Variety in Computer Games?

[DarkCloud]

...Are there significantly fewer computer games being released these days?

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=294608

Lists the best selling games for the last week in september as:

1. Spore
2. Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning
3. Civilization IV: Colonization
4. Crysis Warhead
5. The Sims 2 Apartment Life
6. World Of Warcraft: Battle Chest
7. World Of Warcraft
8. The Sims 2 Double Deluxe
9. LEGO Batman
10. World Of Warcraft: Burning Crusade

??
Not much variety here at all.

Is there any way that we, the consumers can correct this slide? Or was the coming of 3D into games the death-spiral for the former plethora of releases? (1995-2001).

[Quillan]

I think the primary cause of it is the increasing cost of making the games in the first place. Part of that cost is growing complexity, and part of it is massive advertising. Since games cost so much to produce, the publishers are loathe to take chances on something that might not make money. The result is new products from proven developers or sequels to good sellers are about all they're making now.

[El_Cid]

Re: Variety in Computer Games?

Originally posted by DarkCloud
....edit....................

Is there any way that we, the consumers can correct this slide? Or was the coming of 3D into games the death-spiral for the former plethora of releases? (1995-2001).

Yes we can correct things, dont buy the games that perpetuate the cycle of....well my current term is 'consolification', but others may take offence at that description.

The cost of production as Quillian mentions is the biggest reason for companies to play it safe most of the time(luckily not all the time yet!), and 3D has it's part to play in that process(as I've been saying for many years now), either in increased hardware costs(for the customer) or development costs(for the publisher) with all the extra artists needed to realize 'true to life graphics' of modern gaming.

As long as MS doesn't lock small devs out of using windows(by increasing the costs of production on the platform - e.g. required ERSB ratings - looking at Vista here(expensive for small devs) etc etc), and i'm not certain yet this isn't part of their plan for 'Windows Gaming'? then we will always have hope of something interesting coming along.

Maybe as you point at, if we were all more discerning in our game purchases(and maybe the global recession will help with this?) then AAA publishers might get back into the grove of what computer gaming could and should have been all about by now, looking back at the golden years and the promise we all felt back then(circa 1990's as you put your finger on)? time will tell.

But then i'm a getting older cynic, and even though i personaly hate McDonalds and Coke and never buy then, pleanty of people do. So get fat, sick and die young - I'll just continue to aim and hope for something better.

[lord of the mark]

Re: Variety in Computer Games?

Originally posted by DarkCloud
...Are there significantly fewer computer games being released these days?

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=294608

Lists the best selling games for the last week in september as:

1. Spore
2. Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning
3. Civilization IV: Colonization
4. Crysis Warhead
5. The Sims 2 Apartment Life
6. World Of Warcraft: Battle Chest
7. World Of Warcraft
8. The Sims 2 Double Deluxe
9. LEGO Batman
10. World Of Warcraft: Burning Crusade

??
Not much variety here at all.

Is there any way that we, the consumers can correct this slide? Or was the coming of 3D into games the death-spiral for the former plethora of releases? (1995-2001).

Look at the tops 4. An MMORPG, an FPS, a TBS, and a genre spanning god game. Sounds like more variety than we've seen in a while.

When was this era of plethora you speak of? 1999?
Its been a couple of years that PC gaming sales in the US as tracked by NPD has been dominated by WOW and the Sims.

[DrSpike]

Re: Re: Variety in Computer Games?

Originally posted by lord of the mark


When was this era of plethora you speak of? 1999?

The usual era of 'in my day', viewed of course through rose tinted glasses.

[Vesayen]

....pc gaming is only a few decades old.

There are far fewer games released because developers and publishers think only games with great graphics well sell well(they may be right), which means every game has to have great graphics. Graphics take time and money.

[DarkCloud]

When was this era of plethora you speak of? 1999?
Its been a couple of years that PC gaming sales in the US as tracked by NPD has been dominated by WOW and the Sims.

* Look at the gaming magazines and the amount of advertising they once held. PC Gamer and Computer Gaming World consistently clocked in at 250-300 pages. (yes, I am pretty certain 300+ (possibly 400 pages) pages for CGW back in 1996- there were over 150 pages of ads.) Now, these magazines have shrunk by far.

* Of the top ten games, many are "expansion packs" for popular games, this demonstrates a coalescing audience that only buys a few choice games rather than purchasing a wide variety.

* Also of note the blossoming of creativity back during 1996-2000; this was the time of:
MAX, Total Annihilation, Seven Kingdoms, Starcraft, Warcraft II, Age of Empires, Civilization II, Rise and Rule of Ancient Empires, CallToPower, Majesty, Anno 1602, and other brilliant concepts (and this is just in the realm of RTS/TBS).

There was a lot of experimentation.

Now it seems that everything has 'already been done' and the producers are quite hesitant about attempting new concepts... It's probably obviously due to the art budgets, but how as consumers can we correct this evil trend toward 3D.

The usual era of 'in my day', viewed of course through rose tinted glasses.

Meh. I can cite approximate numbers of pages in game trade magazines. I think those are easy evidence of the amount and variety of games produced.

True, there were some very buggy games- rise and rule, lords of magic... (generally anything Sierra made) but their concepts were interesting and pushed the genre forward.

Back from 1994-2000 Sierra published its own magazine. Sierra came out with perhaps 10-25 games each year- it was a powerhouse. I don't see that in any game company nowadays save the gigantic Activision.

The opportunity for invention appears to have slipped through the hands of the mass-market gaming producers.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by DarkCloud

summary - the late 90s were a golden era for PC gaming

.

Yes, I agree. I doubt theres much that can be done to bring PC gaming back to that dominance, short of a change in the technology (a change in the relationship of GPU and CPU? never mind, I always get lost in tech dicussions here) that would strengthen it as a platform, a solution to piracy, diminishing returns in the graphics wars, etc.

OTOH, your golden age includes AOE, SC AND Warcraft. Not all of that is new ideas, some is polishing of what by then was already an established RTS genre.

You mention 1602, which was not terribly popular on this side of the pond. Have you checked recent and proposed offerings from Tilted Mill, which are supposed to be quite innovative?

Paradox was , IMO, a source of great innovation somewhat after the period you discuss. They seem to a bit mired down now, but perhaps they will revive.

A lot of creativity is going into MMOs which I really cant speak of. Given their apparent immunity both to piracy and console competition, its not surprising theres a focus on that.

what can WE do. What we have always done, I guess, buy products that we like, and be on the look out for new and independent efforts.

[DarkCloud]

Paradox is a good shining beacon post 2001.

Tilted Mill, which are supposed to be quite innovative?

Can't say I've heard of them. I'll have to check them out.

Speaking of continental games that are good- The Settlers came out during that era as well.

Hmm...

A lot of creativity is going into MMOs which I really cant speak of. Given their apparent immunity both to piracy and console competition, its not surprising theres a focus on that.

So I wonder. Is piracy killing gaming on the PC?

Interesting question.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by DarkCloud
Paradox is a good shining beacon post 2001.

Can't say I've heard of them. I'll have to check them out.

They did Children of the Nile, supposedly the heir to the Caesar/Pharoah/Zeus line of city builders, but with innovative twists. Its on my list of slightly older to buy games. They did something called hinterland, a Sim/RPG I think thats supposed to be decent, and I think they have something else on the burner, not sure what.

[Zero]

Originally posted by DarkCloud

So I wonder. Is piracy killing gaming on the PC?

Interesting question.

piracy hurts pc games. but console can be modded to be played pirated games as well. Although alot less ppl probably do it.

I think the biggest issue here is that pc games lost every advantage they have to offer. PC games used to have advantage of patching, online gameplay, Mods/expansion packs that console game didn't have. Consoles adopted all those traits AND still retain their advantages such as affordability and standardization of hardware for games to run on.

I cant think of one good reason why PC game would be better today... except for maybe gamers that prefer a heavy amount of modding in their game, which pc still might have an advantage of (which console these days chouldnt have any problem adopting if they want to either) I wouldn't be surprised if we see a shift of MMOs into console soon as well.

[Lazerus]

My brother keeps getting into arguements with me because he says i refuse to believe anything made after 1999 doesn't suck and needs fancy graphics to cover crap gameplay lol

[El_Cid]

For sure piracy has played it's part in the demise of PC AAA releases. Either through actual losses of revenue(and these numbers are nearly impossible to come across, but they get hinted at every now and then), which I believe is the smaller problem(in terms of real world effect).
Or just in the perception from the AAA publishing houses, that piracy 'will' screw them, so they 'have to' invest hundreds of thousands of dollars into some terrible DRM system(that will still get cracked, probably before release). As we can see in the current global economic jitters, perception IS everything.

So AAA are less inclined to take a risk on PC, and we end up where we are now - few great exclusive releases(Civ4 is still my top AAA game of recent times), and a decent amount of fairly average console ports. BUT we do have the advantage that we dont have to rely on the production lines of the AAA's to find good games. Plenty of smaller companies are making decent PC games(Dominions/Paradox/Stardock/Shrapnelgames/etc) and their efforts are getting better all the time.

That to me is the greatest aspect about PC games, and why I tend to look in that direction more and more for that next big hit(in terms of an excellent game) to come from.

AAA's currently just love consoles for the most part(it can make more money), but that is all so commercial to me now that i'm happy to hunt down the rare gems that do get made outside of the big publishers. That hunting can be hard work though, but definately worth the effort imho.
It's not perfect yet, we are not back to those golden times just yet, but i can see them around the corner

[conmcb25]

Originally posted by lord of the mark

A lot of creativity is going into MMOs which I really cant speak of. Given their apparent immunity both to piracy and console competition, its not surprising theres a focus on that.

Really, where? Most of the MMO's coming out today IMHO are rehashes with a few new twists of the EQ/ WoW model IMHO. I think we are experiencing the same issue in that genre.

[LDiCesare]

Well, there are some people who tried to do sports MMO, so all are not rehashes of WoW.
But still, I tend to agree that the cost of developping a game has risen through the roof and less risks can be taken. Development costs rose mostly because of 3d, if not entirely because of it, imho. You now have graphists divided in animators and 3d artists, a whole bunch of the game is the 3d engine, and then lots of the ai is busy with 'what animation whould we be playing now', which means more than half the cost of a game today is the 3d part.