Neverwinter Nights Reloaded

[Jamski]

Oh, I did overlook that. I thought we were suggesting wizard builds for a PW... hmmm...

Oh yeah, if you're playing in a SP campaign where you won't reach the 17th level or higher, go straight Wizard to get the highest level spells you can. Not sorc. Not multiclass.

-Jam

[Dis]

Originally posted by Snotty
Im game for it. Im not used to epic levels so would probably play a front line fighter/barbarian type. Organizing a time and a date will be fun Im sure. I cant really play on sunday afternoon/evening (gmt) but will try to be flexible the rest of the time.

sounds like a laugh

it it is on a thursday or friday I can play

[Vlad Antlerkov]

I haven't decided when we'll start, other than it'll have to be after December 15. Why? That's when finals end here.

So here's the list so far:

Vlad-- Rogue/fighter/WM
Jamski-- Rogue/wizard
Snotty-- Barbarian/fighter
Dissident-- No build posted.

Still needed: Cleric-type build for rezzing; another melee-oriented build (preferably paladin- or ranger-based); and possibly another arcane caster.

It'd be nice if everyone could at least do an outline of their build. Nothing major, just what I did for mine.

Also: You can come in with a level-1 character if you wish, apparently. There's a n00b-level-up-and-merchant at the start. (I took a brief--no more than 10 minutes--look at the module last night.)

[Snotty]

alright, i will post my build once I have built it

[DaShi]

Vlad, I might be interested. If so, straight cleric. After the 15th is good for me too.

[Harovan]

Originally posted by Jamski
Oh yeah, if you're playing in a SP campaign where you won't reach the 17th level or higher, go straight Wizard to get the highest level spells you can. Not sorc. Not multiclass.

Yes, and with that in mind the "SpellSword" build makes a lot of sense. You don't have to blow your nukes on lowly goblins or orcs, you can deal with them with your melee abilities. The bosses on the other hand, will feel the wrath of a full-classed wizard. And it is easy to achieve, too, because many of the caster feats like extend, empower or maximize spell aren't that critical in the earlier stages. You can get them later, when they become more important, and invest your earlier feats into melee abilities like exotic weapon, two-weapon fighting and ambidexterity. A good developed dual weapon is the best for this build, because it gives you an (albeit nerfed) second attack right away, as your BAB is growing slow.

[Harovan]

On a sidenote: I know multiclassing is fun. I enjoyed it myself... for a while. But in my opinion, the prestige classes, that came with SoU and HotU, ruin the fun, at least mine. I know it's a fantasy world, but there is good fantasy and simple non-realism. For instance, what in bleeding hell is a Red Dragon Disciple and why does it have wings? Also, many multiclasses also don't make sense roleplay-wise whatsoever. And it is a RPG, after all. For instance, if you combine a rogue and a wizard, it already becomes hard, although skill-wise it's an awesome combination, I know. Is it an evil wizard? Or a mystical rogue? Or what? Now, if you add another prestige class, like Arcane Archer (which makes sense skill-wise, if you developed a "gunship" rogue), it becomes a completely insane roleplay. Or even worse, a Weapon Master.

Enough rant for now. But a while ago I started another slow going run through SoU/HotU, this time with a pure cleric. She is level 24 or 25 now and her epic abilities aren't really that good, but still I don't multiclass her, just because. And I enjoy this character tremendously. She can melee, she can buff, she can cast and she can heal. And I built up all three major saves reasonably well, so she's good at resisting everything, too.

[DrSpike]

I can see how a roleplayer could approach it from that angle. For me though it's a game in itself seeing how to multiclass to get something for nothing, or get something worth more than you give up. If you approach from an angle of building the best possible character you have to accept that 95% of good single/dual class builds can be improved by a skillful multiclass.

[Harovan]

True, it's just my feeling, that the original about dozen of classes are archetypes enough to tinker with. All what the presige classes do is adding partially imbalancing and partially just overly unrealistic stuff. This is also visible in the feats and skills for levels over 20, they feel like forcably propped over a once pretty well thought and balanced system. With other words, all they do is to promote power gaming. They add next to nothing to the game content itself.

[Jamski]

I do have to admit that playing pure Rogue is awesome. The abilities of the Epic Rogue cannot be duplicated by other classes. My Rogue 40 build that is one of my current Folderol PCs (only level 27 or something at the moment) is great fun to play. By not multiclassing I've picked up a bonus feat at 10, 13, 16, 19, 24, 28, 32, 36 and 40. That's 9 feats, many of which are Rogue specific like Crippling Strike, Improved Evasion, Slippery Mind, Epic Dodge, and Self Concealment. I can max out all the skills (Rogues get INSANE skill points per level) like Parry and Tumble and so on, and I'm getting ridiculous sneak damage.

But as always, Rogues are helpless vs the Undead

-Jam

[Harovan]

I don't want to rant against multiclassing, don't get me wrong. My point is just, that I lost the fun with it with the rise of the prestige classes. Tinkering and mixing with the orignial classes is enough of choice.

By the way, rogues indeed are fun, and awesome to RP. Just like rangers.

[Jamski]

I have to admit never having yet made a Ranger. I think I shall go and do that now. I was always a bit disappointed that a Fighter/Druid was better in every possible way

-Jam

[Vlad Antlerkov]

Eh, not necessarily. A pure ranger, played all the way to level 40, would get an assload of ranger bonus feats-- at 23, 26, 29, 32, 35, and 38 (for being an epic ranger) and at 25, 30, 35 again, and 40 (when he could normally select another favored enemy). That's ten bonus feats, as many as an epic fighter (which, IIRC, gets 10 epic bonus feats, one every other level). Also, maxed out, a ranger gets +2d6+9 to damage against ALL his favored enemies (plus +9 to Taunt, which is always nice, and +9 to Listen/Spot, but who cares about those skills? ). If you choose favored enemies with every bonus feat (and you can do that and still get Devastating Critical), that's 15 types of enemies. And keep in mind that not all rangers HAVE to be dex-based, or even dual-wielders (see: son of Arathorn, Aragorn); it's possible to have a ranger that wears medium armor and wields a greatsword. (In fact, one of my characters on Folderol is just that.)

As for multiclassing Rangers... a Ranger 35/Fighter 5 is obvious (just make sure to take the fifth fighter level at 27, or any epic level divisible by 3, so you can get Epic Weapon Spec), trading off +1 to damage and taunt against all your favored enemies (plus one or two extra favored enemies) for +6 damage to ALL enemies, plus two extra combat feats and Heavy Armor Proficiency. (Though I do admit that I wouldn't put a Ranger in heavy armor, ever. )

FWIW, there's a FAQ on GameFAQs on various Ranger builds. That's where I got the idea that Rangers don't all have to be dex-based dual-wielders from.

[Jamski]

Hold on... 15 types of favoured enemy?

1. Animals
2. Undead
3. Goblinoids
4. Giants
5. Dragons
6. Planar
7. Beasts
8. Abberations
9. Vermin
10. Humans
11. Elves
12. Dwarves
13. Reptilians
14. Monstrous
15. Constructs

Bloody hell. That's about everything except halflings.

-Jam

[Dis]

Originally posted by Vlad Antlerkov
I haven't decided when we'll start, other than it'll have to be after December 15. Why? That's when finals end here.

So here's the list so far:

Vlad-- Rogue/fighter/WM
Jamski-- Rogue/wizard
Snotty-- Barbarian/fighter
Dissident-- No build posted.

Still needed: Cleric-type build for rezzing; another melee-oriented build (preferably paladin- or ranger-based); and possibly another arcane caster.

It'd be nice if everyone could at least do an outline of their build. Nothing major, just what I did for mine.

Also: You can come in with a level-1 character if you wish, apparently. There's a n00b-level-up-and-merchant at the start. (I took a brief--no more than 10 minutes--look at the module last night.)

If I can play, I could play a bard. (since another expressed interest in a cleric) I love clerics as well. But I have played them extensively.