Term 22: insert title here

[Whoha]

Going with plasma cannons because we aren't researching the physics line yet.

1.5 damage per space vs ~3 damage per space on the plasma cannons.

[Whoha]

I'm not worried about an attack on Cryslon because there is a ship overhead. I have them all on housing just out of habit, if theres a more optimal build take the governorship and give me some orders.

I think I overlooked the wormhole on Lesath, I'll have to send something there to check it out.

[vmxa1]

Here is a thought on Cryslon II. It is 2/21. It ihas AF and the AMC and then housing queued.

The planet is size 21, I would think a cloner would be useful. Maybe I am paranoid, but I do not put anything in the que ahead of Marine, AMC on a captured planet, if not a tele. I have had to many rebellions.

In fact I will buy those items, if they cannot be built in one turn.

Leasath (sp) can make a Starbase in one turn and then a spaceport in one turn. This will pay off in a hurry. You will save the cost of the CP you are in the hole for and boost the income by 50% on the planet.

It now does 20 + 4 = 24BC. If you go SB, port it will be 20 + 4 + 10. Then if you switch the unassimilated workers to research and go to trade, it will yields 71BC and the extra RP.

You can then put the other planet that is on trade to doing something with no lose of cash.

The good news is that Leasath will still grow at amost the same rate. It will be over 300K. Plenty for 13/16 planet. As planets get closer to full, they do not grow as fast.

I did not follow the bit about physics. You can't get to plasma cannons without getting phasors via research. I know I use to be in love them as well as they sound so cool.

[Gilgamensch]

vmxa1,

can I assume (at least for the moment) you a governour for Cryslon and Leasath?

Just checked my table, haven't got any information about them ????????

Now for the rest:

Sounds good.

[bakalov]

We should worry about rebelions when we go for the Sarka. Silicoids are simply too weak.

We captured the plasma cannons, so it is a captured tech. No minituarization will be possible in the physics clone soon. So plasma cannons should be ok for now.

[Whoha]

Originally posted by vmxa1
I did not follow the bit about physics. You can't get to plasma cannons without getting phasors via research. I know I use to be in love them as well as they sound so cool.

we captured both weapons from the silicoids.

[vmxa1]

Originally posted by bakalov
We should worry about rebelions when we go for the Sarka. Silicoids are simply too weak.

We captured the plasma cannons, so it is a captured tech. No minituarization will be possible in the physics clone soon. So plasma cannons should be ok for now.

Yes if capturing Saks and Creative, I will drop an Arm Barracks after the Marine, AMC. I often will unload troops as well, if the planet has a large pop and I am a uni.

Ok, I figured it was a steal or captured tech. I did not mean, that a refit would be good, only to point out that 5 cannons are not better than 12 phasors. Especially since you do not have to close on the targets to offset the range penalty.

[vmxa1]

Originally posted by Gilgamensch
vmxa1,

can I assume (at least for the moment) you a governour for Cryslon and Leasath?

I don't know what that entails, but I figured I could toss out some thoughts for Whoha to consider. Maybe for the board to shoot down and disect.

Then either I could learn something or alert the team to another option. I am unaware of the overall plan, so what I mentioned may be wrong for those plans.

[Whoha]

that just means telling me what to do with those colonies.

later on after orion we may do a little thing where we pass the save around to each governor for each turn.

[Whoha]

that just means telling me what to do with those colonies.

later on(after orion we may do a little thing where we pass the save around to each governor for each turn).

[Whoha]

Originally posted by vmxa1


Yes if capturing Saks and Creative, I will drop an Arm Barracks after the Marine, AMC. I often will unload troops as well, if the planet has a large pop and I am a uni.

Ok, I figured it was a steal or captured tech. I did not mean, that a refit would be good, only to point out that 5 cannons are not better than 12 phasors. Especially since you do not have to close on the targets to offset the range penalty.

12 phasors do 360 damage.(optimal)
5 plasma cannons do 900 damage.(optimal)

the range dissipation penalty isn't that bad.

once we do get some mods(SP for instance), phasors become better.

[vmxa1]

Originally posted by Whoha


12 phasors do 360 damage.(optimal)
5 plasma cannons do 900 damage.(optimal)

the range dissipation penalty isn't that bad.

once we do get some mods(SP for instance), phasors become better.

Seems incongruent with your statement above that phasors do 1.5 and cannons do 3 damage. I don't understand how more than twice as many phasors now do barely a 1/3 of the damage of 5 cannons, but I will take your word for it.

Me I like to stay far back from planetary defense while I paste them, this makes cannons a lot less attractive.

[Whoha]

Vxma, heres how I do it.

Heavy Phasors do 7-30 damage per 20 space. That works out to 1.5 damage per space assuming an optimal hit(the range is likely dissipation).

Heavy Plasma cannons do something like 4-45 damage, per 50 space. But they are naturally enveloping, so that number is * 4, so its 16-180 damage per weapon, for 50 space, which works out to 3.6 damage per space again assuming an optimal hit.

The most damage 12 phasors will do its 30 * 12, which is 360. The most damage 5 plasma cannons will do is 45*4*5 which works out to 900.

Now of course there will be dissipation, and the plasma cannon will suffer 2x as much from it as the phasor will, but do the math there and we get that if the phasors lose 10 points each, the plasma cannons lose 80 points each(4 each plasma cannon subhit is reduced 20), that still works out to 20 points of damage for the phasor(of which we can have 2.5 per plasma cannon), and 100 points of damage for the plasma cannon.


Only at the extremes of dissipation loss do we get into a situation where phasors would be better, but as distances close, the plasmas eat the phasors for breakfest.

For planetary defenses remember that shielding extracts a heavy toll on phasors, a rad shield with class 3 shield level will take 8 out of 15, as opposed to 8 out of 22.3*4. 12 phasors in that situation will do 84 damage, while only 1 plasma cannon will do 89.2 damage, again ignoring dissipation.

[vmxa1]

I may not have this correct, but here is my understanding of those two weapons.

Phasor 5-20 dmg size 10 cost 10
Plasma 6-30 dmg size 25 cost 15

Both have CO and HV for mods and phasors have PD and AF.

Miniaturization is:

Level beyond tech Size cost

0 100% 100%
1 80 75
2 65 55
3 50 40
4 35 30
+4 25 25

So cannons will not really ever miniaturize to the level of a phasor as you will not beusing them by the time you are more than 4 levels beyond. So phasors will always be cheaper, hold more and a key thing made faster.

One of the side affects of miniaturization is it also speeds of the production of the device.

Now these would both have HV at this point in the game. Hv will give a 50% boost to damage and double the size and cost.

So what does that leave for these weapons at no miniaturization?

Phasor 7-30 size 20 cost 20
Plasma 9-45 size 50 cost 30

I can now get more than twice as many phasors. So for size 100, I get 2 cannons and 5 phasors. That is 18-90 dmg vs 35-150 dmg. I am going to ignore the range, which is 2x. I am going to ignore the envloping.

One more thing to consider is that with 12 vs 5 guns, I have greatly increased my changes to hit. All the damage in the world is only a potential, if it misses.

The times 4 is where I part company. That is only hitting 4 shield facings and that is rarely of any value to me. The typical combat does very little other than face to face firing and maybe a slight turn to 45 degrees. So my busting it rear shields is of no value to me.

Planetary shields are a problem for most beams. This is why I switch to disrupters when they appear, if I am running into them.

Again, I think you over state the value of cannons on planets as they are not very effective either and can do nothing to barrier shields no matter how many you have.

Like I said, I love cannons as they sound so good, but no longer use them and do not even research them as a non creative race.

None the less, you will not likely suffer with either one.

[Whoha]

The enveloping mod makes it hit all 4 sides, shields or not. Once your aft shields are busted that subhit hits armor/structure/internals at that point. Try it, take down a shield facing, then hit the ship with a plasma cannon, it will do damage to the 3 shield facings, and to armor from the downed facing.