The Quick and the Dead

[Out4Blood]

Congrats.

As to a MP wonder crunch win. I don't think so, although Egypt's wonder advantage MIGHT work, but the problem with wonders is they are a dead giveaway. As soon as you got TWO, I know what you're doing and I'll go ALL OUT MILITARY on your least defended towns. Since your resources are going to wonders and ALL of mine is going to military, you probably won't have the resources to stop me - my army will just be too big. Even if you get all the wonders built, I probably still be able to drop a town or 2 before the timer expires.

[Out4Blood]

Okay. Fine. I dunno why the recording was messed up. Here's a 6:02 conquest victory.

[Out4Blood]

If that wasn't good enough, here's a 4:45 conquest.

I don't think I could get too much faster. Maybe using one less heavy infantry for 20 sec or so, but then killing the buildings takes longer and you take more damage...

[Drachen]

I just got it down to 8:53 but 4:45? Don't you know that steroids and jet fuel are bad for you?

[Drachen]

Ah...you mean till capital captured. I have actually lost the capital after winning it a few times today so my time is based on the Capital timer retake running down. The Turks have a nice advantage in their 200% faster city assimilation because local barracks are a big hassle even after city capture. My weaker heavy infantry took longer and I didn't get the capital till 4:57.

I'm sorry I misunderstood your first game post but when I looked at the achievements section it said "no winners" unlike the initial victory screen which states you won. Hmmm...two different end game messages?

Looking at your game gave me an idea for surer AI victory. If we take our first couple of heavy infantry along the sides to the opposing capital we can probably meet our last two heavy units there at about the same time and get the ruins bonuses that lie more heavily along the edges. This might get us a market and resource or age advance and unit upgrade; or it might take too long.

O.K. Rushing 101 complete. Now...

[Out4Blood]

Originally posted by Drachen
Ah...you mean till capital captured.

No, I mean till the GAME OVER screen. If you kill off all of the cities, you do not need to wait for the capital timer or assimilation timer. Hence, you get a CONQUEST victory. So, that is VICTORY at 4:45, not just taking the town.

...local barracks are a big hassle even after city capture.

Take the expansion cities beofre he can make troops.

I'm sorry I misunderstood your first game post but when I looked at the achievements section it said "no winners" unlike the initial victory screen which states you won. Hmmm...two different end game messages?

I dunno what happened to that recording. My bad.

O.K. Rushing 101 complete. Now...

One caution. The comp is horrible at defending a rush. This can win SOME multiplayer games (or a LOT if you play poor players) but it's extremely risky. Mayans are almost immune, or if your opponents get a temple up, you'll be hard pressed to take the town. Also, a tower and militia or a barracks and 1-2 archers are gonna ruin this.

[Drachen]

I agree that a rush like this is a valid strat against the AI but probably a poor bet in multi and if I ever do multi I probably won't try it unless I'm trying to wrangle in a noob; like I'll be if I start.

As to your posted game and comments. I completely agree that a conquest victory will bring up the Game Over screen. Also, I see your point that taking over the expansion cities on the way to the Capital may get you the conquest and a faster win than 8:53. But...I also see an enemy city, Kalinpor, left when I examine the map of your posted game and the achievement screen states there were no winners. Perhaps I'm missing something? It really doesn't matter because if you say you won in 4:45 then I'll take your word for it.

[Out4Blood]

But...I also see an enemy city, Kalinpor, left when I examine the map of your posted game and the achievement screen states there were no winners. Perhaps I'm missing something? It really doesn't matter because if you say you won in 4:45 then I'll take your word for it.

Hmmm, not sure what's going on. Are you watching the RIGHT game? (There are three of them now.) I d/l the 4:45 and it played perfectly fine for me. The 4:45 game is me against Turks. He builds two towns and I get them both. If you STILL have problems, there might be some sort of version conflict going on with versions of the game. Rec game is just the commands, the game engine handles the re-visualization.

[Out4Blood]

Since these were so easy, thought I'd go for a real challenge. Here's another game - handling TWO TEAMED AIs. (None of that sissy FFA stuff.)

Kinda makes me wonder what is possible, because the capital sack bonus more than makes up lack of economy. It's possible you could take over MORE than two like this. Not to mention that with more AIs, they are going to be even closer to you, so you can finish them more quickly.

[Drachen]

Originally posted by Out4Blood
Hmmm, not sure what's going on. Are you watching the RIGHT game? (There are three of them now.) I d/l the 4:45 and it played perfectly fine for me. The 4:45 game is me against Turks. He builds two towns and I get them both. If you STILL have problems, there might be some sort of version conflict going on with versions of the game. Rec game is just the commands, the game engine handles the re-visualization.

Well now I am confused. I also downloaded the file again and it's named "4-45 victory over toughest." Kyoto is in the lower right quadrant. Your barracks gets built over the woods to the left. You take Keyseri on the way to Istanbul and after you take Istanbul the game ends. What I see on that screen is a town to the right of Istanbul named Karapinar and When I open the achievments screen it states no winners.

I just landed a 4:59 using Romans v Greeks on an outback map and now I'll download your 2 on 1 game and take a look.

[Out4Blood]

Well, that's weird. It's definitely RIGHT game and all. Must be a version conflict then. Like I said, a rec game is just the series of events and commands that were issued, so in a different version, different things might happen. If it's not too much trouble, you might try viewing in the original version. Can't MP on this machine, so I never upgraded it.

[Drachen]

Very nice work. An interesting decision to run your scout down ruins lane rather than go for quicker assurance of enemy location.

I've been messing about with wonder Crunch and I suspect you may be right about it and multi. When spending the resources to build a proper defense I wasn't able to get the wonders started soon enough. On the other hand, my game play was terrible today and I suspect that I can improve. What sort of defense would you try to use; just wondering.

[Out4Blood]

Originally posted by Drachen
Very nice work.

Thanks

What sort of defense would you try to use; just wondering.

For wonder crunch, you might try towers/forts with max attrition and max militia upgrades. Toss in a few spies to mass convert cav or siege. Don't be afraid to call-to-arms and attack with villagers.

[Drachen]

QUOTE] Originally posted by Out4Blood

Thanks


For wonder crunch, you might try towers/forts with max attrition and max militia upgrades. Toss in a few spies to mass convert cav or siege. Don't be afraid to call-to-arms and attack with villagers. [/QUOTE]

That’s what I do for AI but for multi I would expect that my opponent would bypass the static defenses. For instance, I find the diamond defense described earlier absolutely dominates the AI, but that's because the AI will attack whatever is in front, i.e., the city and when the city is reduced it charges with its army which is then trashed by my troops garrisoned in the tower and fort to the left and right. I really don't care much if the city is reduced because I always get it back and I fully expect the city to take a beating; taking the enemy blows without being destroyed is one of its major functions. A human commander wouldn't make such an obvious blunder and would either bypass to get to the economy or find a way to reduce the static defenses before going in with his troops. I would use some spies but with Egypt that's a disruption rather than a major counter because they are too expensive to mass since I'm building wonders and too vulnerable after they bribe. I would of course use the strat you suggest but I would think that it would have to be augmented significantly by a quick response force and some sort of warning system.

In regards to our game post discrepancy I find that if I select solo quick battle the version displayed lower left is 01.14.06.0500 which I believe is the latest version. It may be that there are other reasons for patching other than MP?

PS; I tried to attach a "print screen" bitmap of the final game scene but it was too large even as a zipped file. I can email it if you're interested or if you know a way to reduce it's size and want to see it then let me know.

[Drachen]

4:12 Japan v Greeks outback.