern is unfounded, and it turns out to be a good victory condition for requiring a builder/conquest combination approach.

Here's my other idea for a religious victory:

To get such victory you have to own the holy city for your state religion and x% of all cities in the world should have your religion
When you only have one holy city x is 100%, but for each holy city you own, it goes down with 5, so owning all holy cities will only require you to spread your state religion to 70% of all cities
Maybe you can also get a small reduction for each opposing Civ that has your state religion (based on percentage, not actual numbers), so if all other civs have your state religion it's reduced with another 20% (while if only 50% of the other civs has it as their state religion, it's only reduced by 10%)

/me hopes this makes sense...

[Jabutron]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger


It could use ion drives. We already have these.

Not practical for interstellar use, unfortunately. Too much propellant needed, not fast enough, takes waaaaaay too long.

Realistically, they should drop the AC Space Race (since no techs researched would lead to interstellar travel) and make it an inner-system colonization. I realize it's not as grand as exploring strange new worlds, but it's actually doable. Besides, then you can work on space-based weaponry to really dominate your opponents.

[Urban Ranger]

Civilization is NOT a realistic game. Stop complaining that it is not realistic.

What really gets me is there are a billions things that are unrealistic about the game. You are not supposed to be able to found cities by sending out "Settler" units. Slavery doesn't work that way. Population growth of a city is determined by far more than just surplus food. A city should be able to work more land than just the "fat cross."

So please, if you complain, find something more basic about the game mechanics to complain.

[djpsychonaut]

Originally posted by Willem


Why would you want to spread someone else's religion, especially if it's an enemy? Every city that has that religion gives the founding civ 1 gold, plus if he/she has anything but Free Religion, they can see every unit you have there. You're just giving an enemy an advantage by spreading their religion for them. It doesn't make any sense.

Think Cultural Victory... I'm after the temples and Cathedrals. Besides the founder of Buddhism in this particular game that I'm playing is pretty weak and I could just grab the holy city from him anyway.

[Solomwi]

Originally posted by Adagio


Here's my other idea for a religious victory:

To get such victory you have to own the holy city for your state religion and x% of all cities in the world should have your religion
When you only have one holy city x is 100%, but for each holy city you own, it goes down with 5, so owning all holy cities will only require you to spread your state religion to 70% of all cities
Maybe you can also get a small reduction for each opposing Civ that has your state religion (based on percentage, not actual numbers), so if all other civs have your state religion it's reduced with another 20% (while if only 50% of the other civs has it as their state religion, it's only reduced by 10%)

* Adagio hopes this makes sense...

That would work well to focus the victory condition on fostering your religion, rather than taking over the work of others. That at leats feels more like it's in the spirit of what a religious victory should be.

[Willem]

Originally posted by Solomwi

Adagio: I like the idea of a religious victory condition, but requiring the ownership of all holy cities makes it, in part, yet another "semi-conquest" condition, like domination. Maybe lowering that requirement to two or three shrines/holy cities and compensating somewhere else, or allowing for victory through intense spread of a single religion would do the trick. Or maybe my concern is unfounded, and it turns out to be a good victory condition for requiring a builder/conquest combination approach.

I had the same idea but I suggested founding 4 out 7 religions and your state religion gets established in 60% of the cities in the world. That makes it more of a domination type thing instead of a conquest.

[Willem]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger


Only if he has the holy shrine built. If you are on your way to Free Religion it's nice to have another one in your cities.

Even still, there's no sense in helping some civ spread their religion for them. Let them do it themselves, they're the ones gaining most of the advantages.

[Solomwi]

Originally posted by Willem


I had the same idea but I suggested founding 4 out 7 religions and your state religion gets established in 60% of the cities in the world. That makes it more of a domination type thing instead of a conquest.

That could work, too. By semi-conquest, I meant that by requiring control of every holy city, you're pretty much instituting a de facto period of a good bit of war-mongering, though short of total conquest, to get the victory.

The way I see it playing out in most games (there would, of course be exceptions) under that condition is that you found and spread what you can in the early to mid-game, then when you're in a position to, go on a massive killing spree to snag those 2-3 holy cities you weren't able to found yourself or see close neighbors you would've fought at some point anyway found. Maybe I'm viewing it too narrowly, but (a) that makes it very similar to domination in the way you actually get to the win, making it redundant and (b) that didn't seem like the type of victory Adagio was trying to craft.

Requiring 4 or fewer holy cities lessens that aspect significantly.