PETITION: Delay Civ 4 Until Easter...Please Sign!

[yin26]

Well, my definition of "Yined" would be: "to run into the barrage of criticism from yin26 regarding Civilization and get royally pissed by it"

Ah, well that's a perfectly reasonable definition! I was thinking something much worse.

[Myrddin]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph



But the game should be released, when the list of known bugs and issues is empty. I.e., all bugs and issues are not only found, but fixed!

In the real world this will never happen, no software can be guaranteed bug-free. I want them to release the game when they are happy with it, not when it is perfect.

[Zoid]

Originally posted by Xorbon
The stupid barbarians in Conquests are pretty hard to miss! Especially if you play the 'Three Sisters' mini-scenario.

But the barbarians have always been stupid! As I said I have never played PtW where the barbarians apparently are a lot smarter...

[Zoid]

Originally posted by yin26

Well, my definition of "Yined" would be: "to run into the barrage of criticism from yin26 regarding Civilization and get royally pissed by it"

Ah, well that's a perfectly reasonable definition! I was thinking something much worse.

Heh, unlike some posters here I don´t want your head on a plate.

[Alex]

Originally posted by Myrddin


In the real world this will never happen, no software can be guaranteed bug-free. I want them to release the game when they are happy with it, not when it is perfect.

Well, they seem to be pretty happy with the game right now...

[Harovan]

Originally posted by Myrddin
In the real world this will never happen, no software can be guaranteed bug-free. I want them to release the game when they are happy with it, not when it is perfect.

I didn't say bugfree. Stop trying to teach a software developer about bugs. I said free of known bugs, which can very well be achieved, if both sides, developers and testers, do their job well. Patches exist not to fix bugs discovered during development or beta. They exist to fix bugs discovered after release.

And I prefer the game to be released, when I am happy with it.

[Paddy]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph


I didn't say bugfree. Stop trying to teach a software developer about bugs. I said free of known bugs, which can very well be achieved, if both sides, developers and testers, do their job well. Patches exist not to fix bugs discovered during development or beta. They exist to fix bugs discovered after release.

And I prefer the game to be released, when I am happy with it.

enough said.

[hexagonian]

Originally posted by Aro
My vanilla Civ III crashed as soon as installed, but I restarted the game and did something different... And It worked! Eventually, crashed again, and again, I just reloaded and played.

Life is too short for CTDs.

I'd be chucking the CD out the window...

[Aro]

Originally posted by Sir Ralph

And I prefer the game to be released, when I am happy with it.

Unless you're a Firaxian (are you? ) or a beta tester (are you? ), the only way to know if you're happy with the game is buying it... After the release date...

Otherwise, you can be happy or unhappy, but only with the reviews, the lack of info from Firaxis, the screenshots, some posters here etc. It's impossible be happy or unhappy with Civ IV without actually play the game.

[Aro]

Originally posted by hexagonian

Life is too short for CTDs.

I'd be chucking the CD out the window...

Life is too short for nervous breakdowns.

But few years ago, I kicked my scanner away, literally... A couple of friends were wittnesses of the episode, and they said that I looked absolutely insane!

The poor thing never worked again

[Harovan]

Originally posted by Aro
Unless you're a Firaxian (are you? )

No. Not even American.

or a beta tester (are you? ),

No. I don't have time for this. I will barely have time to play when it will be released.

the only way to know if you're happy with the game is buying it... After the release date...

No. Believe it or not, but there are still people left on Apolyton, who both love the game, and retained a critical mind to give honest reviews. They are extremely rare, but they exist. And I trust them. When they say, the game is good, I'm sure I can be happy with it, even without actually having bought it.

But I will buy the game nonetheless, because I believe, that it will be good. I expressed multiple times, that I am sure, that Firaxis learned their lesson. May be not in the very first week, but I will buy it by all means.

Otherwise, you can be happy or unhappy, but only with the reviews, the lack of info from Firaxis, the screenshots, some posters here etc. It's impossible be happy or unhappy with Civ IV without actually play the game.

Stop nitpicking.

I said I'd like them to release it, when I am happy with it. Meaning, in the ready state, described above, without bugs and issues left.

I will praise Firaxis and give them credit, when credit is due. Because I want a great Civ game. And judging so far by the announced features, it will be great. The only thing, that can get wrong now, is that they blow the quality. It is complicated. It is like Civ3 squared, by difficulty.

If they succeed to release it with a good quality, with all features working and roughly well balanced and with finetuning being left for patches, I will be the first voice in the choir of cheering fanbois. And I expect nothing less than that.

I will however call a buggy mess a buggy mess, when I see one. I did so with Conquests, for which I had similarly high expectations, and I will do it with Civ4 too, should the unbelievable happen.

[Jaybe]

It IS good to know the excuse for Civ3 not having any more updates for so long: they were not only working on Pirates!, but also Civ4 (from scratch).

[hexagonian]

The one thing that makes me optimistic is that the game has been playable for a long time (I thought I remember hearing that they had a workable and playable build in Q1 2004...)

[Paddy]

excuse... still robbery to ave made so so much money from a product many have purchased, and they would not fix...

[Darkstar]

Well, I expect the game will ship with some known bugs and issues. I understand Sir Ralph, and would prefer the same. However, it is an industry standard to release a game and have your first patch ready to fix some of the issues you ran out of time fixing before validation and localization deadline forms you to ship off the product.

I just hope that Civ4 out of the box doesn't have many significant CTDs that are easy to find, and that none of the major features are obviously broken. They can beta test the game for 10 years, but the code will always have some issues. No signigicant mass of code is ever perfect, and even if it is, you still have to get all the weights correct for fun gameplay.

I want the best, most perfect game. But I expect the standard piece of distressed digital flesh that Firaxis has delivered in the past on release. If we are lucky, it will be as TIGHT as SMAC. Why do I say that? Because Firaxis has always gotten away with it. Do you really expect them to change that behavior? I don't. Civ4 will sell in huge numbers, even if you cannot install the version that is on the first run CDs. It's Civ. It's going to sell regardless of what a few hundred people might post about it on game forums. And to make it worse, most people expect 2 to 4 patches in the first couple of months. So they know they have a lot of leeway. That will just help the Big Cheeses choose to make their marketting deadlines, rather then let it cook until the developers feel it is truly complete.

I hope I'm wrong, but...