Hi, I'm new, having trouble >.<

[Crabz]

Hello everyone, I just picked up MOO2 again after losing it 3 years ago in the 'junk room'. I'm glad to be back, but I've forgotten everything.

:Madban: YIKES. I always seem to run into problems around spying. I tend to run sub/lith and some other combo, because I like the large pops and the ability to obsess Research/Prod on diff planets or in combo etc.

Every game I play goes great and fast up to about class V shield or terraforming... I dunno turn numbers yet. I start getting robbed out of my mind, everything I try to keep as an advantage (tech wise, my play type) gets stolen away. I don't know how to work this out... any help?

Thanks,
-Phil

[vmxa1]

I like to make spies as soon as I make contact or even before if creative. If creative I have more for them to steal as a non-creative, I can wait longer.

If your have no -spy or traits that hurt spying, you should be ok, if you do not delay on researching Tele Training.
I normally will go to N. scanners quickly and get the tech that boost spies in all cases.

Once I get a planet (other than the primary ship building or researching one) to were all structures are doen, it ill just make spies for a long time. I want 4 spies vey soon and then I want to put some out to steal. If I am creative, I will not bother stealing, if I am a tele, I will put the spies on sabatoge instead of espionage.

Later I often put any planet that just finished it final build to make one spy before going to trade. This keeps spies coming in until I get a ton.

One other thing I may do is to use the Darlok picture to prevent them from being in the game.

[Whoha]

Production

[Crabz]

Yikes, I have another problem...

I was reading the backed messages about the start of that democratic game, and I realized I always scoff at my early game tech choices, I usually get colony ships and engines first... That's bad? I had never stopped to think that strengthening my planet is a stronger decision. If anyone could break down the 'jist' (sp?) of it for me I love to read strategy, I just can't find anything anywhere about moo2!

[The Mad Monk]

I tend to shoot for automated factories first, then research labs, in pre-warp.

I know a lot of other people like it the other way around, but this seems to work better for me. I don't even look at ship techs until my home system is fully colonized, with the possible exception of freighters.

If I actually luck out and get four colonizable worlds in my home system, it may be five to six years before I even launch a scout.

[bakalov]

I tried to play from the starting position of our democracy game for a speed kill. By turn 180 there were only two alien systems left, with my ships headed towards them (1 psilon and 1 gnolam). I did not build even a single colony from the starting race - played only with the homeworld until t.110 and then conquered everything within 70 turns ... That's an example for a start position-independent race. If you play correctly, you always win.

[vmxa1]

Several players have posted a turn by turn run down of games.
I have a few, bakalov and garth vader and others.

First I may suggest changing the sublith for a UniLith. This will make it easier to handle spies.

[vmxa1]

Here is a start path for a UniLith. Understand I am not saying this is the only way to play, but you will win.

Settings: Rep -GC -SD Lith Uni RHW LHW Huge PreWarp Mineral Rich 8 players Impossible Antarans ON Tactic Combat.

Worker dispositions are shown as x/y/z, where:
x= number of workers on food production
y= number of workers on industry
z= number of workers on research

R-abc denotes I started a new research project this turn and abc is the name of it.

AF= automated factory
CB= colony base
HW= homeworld
OP= outpost
PP= Pollution Processor
RL= research labs
SA= Space Academy
SB= star base
srt stands for started


T0 all on ind, srt CB, sold barracks
T6 colonized II , srt CB on HW, Housing on II 0/1/0
T12 colonize I, move 1 from II to HW, 0/1/9 on HW, R-EC, Housing on I, 0/1/0.
srt spy (this is a place holder)
T15 R-freighters
T17 R-std cell, switch HW to freighter
T20 R- CS switch to unarmed scout on HW
T22 srt prebuild
T24 srt second scout, sent scout out, Hire Gizmo
T24 scouts out, R-labs (0 RP),
HW 0/14/0 switch to CS (9 turns) I/II housing 0/1/0
T31 2 more pop moved to HW as they did not increase speed of CS, made them Sci 0/14/0
T35 CS out, srt CS (8 turns) 0/15/1
T38 colonize Naos set to housing, scout can move again
T43 CS out, srt CS on HW
T45 colonize Hali, other scout can move
T50 R- hulls (may consider Bio as HW full), switch to lab on all, buy on all,
but HW as it is 2 turns for CS
T51 Hali 0/1/0 housing (poor Huge), Naos 0/1/1 spy Pre for AF, Nazin I 0/1/2
spy Pre for Bio as Size 4, Nazin II 0/4/0 Lab
T52 HW finished CS, sent it out and do Lab 0/3/13 one turn.
Now follow this tech run, turns are dependant upon the planets you are dealt, but will be close.
Freighters
Std Cells
Colony Ship
Electronic Comp
Research Labs
R Hull
Auto Fact
Bios
Soil
T84 Laser
T93 Super
T95 B Pods
T98 Spaceport
T102 Robos
T103 Space Academy
T106 Duets
T109 Merc
T110 Augie
T116 Irridium
T121 Fusion Rifle
T123 Tach Comm
T132 Zort
T141 Antimatter Drive

[Garth Vader]

Interesting, I wouldn't have thought of selling your barracks.

Also, I usually transfer people from the HW to colonies so they will grow faster. Interesting to see that in the other direction.

[vmxa1]

If you are a Uni, no need to pay maint on it and that 30 BC can be useful at this stage. Later you can built a barracks in one turn to make transports.
As a UniTol, I often don't put up a barracks for a long time, just dust all the planets and start over. That 1 in 20 for converting pop is dangerous, especially if it is Sakkra.

[vmxa1]

In this race you want to get the HW up to full or nearly full size ASAP. This is where you will be making colony ships and maybe combat ships. You may come up with a better planet later and change to it, but for now.......

This is also true if you have a AHW, pack that puppy quickly. Much later, sending pop out can be done. I normaly do not bother, due to lazyiness. The only time I send pop out to grow other planets is if I am in a scoring run. Then I want to get all planets up quickly.

[Crabz]

Well vmxa1, I kinda did what u said, and I kinda didn't.

I played demo/lith.... I like sci more than production. I was lucky enough to start with a huge ultra-rich and a medium ultra rich in my main, along with an abundant small >.<. This game must have been 200x easier, I don't know what I did differently except my start. Thanks for everyones help! I'm not pro, but I'm having fun

[bakalov]

Interesting challenge for a demo/lith race is to defeat the guardian before turn 100 :P

And Garth, colonies grow faster if they have less pop, not if they have more .... just look at the indicator of the pop growth.

[Garth Vader]

I always noted that they grew faster with 2 than 1, and faster yet up to around half full. But as they get close to full the growth slows.

I might be confusing this with another game, I'll check... if I remember!

[vmxa1]

No you are correct. The more you have as industry the more growth you get up to a point. The thing is (to me) that you want to pack the HW, but at some point yoou start to have too many structures that you need on the colonies and have to let it grow.
This tends to occur after the HW hits it normal pop max, before you add terraforming or any other pop boosting tech.