CD/DVD issues censored on Apolyton ?

[Leuenberg]

I posted yesterday a thread asking to fellow CIVers if they had a workaround for the strange behaviour of the DVD protection on CIV preventing the game to run on the HD only.

Surprisingly I got my thread presumably cancelled by a zealous admin !

The lawyers at 2K surely mention in their stupid EULA (who read it anyway ?) that one cannot duplicate or circumvent any part of the program. But we all know we have the right to do so !.

Since these lawyers don't have any better understanding of technology than a cow does algebra we end up with a game crippled by yet an other copy-protection scheme.

I would have understood such a topic banned on 2K games forum, but on Apolyton ? Guys you are not paid by 2K !

[Senethro]

Re: CD/DVD issues censored on Apolyton ?

Originally posted by Leuenberg
I posted yesterday a thread asking to fellow CIVers if they had a workaround for the strange behaviour of the DVD protection on CIV preventing the game to run on the HD only.

Surprisingly I got my thread presumably cancelled by a zealous admin !

The lawyers at 2K surely mention in their stupid EULA (who read it anyway ?) that one cannot duplicate or circumvent any part of the program. But we all know we have the right to do so !.

Since these lawyers don't have any better understanding of technology than a cow does algebra we end up with a game crippled by yet an other copy-protection scheme.

I would have understood such a topic banned on 2K games forum, but on Apolyton ? Guys you are not paid by 2K !

Quoted so that the oppressive powers that be can't keep the people down!

You sure your thread wasn't moved? And keep in mind that people from apolyton are invited to playtest the new games. Therefore, kowtowing to scary men in suits is necessary.

[baboon]

Something that could work, but isn't allowed according to the EULA, is making an image of the dvd and run it with a free program called Deamon Tools. You need to turn on something like Securom.

However you shouldn't do this, it's bad. It doesn't matter that you bought a dvd with problems, it just plain bad, you foul software thief!

[Leuenberg]

Originally posted by baboon
Something that could work, but isn't allowed according to the EULA, is making an image of the dvd and run it with a free program called Deamon Tools. You need to turn on something like Securom.

However you shouldn't do this, it's bad. It doesn't matter that you bought a dvd with problems, it just plain bad, you foul software thief!

Shh ! don't mention pratical stuff or they will again cancel the thread. There's a lot of things that one could do to be able to play CIV without the DVD, just Google for it ...

I'm just asking why this kind of discussion is banned on Apolyton ? We are legitimate owners trying to use the game there is no reason our discutions on this kind of topic should be banned.

[LzPrst]

EULAs are in no way binding contracts since they are provided only AFTER you have purchased the product.

furthermore you have the right to access your legally acquired product in any way you choose. so if you develop or download software that allows you to access your legally purchased software in a different way than intended by the producer, they cant legally prevent that, as long as you dont exploit it for illegal\commercial purposes.

(Warning, non-legal basis)
and lastly, any digital laws are made by people who are clueless about the digital universe and\or influenced(bought and paid for) by software companies. the people of the internet are not represented by big business therefore they do not have the political strength of large corporations, and therefore corporations get to influence laws, but the people dont.

does anyone see a legitimacy problem here? the power to give and enforce laws derive from the people, therefore any law that goes against the will of the people is by definition illegitimate and void.

(serious once again)
Software consumers should get organized to protect their interests. if we dont contribute to the political process we havent really got a right to complain when consumerhostile laws are passed. unfortunately digital laws are not yet an important part of most political parties programs so we are left to do lobbying. unfortunately as software consumers arent organized and thus dont have access to the financial or legal powers that consumer hostile corporations do, laws will be passed that are not in the people\consumers interests.

are there any real software freedom organizations out there that are open for all software users? kinda like labor unions, but with digital freedom as political agenda? if not, we should start one...

[Leuenberg]

Re: Re: CD/DVD issues censored on Apolyton ?

Originally posted by Senethro
You sure your thread wasn't moved?

Yes, here's the link to the cancelled thread in hope some fair admin will review it and (hopefully) reinstate it

Originally posted by Senethro And keep in mind that people from apolyton are invited to playtest the new games. Therefore, kowtowing to scary men in suits is necessary.

Well, I fear you could be right and the guy canceled my thread to please 2k instead of an overzealous Apolyton AUP enforcement

[LzPrst]

power to the people!
the geek shall inherit the earth!

[Josquius]

You don't actually own the game if you've bought it. All you have is a license to use it so they can according to the law do anything they want, they can one day just suddenly make it illegal for you to use the game at all if you've bought it and all they may have to do is give you your £20 back.
The laws are really unfair but they are the laws of the land

And Civ 4 has some pretty harsh copy protection I hear so I doubt its a case of making a simple image (which is a shame, one of the things I loved about civ 2 was how quick it was to just load up in the background and play without hunting the CD though 4 has finally finished 3's work of kill that )

[LzPrst]

you have a license to use the programme...
you therefore have a license to use the program in whatever format you can put it in. therefore you may no-cd crack it all you want.

there are ways of doing that. but I'm not allowed to say how since apolyton does not accept that we as consumers actually have rights towards the product we have paid for. of course there are ways to abuse such information, therefore you have to have the brains to figure out how on your own. either develop the software to do it or find someone who has already...

just know that its not too difficult to find a way around the copy protection...

[Bill3000]

Deleted thread, not cancelled thread. TV shows get cancelled, threads get deleted.

And that proves nothing, technically; instead, you could have just provided a link to a nonexistant thread. Either way, there's already roughly 34234235423 threads on these topics, and there's no need for another.

[Josquius]

Originally posted by LzPrst
you have a license to use the programme...
you therefore have a license to use the program in whatever format you can put it in. therefore you may no-cd crack it all you want.

there are ways of doing that. but I'm not allowed to say how since apolyton does not accept that we as consumers actually have rights towards the product we have paid for. of course there are ways to abuse such information, therefore you have to have the brains to figure out how on your own. either develop the software to do it or find someone who has already...

just know that its not too difficult to find a way around the copy protection...

With old games yes. With new games though the license you agree to specificly points out that you legally can't use such things.

[Leuenberg]

Originally posted by Bill3000
Either way, there's already roughly 34234235423 threads on these topics, and there's no need for another.

And would you be kind enough to direct me to one of them ?

I do hope that if this subject was raised that much, Apolyton would have changed it's policy.

[Saldrin]

I see both sides of the argument here, and honestly I don't know what side of the fence I sit on.

I see the consumers side, me being one, who wants to burn the CD image to HD. Heck, I do it, I have a hardrive on my system dedicated just for my CD1s so I don't have to go about looking throught my CD collection to find the play disk. Plus, I have three kids, the youngest being 6, oldest 13, all of who want to play Civ 4, and quicky after that play a different game that requires yet another CD. Kids are not the best at putting CDs away. Heck, I'm not the best at putting CDs away...

Then I see the developers side and don't want media "copyable". It would suck to work years on a project and not get paid. Bad enough developers have to deal with publishers. Throw pirates in the mix and there is a lot of money circumvented away from the people doing all the hard work.

I've suggested this before on a different site, but a usb key card or even a smartcard that holds the "authentication" required to run the game would be so much better than requiring a CD. Want to play the game? Spank the USB/Smartcard in the computer while the CD is safely filed away. Almost all computers have USB ports, and most newer computer motherboards have smartcard options.

[Aro]

Originally posted by baboon
Something that could work, but isn't allowed according to the EULA, is making an image of the dvd and run it with a free program called Deamon Tools. You need to turn on something like Securom.

However you shouldn't do this, it's bad. It doesn't matter that you bought a dvd with problems, it just plain bad, you foul software thief!

Besides that, it will not work with Daemon Tools.

[Saldrin]

Originally posted by Aro


Besides that, it will not work with Daemon Tools.

True. I tried Blindwrite and DTs and it didn't work with Civ4. There is an a newer version of DTs out, but I read that you have to unplug the cables to your drives for it to work properly.

Thats more work than digging for the CD is ya ask me therefore not getting installed.