Paradigm Shifts

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Padmewan
Another idea I was kicking around today was some idea of "resetting" upon hitting a new era. I was thinking specifically of cultural resetting -- that your cultural points take a big hit when you advance to the next era. After all, the fact that Egypt had one of the most ancient civilizations / temples / etc. doesn't give it latter-day cultural "points" -- for better or for worse, the U.S. dominates culturally today. Yet in Civ3 it's impossible for this to happen, since culture accrues continuously and even logrithmically.

The closest analogy to this in Civ3 are GW's that expire upon discovery of a certain tech -- in particular, the Great Library. If you have the GL, you try hard not to research Education. Imagine that on a larger scale -- you must decide whether to advance to the next era or hold on to your advantages of the current era. You could decide to hold on to the past and thus either a quick victory or eventual stagnation. Or you could opt to take a big hit but be better off in the long run.

I like giving the player these kinds of tough choices. It also happens to coincide somewhat with "reality."

I like this idea. I think it is compatible with another idea discussed in the Culture list- namely, a floating culture number, i.e. that culture is not an absolute sum but rather a comparison of your output to your rival's.

As your civilization progresses, the cultural output of previous-age buildings should diminish with time.

Many would feel that this is introducing too much complexity in a game that should remain close to its roots. I say bollocks. C3C is already doing what it should do quite well; instead of wanting Civ4 to be a glorified expansion pack, they should just stick to it.

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Cmonkey
Sim-civ would be better. Die Firaxis!

[Max Sinister]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris
As your civilization progresses, the cultural output of previous-age buildings should diminish with time.

I dunno. Old churches aren't worse than modern ones, maybe even better (tradition is a big part of religion). Old universities don't have to be worse than modern ones (if you keep them updated and funded, that is). Factories are different... but isn't all of that already covered in maintenance?

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Max Sinister


I dunno. Old churches aren't worse than modern ones, maybe even better (tradition is a big part of religion). Old universities don't have to be worse than modern ones (if you keep them updated and funded, that is). Factories are different... but isn't all of that already covered in maintenance?

I see your point, and we're on the brink of a serious historical debate... but I'd say that on the long run, a clear tendency towards cultural erosion can be seen. What are the Pyramids worth in culture today? Do the French draw as much proudness from Notre-Dame than they did back in the 14th century?

Your misconception could very well due to the fact that you don't make a difference between old culture that still has a direct effect on the population (say, by 300 BC the Oracle was still well alive, and probably had gained some prestige from its old age) and old culture that is truly dead. The Sistine Chapel may still have a strong appeal to Christians, but in 1000 years it's probably going to be a mere tourist attraction, just like ancient ruins are today.

I believe that this principle has always been implicitly recognized in all Civ games with the Wonders expiration date.

[Epistax]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris
What are the Pyramids worth in culture today?

They are world renowned ancient wonders left still standing which mesmerize people to this day. When they were first made they weren't recognized wonders-- they were big tombs. Almost no one outside of their culture had ever seen them and the average person hadn't heard of them. Now, you'd be hard pressed to go two weeks without seeing the pyramids mentioned in some way, shape or form.

Granted, this is culture turned to fame (not to mention money) so if you want to decrease the cultural output of a building with age, you'd better increase something else regarding it.

[Vince278]

Should the cultural and tourism factor peak then decrease with time. The Pyramids are the only Seven Ancient Wonder around now and even then they are falling in serious disrepair.

[Addled Platypus]

But the precursors (1,000's of years) to the Great Pyraminds are the Megolith structures throught Btritian, and are still a tourist attraction, albiet smaller and easier to repair.


were does one draw the line?

[Quezacotl06]

About food and transportation: irrigation produces more food when it has a rail, which is supposed to mean increased trading between cities.

[Quezacotl06]

And pyramid culture really doesn't count, cause egypt was conquered by arabia. So it doesn't commit to their culture.

megalith structures were just european temples, which should increase in cultural output over time, because it's a part of increased heritage. But the 1's in britain are just ruins now, and are more of a memorial thing than a cultural thing. The UK has crocette, tea, and irish drinking songs for that