The truth needs to come out...

[Adagio]

If you're here, then you're probably interested in Spore. In that case I feel the need to warn people (which is something EA should be forced by law to do IMHO, but they don't):

As with all recent EA games, Spore contains SecuRom. The version in Spore has a high risk of including a limit on the number of times you can activate the game. Three times is the number. You need to reactivate your computer whenever you make changes (everything from installing the game on a new computer to just upgrading the ram on your computer. Reinstalling Windows also needs a reactivation)
It hasn't been confirmed, but it hasn't been denied either. But considering that users has experienced this with the Creature Editor, this speaks for itself
What to you do when you have used your three activations? Apparently you're supposed to call EA support, who then from case to case will decide if they want to give you more activations. If they decide against it, then you're out of luck (the only legal way to play the game would be by buying the game again)

On EA forums a user called Wishbone77 posted this: (a SecuRom protected television)

The EULA for the SecuROM-protected TV

Congratulations on your new Sony TV set! To unpack and connect this TV, you have to accept the following agreement:

I, the customer, as part of my purchase of this piece of equipment, agree to the following:

1. A small man will move into my closet.

2. When turning on my TV for the first time, the man will phone Sony to activate my TV account. I have a maximum of three such activations. Subsequent activations can occur for reasons explained later in this agreement. When the fourth activation is attempted, my TV will stop working.

3. Every ten days, the man will phone Sony, to verify that they are still okay with my using the TV that I bought from them.

4. Periodically, the man will go through my house, searching for anything that could possibly be used to commit a crime, such as knives, candlesticks, rolling pins, etc. If he finds any of these items, he will lock them in the closet.

5. If I move the TV out of the house, and move it back inside, the man may activate my account again.

6. If I buy a new piece of furniture, the man may activate my account again.

7. If I paint any room in my house a different colour, the man may activate my account again.

8. Even if I get rid of the TV, the man will keep living in my closet, and periodically go through my house, as explained in point 4.

9. Sony Corporation is in no way responsible or liable for any damage the man in the closet may do, and can not be held accountable for any action on his part, including, but not limited to, lighting fires, letting in burglars, smashing furniture and destroying personal papers.

[Decline] [Agree]

Link

Would you buy this TV?


Ok. Number 3 doesn't apply anymore, as this has been changed. It's now whenever you want to use online features, it will phone home




I'm not telling you not to buy Spore, that is up to you, but I want you to know what you need to know for you to make an informed decision when choosing if you want to buy the game or not.
A lot of people are probably not going to get into problems with this. Most people doesn't reformat their computer and most people doesn't upgrade their computer



It's funny how anti-piracy copy protection actually pushes more people to piracy

[Nikolai]

Yeah, I know. I've wanted Spore for years now, and will get it. But I'm not sure if I dare buy it legally. I always buy games legally, and would like now too, but I don't like the terms this TV offers...

[Metaliturtle]

Start calling EA today and asking them... send them hundreds of e-mails, force them to make a stand.

[LotC]

The funny thing is that the protection will be cracked within a week. How long did it take for Bioshock?

[DanQ]

SecuRom =

[EternalSpark]

SecuRom is simply the result of publishers assuming that 90% of gamers will download anything they want instead of paying for it, and 90% of gamers being all too willing to prove them right.

[Asmodean]

Well with stuff like SecuRom on a game, I would actually be more inclined to pirate software, as opposed to less.

I don't think such draconian copy protection will have the desired effect.

Let me just for good measure send my thanks to Brad Wardell and Stardock for their battle against copy Protection

Asmodean

[Adagio]

Just look at the official Spore forums. Quite a lot of people have a signature that says they wont buy Spore because of the 3 limit install (or just because of SecuRom)
When do they learn that the "tougher" the protection, the less people are buying it. The crackers don't see this as a threat, they see it as a challenge

[EternalSpark]

Well with stuff like SecuRom on a game, I would actually be more inclined to pirate software, as opposed to less.

Which is a horrible cycle. Publishers put copy protection into their games, which makes certain segments of the gaming population more inclined to pirate a game (you know, the ones who complain about being considered a criminal, or the ones who put all sorts of "yeah, this program has a completely non-piracy related purpose, wink wink" stuff on their PC), which decreases the amount of people who legitimately bought the game, which inspires publishers to put more copy protection into their games.

Let me just for good measure send my thanks to Brad Wardell and Stardock for their battle against copy Protection

You can send him your thanks, but a lot of people didn't have to send them their money. I introduced quite a few people to GalCiv, but I know for a fact (from the people who played it directly) I'm the only one that bought it. One of my friends told me flat out that he didn't see any reason to buy the game, since all you need is a keygen.

Just look at the official Spore forums. Quite a lot of people have a signature that says they wont buy Spore because of the 3 limit install (or just because of SecuRom)

Either lying or they won't matter. Finding people who genuinely saying stuff like that are like Firefly fans: you can see them everywhere online, but not outside of that.

When do they learn that the "tougher" the protection, the less people are buying it.

When it's true, for one.

[Adagio]

Originally posted by EternalSpark
One of my friends told me flat out that he didn't see any reason to buy the game, since all you need is a keygen.

Unfortunately this is where society goes wrong
A lot of people can't see that if you don't buy a game you like, there's an even smaller chance of them making another good game you like
Teaching them how buying a game could benefit them would help a lot more than the "You're a crimal, I'll sue you" method they're using now

Originally posted by EternalSpark
Either lying or they won't matter. Finding people who genuinely saying stuff like that are like Firefly fans: you can see them everywhere online, but not outside of that.

While I do agree that most of them are probably going to buy the game anyway on the day of release, a lot of them are waiting to see how badly it actually affects the people who bought it
Unfortunately this is only a very small number of people, so from EA's eye this wont matter

Originally posted by EternalSpark
When it's true, for one.

Ok, I might have exaggerated a bit here. But a few days ago I read that a game developer/publisher made a few tests about this. Putting on a tougher copy protection would only increase sales by 0.1%, while angering a lot higher percentage. Would this 0.1% increase in sales justify the cost of the tougher copy-protection (not to mention the increased anger from customers) ?
In the end they also mentioned that a pirated copy of their game could be viewed as free advertisement

[Asmodean]

Originally posted by EternalSpark


Which is a horrible cycle. Publishers put copy protection into their games, which makes certain segments of the gaming population more inclined to pirate a game (you know, the ones who complain about being considered a criminal, or the ones who put all sorts of "yeah, this program has a completely non-piracy related purpose, wink wink" stuff on their PC), which decreases the amount of people who legitimately bought the game, which inspires publishers to put more copy protection into their games.

I totally agree with your statement. I disagree with the premises of said statement, though. I very much object to the fact that it is even needed to have copy protection on software. In my mind, the way copy protection is headed, publishers end up annoying customers to the point that it is almost an invasion of privacy. Were I a publisher, I would never go in that direction, for I would only end up becoming unpopular with my customers. Not a smart move.

You can send him your thanks, but a lot of people didn't have to send them their money. I introduced quite a few people to GalCiv, but I know for a fact (from the people who played it directly) I'm the only one that bought it. One of my friends told me flat out that he didn't see any reason to buy the game, since all you need is a keygen.

If Stardock really thought they were losing money as a result of their stance on protection, I very much believe that Wardell would rethink his position. Sure, your friend may just think that he got a game. In fact he got a shell, if that at all. No access to updates, of which there have been numerous. In the end, I really don't think Stardock lost a customer there. He would never have bought the game anyway. It just isn't important enough to him. Otherwise he would have bought it when he saw the content that he missed out on



Asmodean

[Nikolai]

http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=76

and then

http://www.positech.co.uk/talkingtopirates.html

A good read

[EternalSpark]

A lot of people can't see that if you don't buy a game you like, there's an even smaller chance of them making another good game you like

Having to "support" a game by buying it is the exclusive domain of the hardcore gamer.

Think about it this way: a mainstream gamer never had to worry about pirating Sims 2, because it was going to do fantastically. A hardcore gamer had to worry a lot more about pirating Planescape Torment or Psychonauts.

Unfortunately this is only a very small number of people, so from EA's eye this wont matter

I commend you for understanding. A lot of people assume that A Lot Of People Online is equal to A Lot Of People In Real Life. It never is. I call the effect the INAE. Inverse Nerd Appreciation Effect. The more people you see people talking one way online, the more likely the real-world opinion is either the reverse, or at the very least, muted.

Would this 0.1% increase in sales justify the cost of the tougher copy-protection (not to mention the increased anger from customers) ?

Do you know what the 'increased anger from customers' winds up being? Nerd Rage. Exactly the kind of rage that everyone else doesn't know about it, doesn't want to know about, and will judge the Nerd if they do find out about it.

In my mind, the way copy protection is headed, publishers end up annoying customers to the point that it is almost an invasion of privacy.

I honestly don't think we're even close to that.

I very much believe that Wardell would rethink his position.

I very much call bull****. The Poster Child For No Copy Protection having to admit that the whole No Copy Protection Speil hurt sales? Nonsense. I would go as far as to argue that Wardell's constant and insistent claims that GCII wasn't hurt by piracy to be suspect.

In fact he got a shell, if that at all. No access to updates, of which there have been numerous.

Unless you update the game with the keygen. I've seen them do it. I did the same thing with my game that they did with theirs. I paid for it, they didn't. Hell, they enjoyed the game a lot more than I ever did, for crissake.

[ColdWizard]

Re: The truth needs to come out...

Originally posted by Adagio
If you're here, then you're probably interested in Spore.

Well, I was...

... I want you to know what you need to know for you to make an informed decision when choosing if you want to buy the game or not.
A lot of people are probably not going to get into problems with this. Most people doesn't reformat their computer and most people doesn't upgrade their computer...

It's nearly certain that I wouldn't have any such issue but I like the things I pay for to work when I want them to.

Overly aggressive copy protection combined with dubious game quality is turning me off of pc gaming.

[Maquiladora]

Re: Re: The truth needs to come out...

Originally posted by ColdWizard

Well, I was...

Same here. I was interested, but there are plenty of other games to play, without **** like this included.