Improving Economy

[Hydro]

One of the keys to Gal Civ 2 is getting income that allows you to maximize your industrial capability, and gives you extra cash for upgrades, emergency purchases, building infrastructure, and supporting an increasingly expensive fleet. I’ve compiled a number of tools posted by others here, at the GalCiv2 web site, the Wikipedia, and I’ve included a few others I haven’t seen mentioned (see survey frigates, below).

If there are others I’ve missed I’d be delighted to know of them!

Settings
• Have eco improvement as a racial pick
• Pick a Federalist government (+20 eco)

Management/Empire Options
• Prioritize techs that improve your race’s economy rating: Xeno Eco (+10%eco), Xeno Bank (+5% eco)
• Prioritize techs that improve economic structures at a given planet: Xeno Eco (Adv Market Centers, +10%eco/ea), Xeno Trade Centers (Trade Center, +15%eco/ea), Xeno Bank (Banking Center, +20% eco/ea), Galactic Stock Exchange (Stock Exchange, +25% eco/ea)
• Build economic capital at large planet with lots of trading center improvements AND a big population (10B+). Keep the population happy.
• Set up trade routes. The farther and larger population of the target planet the more $$.
• Build eco star bases with modules that enhance trade. If possible, overlap 4 more eco starbases from adjacent sectors so they also cover key planets. Example: with 8 eco starbases with 30% trade bonus/each: 16 bc (base trade from 1 freighter) x (1+(8x0.3)) = 54 bc/turn. This enhances the 144 bc/turn from 9 trade routes to 486 bc/turn. SBs beyond those allowed by your logistics level can be costly, so be prudent.
• If your ethos is good, research Xeno Ethics switch to Good and you’ll get a 25% bump in trade income from other good races. Hint: prioritize trade routes with likely good races.
• Change to Republic government (+10% eco), Democratic (+20% eco), or Federation (+35% eco) [a priority in my games]
• Improve morale so that taxes can be increased - building entertainment centers, particularly on tiles with a happiness bonus; get morale special resource, if you can; build galactic achievements (Frictionless Clothing, Harmony Crystal, Spices). Higher approval = higher tax rate = more $$
• Eco special resource – mine the heck out of it! Defend it!
• Increase population – people equal taxes, so more people mean more taxes! Keep approval high to improve pop growth
• Shut down ship, social, or research production at one or more planets; this can shut down factories and save $$
• Improve influence – seems to be correlated with both area and intensity. Building a few influence star bases in remote unclaimed space may increase tourism $$. Building them in an AI’s territory will likely annoy them; be prepared to defend yourself if you take this passive-aggressive action.

Short-term Cash Strategies
• Explore anomalies – research Sensor I to get survey ship modules and build a survey vessel on a small hull with the best engines and at least 1 support. If your ship is spd 6+ you’ll get twice as many anomalies as the slow flagships – so the faster the better. With a half dozen or more cheap survey ships you’ll get more than your fair share of cash from space junk ($500/$750/$2500) and racial improvements (some of which may be eco). These are great to build early before your planets have enough pop for a colony ship. They also do a great job scouting territory for colonization. When the anomalies are done set to Explore or decommission the lot (many may have high experience or HPs, so they may have other uses if upgraded).
• Sell tech to minor races – sell them almost anything (and in particular really cheap early weapon techs), and use them like an ATM. For instance: sell ECM 1 in one go, then ECM II, etc to milk them all. If there is a lot of tech trading bundle several different techs (ECM1, Laser 1, Armor 1; then ECM2, Laser 2, Armor 2) since this expedites the process. If you have multiple minors you can sell to them all the same techs and get 5-10K! NEVER sell or techs that improve the AI’s diplomacy or your future dealings will be decreased! Warning – if you plan on invading then you are increasing the tech level of the minor, which will make the ground assault more difficult. If you’re pure EVIL you’ll milk them dry, and then invade anyway. With enough transports it won’t matter.
• Sell tech to major races – be careful. Select weaker races that have a relatively poor diplomatic rating and technology. The AI will likely sell/trade your tech to other AIs, so only give techs that are lower on the tech tree that you don’t mind being passed around. Low level military techs are a good option. NEVER sell or techs that improve the AI’s diplomacy or your future dealings will be decreased!

[tetley]

A few comments:

- Most definitely pick the economy racial bonus. Federalist is also a good party pick, but in the latest build, +20 economy only costs 3 AP. Technologist (+20 research, +1 sensor) is 5 AP.

- I have never found large economy planets or trade starbase modules all that great. They help, but...not a whole lot.

- More significant than the trade modules on the economic starbases are the manufacturing bonus modules. Half of the bonus production you get from those is free.

- All 3 alignments have economic benefits. Good also gets 5 free initial colonies (~60bc/turn worth). Neutral gets sizable morale & planet tile benefits. Evil can safely spam Economy starbases since it doesn't have to pay up-front costs, and it's got a couple extra Super Projects that really help.

- One catch with population is, your income only grows as a function of the square root of the population. In other words, get your teeny-weeny colonies populated ASAP, as it's hard to squeeze more out of those 20b pop planets.

- Sure, you CAN shut down production on some planets to save money, but that constitutes failure. Sure, it's frequently unavoidable, but the point of this is to try to maximize your economy so you don't have to shut down anything.

- Rather than shut down industrial capacity, another way is to avoid colonizing low-PQ planets that will do very little for you other than to drag down your economy. Let the other guy colonize them instead and drag down his economy. (the way you go about this changes a bit in Dark Avatar)

- Why aren't you using cargo hulls for your survey ships?

- When you research medium hulls, you can upgrade your flagship into a very decent fighting ship. Especially if you're neutral. It's sweet.

- Expect all this to change yet again in Dark Avatar. I used to have no problems in DL 1.4, but now in DA beta I never have enough money to do everything I want.

- Tech whoring is also very different in DA.

[Hydro]

Eco planets – I kind of took it at face value that these were good, and based on your advice I’ll check out the stats. Higher pops mean more morale problems, which can be distracting and take valuable space for morale buildings. The true benefit of large pop planets is that they are great places to site transport building: high pop and high morale planets will replace pop quicker (up to the limit, which I seem to recall is ~200m/turn).

Trade modules – you’re correct that these are poultry early (0.3 bonus for 3 trade upgrades x 16bcx10 routes = 48 bc/turn), and I go for production bonuses first.

What do you consider a low PQ planet? For me anything with PQ 8 or better is good, and 6 or less is next to worthless. The only exception is occasionally they’ll have a really good tile – but only occasionally. Note that there is a strategic value in denying them to your enemy since it gives them the ability to play in your turf, and they are a huge waste to take over with transports. Of course, they do eventually flip if within your territory (and at advanced levels the AI will actually place a influence base to prevent this, which is a shame for a PQ 3 world!).

Survey ships – a small hull seems to work fine, but I’ll play with cargo hulls to compare cost (they need to be cheap so they’re fast to build in an early colony). I usually go for high propulsion to aid the colony rush so getting a spd 7 survey on a small hull is pretty easy.

I generally upgrade my flagship in mid game (if it isn’t dead). Before then it is just too expensive.

Tech whoring – you mean rampant tech trading? I’ve found the AI generally doesn’t sell or trade war techs, and if it does they sell them dear. Some techs they simply will not trade/sell. Now if you mean selling, I certainly do that if my economy is tanking in the earlier game.

I’m looking forward to DA, but will be hesitant since I’m still exploring the regular game.

Thanks for the comments!
Hydro

[tetley]

The best benefit I found to econ planets is the mere fact that they aren't producing much. And if they're not producing much, well...might as well slap some cheap Market Centers on there. It goes back to the whole balance-your-economy-by-reducing-your-production thing: it'll work, but that constitutes failure, in my book.

The level PQ I consider worth colonizing varies depending on my money. If I have all the money I need--which in regular GC2L I do--I have no problem colonizing class 4's. All those extra planets means more research. Later on you can use Soil Improvement to lift the population cap, which means you can usually make a small profit off them. Early on, though, they're a real drag on the economy, so I'd rather make the other guy colonize it and make it a drag on his economy.

In DA it gets even better: there are lots of class 1's, which later in the game you can terraform to class 16's. And culture flipping is a lot easier. So yeah, you most definltely let the other guy colonize it and flip it later.

The problem I have with small hulls on survey ships is the speed. I need the speed. The nice thing about a small hull, though, is you can upgrade. But I choose the speed.

Yeah, tech whoring is basically rampant tech trading. It's when you get a tech, sell it to 6 AI's and get 6 times the value of the tech back. The AI will be more than happy to sell you even the latest military techs if you have no military.

[Hydro]

Ah, I understand now about tech whoring. I generally don't neglect my military (keeping a rating of at least 80 or so), so that's why the AI tells me to bug off. They will freely trade for almost any other tech, though. Generally my research is such that they don't have much I care about. Minors are much freer about trading military tech, likely because they need all they can get.

I'll play with the cargo survey ships. Hadn't thought of that!

For colonies I send fast ships (spd 7-11) to grab territory and get all the better PQ planets I can. I'll occasionally lose a PQ 4-6, which is annoying - but I'd rather get a PQ12 a little further out. I'm only playing on Painful, and the AI is much better about colonization. Spamming colonies isn't quite as easy...

Sounds like there are much more subtle strategies to colonization in DA!

Hydro

[tetley]

How are you getting speed 7-11 colony ships? My ships are typically 3-4, with maybe some 6's at the end of the colonization phase. Are you using the fast technology setting?

OTOH I have no problem getting speed 7-11 cargo survey ships.

[Hydro]

No, I’m using std technology settings. But, recently I’ve played the Iconians (who have a nice research bonus of 20%) and technologist (another 20%). When I bias my PQ15 homeworld to a research world my tech comes in very fast, especially if I’m lucky enough to get one or **gasp!** two research specials. I get spd 7 easily in the mid colonization phase by B-lining propulsion tech: xeno research, new propulsion, ion drive, planetary improvement, imp 1, imp 2, a few yellow techs, adv computer, basic miniaturization, imp 3 – you get the point. With 2 levels of miniaturization spd 11 is easy (but I can’t quite get a life support module on, so they’re short range). For long range work I’ll get a spd 9 with 2 life support. I can’t imagine plodding along with spd 3! I get a perverse satisfaction of having my spd 11 colony ship beat the AI to a world they’ve probably be en route to for 10 turns…

On huge maps the colonization phase is longer so it is worthwhile investing in propulsion tech. That said, I’ve only recently moved up to Painful and I’ve noticed the planets get grabbed a bit faster. The AI seems to only use spd 3 ships, but it spams them out all over the map (frankly, I don’t know how the AI affords it – maybe massive deficits?). Spd 7+ is a huge advantage, and it allows me to get my fair share (and perhaps a bit more) of decent colony worlds.

I’ll definitely have to try the cargo survey ship! With advanced propulsion it will fly…

Hydro

[tetley]

Do try to fit a life support mod on the cargo survey ship if you can. Even if it means sacrificing one speed point to do it. I've gotten burned on that one a number of times. One tactic is you can use your flagship to survey far-out stuff and let your cargo surveyor grab the rest, but it's still better to have a life support--especially if you want to survey wormholes.

One other tactic I try is to have my initial flagship do a beeline away from my home planet (grabbing anomalies on the way, of course), and leave most of the stuff close to home for my second surveyor. That's not just because of the life support, but because I'm trying to grab everything before everyone else does.

[Hydro]

Wow, worked like a charm! There is NOTHING like a spd 13 cargo hull survey ship with two support modules! Even better, a half dozen! They don't cost much more than a std small survey ship, too!

When all the anomolies are gone they can scout territory. And when that is done they make great sentinals to keep tabs on bad guys. I'm not sure they're worth upgrading to anything (having 1 HP is a problem).

Thanks for the tip!

Hydro

[tetley]

I've always meant to upgrade one of my cargo surveyors to see if the +4 hp anomaly helps out the cargo vessels. Never got around to it, though. I try to single out those anomalies for my flagship, anyway. But yeah, like you said, they serve as sentinels. Works great, especially if you built the Eyes.

[yin26]

Good discussion. I also use a fast cargo hull survey ship. A very basic measure, for me, in managing my econ is are my tiles sitting there not upgrading after I've placed them all? In other words, once the initial buildings are in place, I try to make absolutely sure that I have the next upgrades (bank, etc.) researched. This goes for more than just econ, of course.

By far for me the biggest killer is sitting there mid to late game with capabilities that worked well in the early game but now can't pass muster.

[Hydro]

Yin,

Do you mean you try to skip an intermediate step of a building, like building a Bank directly?

I like to time my improvements in waves so that my social is almost always busy. This means I might do an industrial improvement tech, lots of weapons, then research, then logistics, then eco, then hulls. You get the point. I don't like to have lots of infrastructure improvements bunched up since it really doesn't do me much good. The exception is the eco techs that give me the blessed +10 and +5 bonuses! I grab those as soon as I reasonably can.

Also, if my economy is flagging I'll goose my economy techs a bit. I'll generally finish those long before I finish research or any weapon tech line.

Hydro

[yin26]

Hydro: Actually, I mean what you said. I should research English Language to improve my diplomacy.

[Spiffor]

In my latest game (Terran, challenging), I had a very healthy income despite 0% taxes, from mid-game on. Because of a high trade, and high tourism.

I had all my trade routes start from Earth, and I surrounded Earth with economy bases, with trade maxed. I chose Neutral alignment for the extra 3 trade lanes.

For tourism, I started the game with a heavy influence policy (several planets were dedicated to producing influence). I also bought influence from other races, especially minor ones, in exchange of techs and trade goods. Of course, I avoided giving them diplo techs and universal translators.

Thanks to my influence, I got a good tourism income, but I could also steer the UP the way I wanted (I had something like one third of the influence all to myself). There had been several resolutions during the game about trade, which led to increase the income of each trade route.

I find long-distance shipping to be fairly overrated. The most lucrative routes went to the Arcean homeworlds, despite them being also the shortest routes.

Trade not only brought me money, it was also instrumental into being seen positively by my neighbours: this way, I didn't have to worry too much about my military. I only had one war thrown at me, and I could quickly bribe the others into attacking (and destroying) those filthy Torians

[Hydro]

I've noticed my income spiking when I grab lots of territory (usually when I take an enemy capital). That income has never been enough to run an empire, though. In my latest game I have raving fleets of Drengin and Altarans, so if I'm passive I'd dead. Trade income, sadly, is zero since evil races (as in my Yor) get 1 trade route by Council resolution.

Other keys are influence resources and high populations. I've generally ignored influence bonus tiles, though. Have you seen a difference? Do you think influence/tourism income is both area and intensity?

Hydro