how to make other civs convert or adopt?

[Lucilla]

A question about the foreign advisor screen:

There are the options convert (to my state religion) and adopt (one or more of my civics). Sometimes, these options are red, meaning that the other civ does not want to adopt or convert. So far, so good.

But most of the times, my religion and my civics are not even listed. Why is that?
At first, I thought this is because the other civ doesn't have the required technology yet, so this is a non-tradeable item.
But even much later in the game, when all civs have discovered e.g. all techs required for all religions, there is no option available for converting. The same goes for civics, where I'm sure the other civ has the required tech.
Any ideas?

[Peets]

They already have them?

[Lucilla]

They already have the tech (Hinduism), but their state religion e.g. is either none or Judaism and my state religion is Hinduism and I still don't get the option to ask them to convert to Hinduism.

[Boracks]

Maybe you have to send missonaries to spread the religion to a number of their cities?

[Lucilla]

So you mean, I have to spread the religion to at least some of their cities first before that "convert" option becomes available?
What would I have to do for the "adopt" possibility then? I can't send a missionary to spread slavery...

I know, that when sending enough missionaries, they might convert by themselves eventually, but this is not the point.

I rather think, that I'm missing some other requirement to be able to make other civs convert/adopt in the foreign advisor screen. Maybe I need for instance the same religous civic to be able to convince them. So we would need to be both following the Organized Religion civic. This would explain why I can get the option with some civs but not with all of them.
This is just brainstorming about what could be a limitating factor, but still it is not clear to me what the exact requirements are.

[sabrewolf]

they must

a) like you enough and
b) profit from the change enough to do so. eg. if you force them to take tribalism, they'll be unlikely to do so unless they REALLY love you!

[sabrewolf]

in case of religion they need plenty cities to see it worth. after all, they do not gain the bonus of having their "own" religion as their state religion...

[Lucilla]

Sabrewolf,

your answer explains, why the items are marked in red, but in my case they are not even visible. Maybe a screenshot explains better what I mean:

Napoleon does not want to adopt Tribalism (item is red) and cannot convert to my religion (Hinduism) - the option does not exist, not even in red.
So I understand why an item is red, but I don't understand why an item is not there.

[Kekkonen]

Does Napster have any cities that have Hindus?

Edit: He probably hasn't, since he doesn't have polytheism. He can't convert because he doesn't have the tech to be a Hindu.

[Lucilla]

As addition to that, I cannot offer to convert to Buddhism or adopt Slavery as both options are not available on my side of the screen.

[Lucilla]

Originally posted by Kekkonen
Does Napster have any cities that have Hindus?

Edit: He probably hasn't, since he doesn't have polytheism. He can't convert because he doesn't have the tech to be a Hindu.

Indeed, I missed that he doesn't have Polytheism. That explains that.
I just gave him Polytheism as a gift, but still I can't see anything in the convert options (not even after I pressed end of turn).

[Kekkonen]

I think he needs to have at least one city with Hindus. I don't think you can convert to a religion which nobody in your empire practices.

In general, I've assumed that the red option means that you don't have enough goodies to make a deal, even though it's theoretically possible. Total absence means that the option isn't possible even in theory.

[Martinus]

Giving him polytheism, once you founded the Hindu religion, will not do anything, since only the first person to research a given tech gets the religion. You will need to spread Hinduism in his city or cities first, by sending missionaries - only then there will be an option for him to adopt it.

Also, is he the one who founded buddhism? In this case I wouldn't bother, since even if he converts to hinduism, he will convert back after few turns (unless there was an overwheling advantage for him to go Hindu, e.g. all his cities had that religion, while buddhism was in only a part of them).

[Martinus]

Also, I don't think the player can offer to adopt a civic or convert to a religion as part of the deal - the demand to do so must come from the AI (especially with civics this makes sense, because a leader like Nappy who I believe favours Representation couldn't care less whether you adopted Slavery like him or practiced Tribalism - the only point of interest for him is what Government civic you have).

[Kekkonen]

Also, is he the one who founded buddhism? In this case I wouldn't bother, since even if he converts to hinduism, he will convert back after few turns (unless there was an overwheling advantage for him to go Hindu, e.g. all his cities had that religion, while buddhism was in only a part of them).

You can do it, but I'd suggest a modified techinque: spread your religion to his cities, take the Buddhist holy city, then kick Napster's door in and inform him that his options are Hindu France or no France.