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**Maquiladora** · May 18, 2007, 19:37

Re: Design: Tile Improvements

Originally posted by E
These may need balancing as well. I for one think early farms should use my Needsirrigation and IsIrrigation flags. That way you have to build near fresh water rivers or other farmland. It would make rivers more strategic.

I wouldn't mind using it either, but the problem is the AI.

If the farms provide irrigation to adjacent tiles, then the AI needs to know how to chain them from city to city. If the AI can't chain farms, then it's obviously bad to use IsIrrigation on farms.

If farms can only be built next to/on rivers (NeedsIrrigation only), then it's easy for the AI to use. But you could have many cities without any farms at all, so you'll either need serious food trade working (we haven't got that), or farms need to be made less crucial like in CtP1 (which also required rivers for farms IIRC) and granary (which is available in any city) much more beneficial. I know the granary in CtP1 was much better for the same reason.

To summarize, if farms are weakened and granary bonus increased, then next to/on rivers is fine with no chaining.

My only worry is cities with rivers will become too good, so much so that rivers shouldn't give any food, just +5 gold, and provide irrigation.

The AI's obsession with mines on flatland will also become useful

Another thing thats up for debate is the 'DeniedToEnemy' flag. Somehate it. But i think civ3/4 went to far in limiting roads and railroads. I think roads shouldbe left alone but railroads should be denied to someone at war because its impractical and too much of an advantage to get a 1/10th move into a territory. a big exploit for humans.

I can't see how it can harm the AI at the moment. If the AI is taught to use balanced armies and it's invading armies are strong and large, then they're slow. The high movement from rails in enemy terrain is only exploited by the human, by pillaging tactics and capturing smaller cities in the weak centre of a civ. Both of which the AI doens't do, and even if it does pillage it would be only on the way to attacking a city.

**Ekmek** · May 18, 2007, 19:45

Thanks Maq.

The irrigation flags allow for chaining. Not sure if the AI will figure that out or not. So far when I've added 'CanBuildwasteland' to roads the AI has built roads through wasteland to connect cities. It may do it for farmland we may have to test.

thats another thing we should look to adding "canbuildwasteland" to roads. but not railroads

DeniedToEnemy is something we can test out as well.

**Maquiladora** · May 18, 2007, 19:57

Originally posted by E
Thanks Maq.

The irrigation flags allow for chaining. Not sure if the AI will figure that out or not. So far when I've added 'CanBuildwasteland' to roads the AI has built roads through wasteland to connect cities. It may do it for farmland we may have to test.

I don't think that would tell the AI to chain to another city to provide irrigation though. Building roads it knows to go from city tile to city tile in the shortest route, but it just puts farms on the inner ring working outwards when it decides the city needs a farm (rarely!).

I imagine it would only be by pure coincidence if it chained one together.

**Maquiladora** · May 18, 2007, 21:34

Just looking at CtP1 and how Adv. Farms come much later (Oil Refining), I think this is part of the reason specialists are so much better in CtP2, because theres such a surplus of food really early in the game. It makes trading posts mostly useless when you have scientists to generate science, and you have so much food that you can still grow quickly and use many specialists.

There's also the point the actual graphic for the farm represents something more modern, but that's not the main point that they're too early.

One choice is Railroad. It has no tile imp, fits pretty well with the timeline and in a historical sense, RR did revolutionise agriculture.

Another is Electricity (Refrigeration), this would IMO mean moving Listening Post (Watch Tower?) to Geometry or somewhere earlier where it's actually some use and worth building.

**Maquiladora** · May 19, 2007, 00:43

E how does NeedsIrrigation work? I put it under farm entry but it still allows me to place farms anywhere. Do i need to put anything anywhere else?

**Ekmek** · May 19, 2007, 14:11

It supposed to work where the tile must be located next to (1 space) a river or another tileimp (1 space) that has IsIrrigation (that way we can limit it to rivers).

Let me see whats wrong, I tested it before and it worked.

EDIT

It has to go under the effect part i.e/

Code:

   TerrainEffect {
      Terrain TERRAIN_DESERT
      Terrain TERRAIN_GRASSLAND
      Terrain TERRAIN_PLAINS

      BonusFood 20
      EnableAdvance ADVANCE_AGRICULTURAL_REVOLUTION
      ProductionCost 500
      ProductionTime 2
      TilesetIndex 8
     [b]NeedsIrrigation[/b]
   }

I might have not removed the older code.

**Ekmek** · May 19, 2007, 14:18

yeah I tested and that is probably your problem. it worked for me.

I also have an urban version where you can only build next to cities or other "IsUrban" tileimps

**Maquiladora** · May 19, 2007, 14:36

I just put exactly the same thing as above and it brought two popups, "Expected Record Name" and "Unknown Token". Using rev732b. Any ideas?

**Ekmek** · May 19, 2007, 14:43

as per the cdb above:
Bit NeedsIrrigation
Bit IsIrrigation
Bit IsUrban
Bit NextToUrban

all go under the effect part. I just did NeedsIrrigation for 732b and it worked. Just try that one first.

**Maquiladora** · May 19, 2007, 15:03

Thanks E got it working now. Seems like I didn't extract 732b into the right install. Confusing when you have 3 or 4 installs

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DESIGN: Tile Improvements

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