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Imperialism II ; Couple Of Questions

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  • Imperialism II ; Couple Of Questions

    on the other day I found this awesome classic game from my game shelf. played a little, first time in years, it was better than I remembered. I have played a few games back in the day, still a couple of things are unclear to me.

    1) is there a map editor available anywhere?

    2) is there real new world map available?

    3) what good are generals? they increase morale of the army and max stack size but anything else?

    4) is there a way to get a colony to produce paper? how many units of timber must a colony produce to do this?

    5) how many different tribes are there? is their number always the same?

    6) if my empire has a trade consulate in a another country and I buy 1 unit of something from them, our relations improve. if I buy 2 units of something same time, does our relations improve twice as much?

    7) random map generation keys. any available anywhere?

    I know its an old game, but some of you must have played it, and might know the answer to some of those.

    Last edited by Andemagne; October 2, 2007, 15:20.
    My Words Are Backed With Bad Attitude And VETERAN KNIGHTS!

  • #2
    Re: Imperialism II ; Couple Of Questions

    5) how many different tribes are there? is their number always the same?
    I count 10 different:
    Kwahluti (how do you spell that?)

    7) random map generation keys. any available anywhere?

    for example. these following will produce one giant continent(all countries on a same landmass) for the old world and random one for the new world.

    My Words Are Backed With Bad Attitude And VETERAN KNIGHTS!


    • #3
      Re: Imperialism II ; Couple Of Questions

      Yes, it's a beautiful game with a great feeling of high-level strategy. I'm not too fond of the tactical battles, but the centralised economy is a welcome change of pace from the usual city-by-city model.

      Originally posted by Andemagne
      4) is there a way to get a colony to produce paper? how many units of timber must a colony produce to do this?
      No, they only produce lumber.

      Originally posted by Andemagne
      6) if my empire has a trade consulate in a another country and I buy 1 unit of something from them, our relations improve. if I buy 2 units of something same time, does our relations improve twice as much?
      No, purchasing one unit gives you all the boost you can get from that item for that country during the same turn.

      Originally posted by Andemagne
      7) random map generation keys. any available anywhere?
      There is a list of map generation keys for maps that are particularly suited for multiplayer games on page 10 of the manual.


      • #4
        Re: Imperialism II ; Couple Of Questions

        Originally posted by Andemagne
        1) is there a map editor available anywhere?
        Check this:
        (remember to sort topics from the beginning)

        Haven't tried it myself but you probably shouldn't expect the ease of use of Civilization.

        2) is there real new world map available?
        The new world is always randomly generated AFAIK.

        7) random map generation keys. any available anywhere?
        DISCLAIMER: the author of the above written texts does not warrant or assume any legal liability or responsibility for any offence and insult; disrespect, arrogance and related forms of demeaning behaviour; discrimination based on race, gender, age, income class, body mass, living area, political voting-record, football fan-ship and musical preference; insensitivity towards material, emotional or spiritual distress; and attempted emotional or financial black-mailing, skirt-chasing or death-threats perceived by the reader of the said written texts.


        • #5
          Originally posted by Colon™
          Check this:
          (remember to sort topics from the beginning)

          Haven't tried it myself but you probably shouldn't expect the ease of use of Civilization.
          I found the editor. or rather many smaller pieces of an editor. I will look into it soon.

          The new world is always randomly generated AFAIK.
          yes it is, but is there one available? like the pre generated map of europe that comes with the game.

          The Daily Imperialist! Of Course! and I tought I allready looked there.....
          My Words Are Backed With Bad Attitude And VETERAN KNIGHTS!


          • #6
            Re: Re: Imperialism II ; Couple Of Questions

            Originally posted by Verrucosus
            I'm not too fond of the tactical battles,
            me nether.

            No, they only produce lumber.
            does this also apply to Old World Provinces?

            No, purchasing one unit gives you all the boost you can get from that item for that country during the same turn.
            what about, if I buy 2 different resources, timber and horses, for example, do I then get x2 the relationship improvement?
            My Words Are Backed With Bad Attitude And VETERAN KNIGHTS!


            • #7
              Yes. Relationship improves with every individual transaction. You might want to buy the entire stock to prevent others from improving their relationship this way though, if you got the money.

              yes it is, but is there one available? like the pre generated map of europe that comes with the game.

              A real life map of America? I don't know, but the map would still contain a randomly created new world as well.
              DISCLAIMER: the author of the above written texts does not warrant or assume any legal liability or responsibility for any offence and insult; disrespect, arrogance and related forms of demeaning behaviour; discrimination based on race, gender, age, income class, body mass, living area, political voting-record, football fan-ship and musical preference; insensitivity towards material, emotional or spiritual distress; and attempted emotional or financial black-mailing, skirt-chasing or death-threats perceived by the reader of the said written texts.


              • #8
                Unfortunatly I can't play imp2 or 1 anymore
                Lovely games though.
                No Fighting here, this is the war room!


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Henrik
                  Unfortunatly I can't play imp2 or 1 anymore
                  Lovely games though.
                  Why not? Is it incompatible with recent hardware or operating systems?

                  A long time ago, Velociryx made a couple of posts about Imperialism II. I cannot find the thread itself anymore, but, at the time, I saved the most interesting fragments in my Imperialism II folder. They give an excellent overview of the game, so I hope it is okay to repost them.

                  Originally posted by Velociryx
                  I've been on vacation, and playing around a bit ... came across another undiscovered gem I thought I might write a bit about … fantastic game, and everyone who plays SMAC and enjoys its more “Builderesque” elements will REALLY love this!
                  First, let me say that I’ve gone and done it again. Was scouring the Underdogs site for forgotten classics or really good games that only got a cult following, and I really hit the mother lode!
                  It’s called Imperialism II, and if you’ve never played it, you’re in for a real treat! If you enjoy empire building games that are far more strategic in their nature than tactical, if you like the process of creating and refining an empire, then you’ll fall instantly in love with this game. There’s just no other way to say it.
                  The game opens in 1502, Europe, during the age of exploration. You can play as any of the following nations (in the order of number of territories controlled at start): France (15), Spain (14), Sweden (11), England (8), Holland (6), or Portugal (4). A word about balance here seems in order (with more later). It may seem at first glance that playing Portugal (4 territories) would be a much harder game than France (with 15), but this is in fact, not the case. It DOES change the character of your game, but I found that the compact nature of the smaller countries actually works to make certain aspects of putting your empire together an easier proposition ... anyway, more on that later.
                  So ... you pick your country and get to it, and man is it tough in the early goings! SSI did a superb job with balancing playability and realism ... I used to be able to say that, as a long-time student of economics, I could only imagine the absolute nightmare of taking a feudal, agrarian society and turning it into an industrial powerhouse ... now, I can say I know the feeling ... UGH ... it’s no picnic folks ... a very delicate balancing act is required to even survive the early game! One misstep in the early years and you’ll set yourself back years, so be careful!


                  Each turn, there’s a lot to do, but the game is blessed with a terrific interface that is both fairly intuitive and blended beautifully into the game. Everything has a consistent, “rustic” look that is very much in keeping with the timeframe the game’s set in.
                  At start, you’ve got a handful of raw materials (timber, raw iron, tin, copper, and wool being your first, most basic resources – along with food which comes in two categories, Wheat and Meat/Fish), a smallish army (about three units at start), and a fleet of about the same size. You also begin with three civilian workers (1 Builder, 1 Engineer, and 1 Explorer).
                  A note about units!
                  All naval, military, and labor units (peasants) have realistic support costs! To recruit troops or build and staff additional ships, you MUST pull laborers off of their currently assigned tasks – in other words, your population decreases. Additionally, each laborer, soldier, and crewman must be supported by sufficient food production. New units brought into play will alternate between requiring one unit of wheat and one unit of meat/fish, meaning that, in addition to building mines, roads, and lumber mills, you’ve also got to constantly build more farms and cattle ranches or what you’ll wind up with is a lot of developed resources and an insufficient labor pool. Again, a balancing act.
                  You DO get some “free” units (units that do not have to be supported by food), and these come in the form of your civilian workers. At game start, you may build Explorers (your eyes, they can move around in unexplored territories and scout for new resources), Builders (makers of mines, lumber yards, farms, and all manner of land improvements –the “formers” of Imperialism, and they have no support costs!), Engineers (also like formers, except that they are used to build roads and improvements to towns – fortifications and ports), and Spies (to help speed your research and stuff!). More civilian units become available as you progress through the tech tree.
                  By far, the most important early game resources are wool, unrefined iron, and timber. From wool, you get cloth, and cloth is needed to recruit additional workers. Timber can be processed into either paper (used to recruit additional civilian units) or lumber (used for ... well, everything), and raw iron can be processed into refined iron, which is also used for ... well, everything. Eventually, you’ll need to worry about tin and copper (for making bronze, used to make early war materials in the pre-steel era), but to get started, I’d not pay terribly much attention to that.
                  As far as I can tell, there is simply no way to excel at the game without paying close attention to diplomacy, and again, SSI did a superb job at making diplomacy a key (and entertaining!) aspect of the game. To improve your relationships with the other nations (either other Great Powers like yourself, or the various minor nations in the game), you must trade with them. Each successful deal serves to improve your relationship with the nation traded with. Occasionally, random events will also improve or hurt your relationship with the other nations, and if you allow the relationship to drop too low, or if you are perceived as being significantly weaker, you run a very real risk of being attacked!
                  To speed the process of improving your standing with various countries around the world, you can give trade subsidies (listed as a percentage: 5, 10, 25, 50. 75, or 100!), or cash grants (which can be set up as one time affairs or given every turn till you turn it off). To punish nations, you can boycott their products and/or boycott products from their new world colonies. All of this can be fine-tuned country-by-country, allowing for precise and masterful control of your diplomatic climate.
                  Early game warfare (against new world territories) is mostly a tactical affair, but there are some key strategic elements involved. When your scouting ships discover new world territories, your explorers should immediately begin striking for the interior, scouting things out and looking for riches. When riches are found, you can send merchants to the new world to buy up prime bits of real estate (strategic), and turn a tidy profit by hauling cargo from the new world back home for sale ... or, you can send your army out to go capture the territory from the locals (strategic/tactical).
                  The “battle board” where combats are played out is pretty simplistic, and gets tiresome after a while (against the natives in the new world, at least). I’d say that combat is probably the weakest point in the game but it’s entertaining enough to keep you interested (at least on par with SMAC combat, I’d say). So ... battling the natives is the tactical aspect of it all, but deciding which territories you want to expand into ... that’s vastly more a strategic exercise.
                  In the new world, you gain access to a number of new resource types (cotton, spices, tobacco, gold, silver, gems, furs, and sugar), as well as vast supplies of all your old favorites. Yes, the lure of gems and precious metals is strong, but far and away the most important product in the new world is sugar. Sugar cane can be turned into refined sugar, and refined sugar is how you keep your apprentice workers happy. Apprentice workers (available after some fairly extensive research) are recruited from the ranks of your peasant laborers, and are “worth” four times as much in terms of their productivity. Conclusion: If you want to leap ahead of the pack in the mid-game, you NEED lots of sugar. If you have it, and your opponents don’t – or if they have significantly less than you – then you’ll have a huge advantage, because as you train more and more apprentices, you can free up an increasing number of peasants to recruit into the army, swelling the ranks very quickly. So ... when you’re exploring the new world, snag as much sugar as you can. Ahhh ... and keep an eye on territories that have mountain ranges running through them! Those really tend to be the mother lode! Not much sugar, but a mountainous territory that’s barely a tenth the size of your starting country might contain more iron ore and precious metals than any two nations in Europe!
                  Don’t get greedy though! I’d limit New World expansion to no more than 12-15 territories, so choose them well and wisely! The reason you don’t want to expand into too many New World territories is because once all the “neutrals” are gone, the Great Powers then begin to turn on each other. As long as there are neutrals up for grabs though, as long as you don’t make too many waves, no one will attack you. Anyway, 12-15 New World territories. Choose them well, focus on sugar and mountainous territories and you’re on your way!
                  Crucial technologies:
                  Improved Roads – Allows the transport of 2 units of goods per developed tile across roads. Utterly crucial, as it will effectively double the productive capacity of your tiles.
                  Apprentice workers – four times more effective than a peasant worker.
                  Indiamen – Merchant ship with a cargo capacity of 8! And, it only takes wood, iron, and cloth (preserving your scarce bronze for army units)
                  Horse Artillery – Hands down the best early game assault unit. Artillery is not needed when fighting the natives in the new world, but if you don’t have massive firepower when fighting in Europe or assaulting fortified New World holdings, you’re toast!
                  Winning the game:
                  Despite the focus on the New World (which really is vital to your survival in the mid-game), the only way to WIN the game is to control 42 or more territories in the Old World, and that’s no easy task. There are, however, some very important things you can do to help yourself in that regard.
                  1) Be careful with alliances! If you enter into an alliance with another Great Power and that GP attacks or is attacked, you WILL BE expected to help. If you don’t help, the alliance is immediately dissolved, and that nation’s opinion of you drops dramatically, quickly undoing all those carefully planned trade deals you made. Thus, don’t make alliances lightly, or you’ll wind up with everyone hating you!
                  2) Don’t be last place, militarily! Keep watching your status. It’s okay to be somewhere in the middle of the pack, but don’t be last! Invariably, in the middle game, when the new world has been conquered, the game goes through a shakeout period, and it’s usually the guy with the smallest military that gets ... well ... shaken out. Don’t let that be you, and watch the diplomatic radar closely! When one of the Great Powers slips and begins losing territory, THEN is the time to declare war as well (opportunistically) and absorb some of their holdings into your own. Make sure to scarf up any New World territories that are adjacent to yours in order to consolidate your position there, and also don’t hesitate to grab any European provinces you can!
                  3) Absorb a Minor Nation – If you’ve been trading regularly with one or more neutrals, and offering good subsidies, you’ll soon ‘max out’ your relationship with that country. Build an embassy there as you go, and when the timing is right, ask that nation to join your own.
                  4) Conquer a Minor Nation – Especially if they’re already being munched on by some other Great Power. Might as well join the fray!
                  Naval Combat:
                  I’m not sure how I feel about it. On the one hand, it’s a bit of a disappointment in the sense that all naval combat is abstracted. You give your fleets general orders (assign to merchant duty, blockade, patrol, escort, etc), and the computer tells you the results. There’s no chance to influence the combat at all. On the other hand, the tactical level combats are not this game’s strong suit anyway, so….::shrug:: It’s interesting enough as it is, and lends a greater sense of the strategic to the game.
                  Moving units around:
                  This takes some getting used to, and it makes warfare both easier and harder than you might be accustomed to.
                  Your units can be in any territory you control in a single turn. If you have your entire army in Paris, they can be in your New World holdings the very next turn. That’s weird. It also makes for a defensive nightmare, because there’s no way you can possibly defend all of your territory.
                  One thing you can do is construct a basic fort in every territory that shares a border with another country, and fortify every coastal province to guard against a naval assault. That, at least, prevents a lone unit from putzing through your otherwise empty territory and claiming your New World prizes. If you can spare the manpower (which you probably won’t be able to), drop in 1-2 bowmen (poor choice), or musketeers (better by far).
                  I’ve gotten in the habit of “zoning” my empire and making one decent battle force for each zone (2-3 zones in all). A decent battle force by the mid-game consists of 2 mounted units (Lancers or Cossacks), 4 Musketeers, and 2-3 Horse Artillery. That’ll provide you with sufficient punch to knock out lightly held enemy positions, and the forces can be brought together for assaults against heavily fortified enemy capitols.
                  More about troops:
                  Troops gain experience over time. Every three victories or five defeats that a unit is involved in, he gets a “medal” which increases his effectiveness by a factor of 25%. A unit can receive a maximum of four medals. Also, as your technology increases, your existing units (including ships) can be upgraded by paying the full price of the new unit, minus the hit to your labor force. In this way, you can carefully craft a real killing machine of an army, but as you can imagine, based on the intricate system of interdependencies described thus far, replacing lost troops is no easy feat, and the loss of experienced troops can be a crushing blow indeed, so guard them carefully!
                  Turn Advancement:
                  From 1502 to 1700, each turn is two years long and starting in 1700, this changes to a turn a year, which represents the general advancement of society – tech advances start coming faster from a “years” perspective, etc – and the effects of industrialization in general.
                  Keep units from routing. You get one general (free) for every ten units you put in the field. I’ve never seen that they did much good, but maybe I wasn’t looking at the right thing ... don’t know. Haven’t had enough combats involving Generals to really make an informed opinion, but I’d imagine that a General with four medals would be a pretty impressive fellow.
                  Other stuff:
                  This game unfolds very slowly, so it might not be for everyone. I bring it up here because I know from watching the boards that there are a number of people currently playing SMAC/AC who really enjoy the Builder elements of the game, and that’s what you get (and then some!) with Imperialism.


                  • #10
                    Continued from previous post:

                    Originally posted by Velociryx
                    Almost forgot! Notes about the different countries!
                    Earlier, I mentioned that some countries seem much harder to play than others (Portugal, with her four territories in Europe vs. France with fifteen at game start). This is true in some respects (ie – winning the game takes 42 European territories, so obviously France has a leg up on Portugal in that regard, at least), but the game is so exquisitely balanced that Portugal (and all the smaller nations in Europe) winds up with some key advantages.
                    First, if you want to play a smaller nation, you get the blessings that come with your smallness. Every “level one” improvement you make (farms, roads, mines, cattle ranches, all of it!) takes 1 Lumber and 1 Refined Iron to make – and 1-2 turns in time. Thus, while France has significantly more territory than Portugal, they need to build significantly more roads in order to make use of their various resources. Additionally, while France is blessed with the most territory in the game, their nation has only three iron mines (when developed to level one, this means three units of unrefined iron – 1.5 units of refined iron – per turn. That’s pitiful, AND it’ll take a while to even get there, because all of France’s iron deposits are on the fringes of the country, and road building out to them will take YEARS.
                    Contrast that to Portugal, who can build roads to ALL their resources before France can even reach their iron deposits. That puts them in the position of being able to get geared up and running good while France is still floundering in the mud. What it means then, is that the little guys OWN the early game, and if they can strike out fast and get “first pick” of New World territories, they can have those territories up and running and defended before the lumbering bigger powers can even get in gear.
                    The downside is that the little guys have a smaller population base (fewer farms producing wheat). The cattle farms are relatively unimportant because cattle and fish can be used interchangeably, and ports can be built to bring in more fish. Therefore, what really sets the upper limit of your population is the number of wheat farms you’ve got access to. When you run out, you hit the wall.
                    Thus, both diplomacy and warfare are VASTLY more important for the smaller nations. Getting in good with one or more minor nations and absorbing them can double the size of your European holdings! On the other hand, bulking up a good army and simply bulldogging your way through a minor power will see you in a similar position.
                    France – Has tremendous potential for the mid-game, but they’re relatively slow to develop. Your best bet is to begin building a road from Paris, striking south toward your (distant) iron mines, developing resources along the road as you go. Of all the nations, if you focus heavily on trade, you can most easily dominate world markets and thus, have a relatively lesser need for alliances at all. Simply give everyone trade subsidies of 10% to keep the peace all ‘round and use your economic muscle to fuel your way to victory.
                    Spain – Your fractured start leaves you adjacent to just about everybody, giving you enormous flexibility. Given the way troops move in this game, the Spanish probably have the most enviable starting position on the whole map. Just plod along much like France, and keep your army strong. If Portugal, Holland or France begin to slip at all, you’ve got holdings adjacent to them that can be used as staging areas for attacks of your own. In all, you’ve got the easiest time increasing your European holdings, simply by virtue of being adjacent to so many people. On the other hand, if you are ganged up on, you’re doomed. Alliances are important for Spain to avoid getting ganged up on too badly, but choose them wisely. An alliance with the English, especially, will put you in a splendid position.
                    England – Ahhhh, the Sceptered Isle! Diplomacy is a must for you if you want to get on the Euro mainland. Make friends with the Swiss (who border almost everyone) and absorb them as soon as possible. That’ll give you the staging area you need to take the rest of Europe. Also, you MUST either befriend/absorb or crush Scotland underfoot before someone else gains a toehold on your island. If they do, you’re in a really vulnerable spot!
                    Sweden – Lots of territories, but your resources are in widely scattered pockets which will see your development only plodding along. Also, you’re 1-2 turns “further away” from the New World. That doesn’t seem like much, but it DOES mean that you probably won’t be first in the New World. Get there as fast as you can and attack more quickly than your rivals to make up the lost time (minimal scouting, a couple of riskier combats with damaged units should put you back on par). Absorb Denmark to gain access to the rest of Europe. An alliance with distant Portugal can set you up to divide Europe with them, and you’ve already got the upper hand, since you start with more territories.
                    Holland – Like Portugal, you’ve got the advantage of your smallish size in the early game. Like Sweden, you’re slightly further from the New World that the others, which means you’ve got to hustle. On the upside, you’re adjacent to lots of Neutrals who are just BEGGING to be added to your holdings! You NEED to keep Sweden penned in the north, so you must prevent them from acquiring Denmark at all costs! Beat them to the punch! In the south, keep a close eye on Spain, and if she falters, be quick about grabbing her “detached” holdings that are adjacent to you! The combination of acquiring Denmark and those Spanish colonies will about double your holdings in Europe and position you nicely for the win.
                    Portugal – Tiny, resources all packed together, and closest to the New World! Go out, conquer quickly, and build a large Merchant fleet to cart all the goods home. Keep an eye out for Spain, and AS SOON as they pick a fight with someone and get their nose bloodied, declare war! You’re relatively isolated from all of the other Great Powers and with only Spain to worry about, if you wait until someone else has them in a hammer lock, you can sneak in and add your dagger as well, and with tiny Portugal, it’s not at all hard to double the size of your holdings at Spain’s expense! NEVER make an alliance with Spain….they’re the nation that’s blocking your progress through the rest of Europe!
                    Thought I’d better mention that um ... this is a LONG game! Don’t be surprised if you only get one finished over the course of an entire weekend! Oh, and don’t even bother with the random maps ... they’re nowhere NEAR as entertaining as the map of Europe!


                    • #11
                      A Game Report:

                      Originally posted by Velociryx
                      I see that a number of folks have read this thread over the past couple of days, and just in case those who have read have also downloaded the game, I thought I’d share my latest game experience.
                      Started as France, used what has become my “standard opener” for that nation, heading south from Paris with my trusty engineer, with an eye toward road-building out to the three iron deposits the French have access to. Turn one, I set the “Large Hull – Indiaman” as my research goal, and began working on all three of the “level one” techs that are pre-requisites for it. Also established embassies with both the Italians and the Swiss with the long-term goal of bringing them under my control in the mid game without firing a shot.
                      Subsidies – I gave the Swiss and Italians 25% (this would be increased to 50% in a few turns, and finally to 75% sometime around 1600). All the other Great Powers in the game got a 10% trade subsidy from me.
                      Immediately recruited two new workers (which exhausted my supply of cloth), and a second Explorer (which left me with only two paper, and I promptly put those on the open market for some quick cash).
                      Trade-wise, everything worked like a dream. I was getting deals reliably from both the Italians and the Swiss every turn, and my progress with the Builder/Engineer team was plodding but steady.
                      In 1510 I discovered the New World, and my pair of Explorers immediately set out to do some serious shroud busting in the region. I found my first target right away ... a territory containing two sugar cane tiles that appeared (if the intelligence report could be trusted) to be lightly guarded ... so, I set my “fleet” – a single Carrack – to prep a landing site, and put the Army of Paris on alert for marching orders the following turn.
                      As I had hoped, the battle went swimmingly! There were only two native units present, and we crushed them under the heel of our French boots. The province was ours! Further scouting revealed that there were two “capitol territories” (the Sioux and the Pueblo?) nearby, and that’s when I knew this was going to be a real gem of a game. Two ports within easy striking distance, and every turn, my Explorers were uncovering more of what I wanted to see. Lots of mountainous terrain, and lots of sugar. Heaven.
                      Plans were immediately made to bulk up my military presence in the New World (since my trusty three units – 1 Pikeman, 1 Musketeer, and 1 Knight – would surely be insufficient to capture a capitol territory. I knew going in that this would set me back a bit economically, but the rewards were simply too great to be ignored!
                      So ... as I was making the necessary materials (cloth and bronze) I’d need to train a pair of new knights, my Explorers revealed that neighboring territories contained gold, silver, AND gems! Ahhhh, the riches of the mountains! And as luck would have it, those territories fell directly along the “conquest path” I had mapped out to reach one of the two Indian capitols.
                      Before long, the new Knights were en route to my new colony and my explorers had discovered more iron ore in the mountain regions nearby than was contained in all of France ... all of TWO Frances, actually, and my spirits were soaring! As fate/luck/good scouting would have it, I had landed myself right in the heart of the mother lode!
                      With the army reinforced, they swiftly began a program of systematic conquest, resting only when one or more units was really banged up, otherwise, pressing our advantage every turn and claiming more and more of the riches we had discovered thus far. Eight years later, we drew up next to the capitol of the Sioux, and stopped. My troops had a medal each, but would need to be at their best before attempting such a fight. The timing worked out great too, because I was running out of money, and I knew from previous attempts that capturing a capitol territory brought with it a cash windfall.
                      So ... a few years spent polishing my gains (and sending my overworked Engineer to the New World to begin the arduous task of road-building down from the mountains where all the riches were out toward the port that (hopefully) would soon be in my possession.
                      We held our breath, and waited anxiously ... praying that no other Great Power would beat us to the punch while we were prepping for the fight ahead.
                      Luck held, no one attacked or bought territory in the province we had our eye on, and battle was joined! This time, however, our goal wasn’t to crush the defenders. I knew that with the capture of the capitol, my army would be turning its attention elsewhere (the OTHER native capitol, several territories away). And, since I’d be spending no more time acquiring territories in this region, I figured I’d try to play to the metagame a bit and let the natives I did battle with escape (they would flee to neighboring territories, none of which I had designs on, which would make battling that much more difficult for my rivals!)
                      We took the province without a single loss, and managed to drive off the defenders without killing any of them, so everything worked exactly according to plan, and we repositioned the army for a move against the second capitol territory in the area.
                      Essentially, it was a repeat performance. A relentless drive until we were adjacent to the capitol, then drawing up and pausing long enough to rest the army completely and then, the big finish. This then, saw me with some eight territories in the New World, and my trusty Carrack had since found another (even larger!) continent with a great many tribes.
                      I was sorely tempted to not follow my own advice and take my now veteran (3 medals each) army and simply conquer everything I saw, but no ... having crashed and burned on two other occasions for getting too greedy, I wisely avoided that trap this time. I DID want to get a foothold on the other continent, however, and so sent my Explorers there to begin doing some more advance scouting.
                      I immediately liked what I saw.
                      Another lightly held territory containing sugar, not far from the capitol of the Inca.
                      So, three Knights were immediately dispatched, leaving a Pikeman and a Musketeer in my original New World holdings (That’s the bad thing about Carracks ... only a 3 space cargo bay!)
                      Fortunately, now that the Knights were sporting three medals each, they cut through the Incan resistance like it was a ginsu cutting through a tin can (and look! It can still slice a tomato like nobody’s business ... yours now for only 19.95 ... er ... sorry, too many late night infomercials ... lol).
                      The following turn, the rest of the Army of France was on scene, and we repeated our basic attack pattern for the third time.
                      And for the third time, we met with complete success.
                      Now, in the late 1600’s, with twelve New World territories under my belt (including three ports that I didn’t have to spend resources to build!), and running a solid first place with Holland and Spain fighting for second, I turned my full attention to my Merchant Fleet. Oh, I had been adding to it as I could of course, but with three ports, I suddenly found myself awash in so many imports from the colonies that I really began feeling the crunch where shipping was concerned.
                      My exploratory Carrack was sent home to be added to the Merchant Marine, and in the mean time, plans were made to construct three additional Fluytes – a step up from the Carrack, with 4 cargo spaces – (I had already built two of these and I STILL didn’t have enough shipping ... such are the riches of the New World.)
                      Before long, the ships were built, but sadly, all the time and attention I had to devote to building up the navy took its toll. I was now listed third overall, but I felt certain that my investment would pay off in the long run.
                      Technologically, Indiamen were finally on the horizon, which was a relief to see ... a relatively cheap ship with a massive cargo bay – fully double what my poor Fluytes could carry. I found myself looking forward to the day when I could begin launching them, and to that end, began stockpiling as much lumber, cloth, and refined iron as I could, with plans to go on a massive building binge the moment I could build my coveted Indiamen.
                      And, since those massive trade ships play such a crucial role in my long-term plans, the next logical step was to add more Builders and Engineers, and set about the task of making my New World colonies pay with a vengeance!
                      Three new Builders and two new Engineers were trained. One of each stayed in France, to finish out the road network to the last of our farms and cattle ranches – and to build improvements there to bulk up our population a bit more – and everyone else was dispatched to the colonies.
                      Much silver was mined. Gems. Iron deposits, and best of all ... tin and copper for bronze. (France has a single tin mine and nothing else ... I had been bleeding my bank account very badly buying copper and finished bronze, and was looking forward to the day when I could begin to make bronze myself, without having to beg, borrow or steal for it ... a happy day indeed!) And, when the Builders weren’t mining, they were prepping sugar cane fields (I had fourteen of them!!), because I was researching “Apprentice Workers”. Seven Apprentice workers could be supported by my available sugar fields ... fourteen as soon as I got the tech that bumped road transport to two goods per developed tile ... that was huge.
                      Once again, everything worked exactly as planned, and before long, my economic power was listed as “Awesome,” while militarily I was showing up as “Fair.” A quick check of general information revealed that I utterly OWNED the world export market (my shipping capacity was over a hundred at this point, and I was buying and selling like a mad hatter every turn, generating some fifteen hundred bucks in profits AFTER paying for all my research and despite the trade subsidies I was doling out). My relationship with everyone was rising steadily – the whole diplomacy map had this very soothing greenish quality to it. Every turn I was being courted by at least one of the Great Powers for an Alliance, and I knew that, despite the rosy diplomatic scene, I needed to cast my lot in one direction or another, else the “aligned” Great Powers would simply find a reason to attack my less-than-stellar army and take me out of the game.
                      I had been watching Sweden flounder about for much of the game, and decided I’d NOT go with them. England and Spain had been warring off and on for the past century, and I really didn’t relish the thought of getting in the middle of that, so they were out. It came down then, to either Holland or Portugal, and in the end, I chose Portugal as I feared Holland might make a move on either Italy or Switzerland that would force me to break the peace with them. At least with Portugal our interests didn’t collide, and it gave me a number of secure borders in the New World.
                      So, Portugal it was!
                      About ten years later, they declared war on England, and I was drawn into that conflict anyway.
                      I bulked up my escort fleet and kept building ships anytime I had the chance (though I have not yet gotten around to upgrading my horribly outdated Fluytes, and when I stopped for the night it was almost two, and 1738!), meanwhile, my awesome sugar production kept the economy humming along nicely even when I mass-recruited peasants into the army (I lost my “awesome” economic standing though, but wound up with “good” in both that and the military category).
                      So here I am, preparing for a war that I don’t really want with the English, otherwise minding my own business, and then ... Sweden just EXPLODES! They declare war with both Holland and England, and proceed to utterly thrash them both, kicking them almost entirely out of the New World, and overnight becoming the Godzilla of Europe. They also declare war on little Italy, who I’d been priming to join my side.
                      Well, considering that I was already in a war with England, I didn’t really want to leap to Italy’s aid and open up the fight with the Swedes as well, so ... I did the next best thing ... I declared war on them too! (Figuring I’d net at least a couple territories out of the deal).
                      The Spaniards weren’t having any of that, however, and promptly declared war on ME for declaring war on Italy (kind of a double standard, I thought ... they didn’t seem to mind when Sweden did it, but they got all rowdy when I decided to join the party).
                      So now I’ve got war on a huge front, and the cursed Spaniards have territories bordering some of my most lucrative New World real estate (exposing about two thirds of my sugar production, and ALL of my precious metals to attack!)
                      Well, clearly, I couldn’t very well lose that stuff, so I gave up my designs on Italy for the moment, and split my army into two camps ... one for home defense, and one for defense of my threatened colonies.
                      The home guard got the bigger chunk of troops (with more being trained every turn), because of the extremely wide front the Spanish could invade along, and I broke off small detachments (2 Musketeers) and put them in forts along the border, moving them to match the moves of the Spaniards who threatened.
                      For a few years, the front in Europe was eerily quiet. Move and countermove, a few false start invasions and quick pull-backs thanks to accurate reading of where the invasions would actually occur.
                      In the New World, my smaller force had their hands full, however. I lost one of my richest sugar-producing states, which whacked my economy pretty hard, and wound up sending a good many of my reinforcements planned for France down to the Colonies in order to bulk up my presence there, and a terrific cat-and-mouse game ensued in the colonies. I’d get my territory back, but would not have enough time to build a fort there, so would have to abandon it to preserve the army.
                      The Spanish would take it and do the same.
                      Then I’d hit a Spanish territory (destroying the fort, and again, unable to keep it ... so I’d pull back), and he’d reclaim it – and of course, while he was reclaiming it, I’d be off to go get my original territory back).
                      Thus, it was something of a stalemate in the New World for a time.
                      After watching the computer fight for a while (and wasting thousands of dollars in abortive attacks), it finally dawned on me that the way to fight in this game is to simply defend everything that’s currently being threatened, dump every man you’ve got into one massive attack force, and punch through where you want to.
                      Thus, after about ten years of cat-and-mouse, I changed things up on the Spanish ... defending all currently threatened French territories in Europe, and creating a massive army in the Colonies.
                      We stormed in and destroyed a fort of his, and instead of running, we stayed put.
                      He countered and a bitter battle erupted, with neither side seeing the benefits of a fort.
                      Thanks to my preponderance of artillery, we carried the day, but the losses were pretty cutting (four of my “three medal” musketeers, and two regiments of horse artillery bit the dust). Still, the Spaniards lost far more, and once we routed them out and held the territory long enough to rebuild the fort, I had figured out my basic battle plan.
                      About the same time I figured out how to fight in the game, my ally, Portugal came riding to the rescue with a declaration of war against Spain, and Holland followed suit shortly thereafter (In fact, for a while, even England joined in against Spain, apparently setting aside her differences with Portugal and I to join in the feeding frenzy).
                      In short order, I had kicked the Spaniards out of the New World, stripping them of all their colonies – which, as luck would have it, all bordered mine. Eventually, warfare would see them with a couple other colonies far removed from mine, but for the moment, we not only carried the day in style, but we booted them out of the New World.
                      And then, with no time to waste, we shuttled the army back to France.
                      While France, Portugal, Holland and England descended on the luckless Spaniards (who got into this whole mess by valiantly coming to the defense of little Italy), the Swedes continued their wrecking ball campaign through Italy and the New World, occupying the lion’s share of the continent I only had a tenuous hold on, stomping out the Aztecs, Mayans, and ... I dunno, somebody else, and even declaring a brief war with Holland to consolidate their position and boot the Dutch out of their section of the New World.
                      Meantime, Portugal and I pretty much divided up Spain (with Portugal also pressing their war with the British, acquiring most of Ireland and a smidgeon of Scotland as well).
                      It was almost two when I saved off, and the year was 1738. Thanks to finally figuring out warfare in this awesome, brilliant game, my ally and I have reduced the Spaniards to Madrid itself, and I’ve got the forces just outside the city gates to land the knockout punch (Oh! I forgot ... they also still have Sardinia ... but not for long…::evil grin:: )
                      Soon as Madrid/Sardinia are mine, the now “commando strength” (almost everybody has four medals) French forces will be loading up on a few Indiamen and landing in lower Britain. I’m looking to the day when Portugal feels she longer needs France and casts off our alliance. I hope they don’t, because they’ve been GREAT allies, but ... they might, and I want a foothold in England if they do.
                      My goal is to end that fight quickly and then get the army back to France, because here’s how I think the game will shake out (if I’m reading the flow of it correctly).


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Colon™
                        A real life map of America? I don't know, but the map would still contain a randomly created new world as well.

                        I mean a map that has Europe as Old World and America as New World.

                        thanks to everybody for their answers. here couple more:

                        8) is there a way to extract random map generation key from an old save game?

                        9) is there a troop limit in the game? how many military units can there be any one time in the game?

                        10) is there a same kind of limit how many civilian units there can be. the game crashes often on me when I start building railroads.
                        My Words Are Backed With Bad Attitude And VETERAN KNIGHTS!


                        • #13
                          11) in most of my games 2 last Great Powers left are Sweden and Spain, no matter what country I play. so there are differences in the AIs. what are they?

                          12) scale of relationship. whats the smallest amount relations ship can improve? when I trade 1 resource, how much it improves? what about 1000$ grant?
                          My Words Are Backed With Bad Attitude And VETERAN KNIGHTS!


                          • #14
                            No idea about the unit limits (I never have enough money to push things), but I'll give the other questions a try:

                            8) You can extract the map key by loading it and ctrl-clicking on the magnifying glass in the top right corner.

                            11) There are AI personalities (they can be switched off under custom rules), but they are tempered by the individual maps that come up. Generally speaking, England is more likely to research naval technologies, Spain is more likely to capture Indian territories, Holland is more likely to trade etc, but these are more tendencies than anything else and I've sometimes wondered whether I'm just imagining things. I don't think I've seen a strong pattern of some countries dominating. In particular, Holland seems to be strong quite frequently in my games. Can you identify a reason for the strength of Spain and Sweden in your games (e.g. early access to precious metals)? Are you talking about random maps or about games with a European Old World?

                            12) I've never tested it, but my impression is that a trading a single resource gives a smaller benefit than the smallest grant. It would be great to have more specific information. (How many trades do you need to get as big a boost as from a non-aggression pact or how many years do you need to make successive 1000$ grants to get the same boost as from a 10000$ grant?)


                            • #15
                              Morning everyone.

                              Just registered today, and I'd be posting this on the Daily Imperialist, or anywhere really more appropriate, but sadly it seems that there are no other Imperialism II sites that are still up and running, especially those wiith remotely active forums with posts from teh last 3-4 months. Firstly, could any suggest any good fansites outside the Daily Imperalist since I'm finding that to be rather dead after reading through the entire place.

                              Additionally, I can't seem to hold my own at all ever against a computer opponent. Are there any really good "learner" keys that maybe gimp all but two or three nations without necessarily giving a resource boost to the others? It'd be nice if the key also set each power on their own island seperate from each other but with a minor or two on the islands.

                              Looking over the keys, there are are numerous 2-player ones. Does that basically mean that my situation is already solved in those map keys, or is it simply that those powers are suggested simply because they needed two powers for that key?